Carabiner Recommendations for ATC Guide

Hey all!

I just bought an ATC Guide for top belays (cause I was tired of my Cinch twisting the hell out of the rope) and was wondering if anyone had recommendations for carabiners to use with it.

I took it out for the first time the other day and ran into an issue. I was using a 10 mil rope and the BD positron (just their generic cheap screw-gate) and was experiencing an incredible amount of drag while belaying the second; so mush drag that my shoulder was wasted after belaying up two partners on one pitch of climbing.

The direction of pull seemed to be parallel with the slots in the device so I don't think that is the issue, and a 10.0 rope isn't terribly large so I am thinking the 'biner I was using may be the issue. Perhaps a more rounded parabiner style? Any suggestions would be appreciated!

Petzl Am'D.

Still, fatter ropes are a bit of work in autoblock mode. Getting farther below the device helps.

I've had an ATC guide before and I used a Petzl Attache. Worked pretty well, but I'm a huge fan on the attache so that might be biased (note, not the newer I-beam attache, those are awful IMO)

petzl attache

BD Rocklock? Its a nice smooth HMS biner. The problem is the amount of friction that the newer "i-beam" style biners make, so don't use them for belaying unless you need the extra friction.

Brendan Blanchard wrote:BD Rocklock? Its a nice smooth HMS biner. The problem is the amount of friction that the newer "i-beam" style biners make, so don't use them for belaying unless you need the extra friction.

I use the ATC in belay as well as guide mode. The BD Rocklock is awesome. I do find that some ropes just fly through the ATC while others do add a bunch of drag. I use 10.2 to 10.5 and my ropes slide great. My partner has a 10.5 that's a bit old and it sucks. I refuse to use it and now he brings a newer 10.2 that works great. I read a review either here or at topo and the Petzl Attache and the BD Rocklock were both in the top 2 or 3. I do believe the BD is a bit stronger at 24 KN closed gate, and 8 KN pen gate. And it's cheaper too.

Petzl Attache

Another Attache user here. But I would say that if you get any similarly round HMS locker you will be happy.

the petzl williams is always my go to biner

All the above mentioned biners will work. I usually use the Petzl Attache or William... William is probably the most versatile locker out there.

Just don't get the Attache 3D. Not nearly as good of a belay biner.

I'm an ATC Guide/Attache user. Combo works great.

1. It doesn't matter, any locker. That isn't your problem.
2. 10 mil rope in that device, in auto-lock mode, is too thick. I have a nice supple 9.8 that works really well.
3. I use one of them fancy new BD biners that prevents cross-loading to belay a leader. I use it to belay a follower in auto-lock mode too, but again, it doesn't matter.

I use a RockLock from the master point to the guide hole cause its so dang big and you never have to worry about too much stuff on it, and then my normal belay Attache for the autolock. System works fine for me with 10.2 ropes, but a good rope handling technique helps considerably.

Eric Fjellanger wrote:1. It doesn't matter, any locker. That isn't your problem. 2. 10 mil rope in that device, in auto-lock mode, is too thick. I have a nice supple 9.8 that works really well.

Agreed. I have a 10.2mm rope for general cragging, and it's very hard to feed in the ATC guide. My Reverso 3 is slightly better, and my B-52 is hugely better. I've tried many biners (including the Positron), and the big, round stock like the Rocklock is best - but still not fun.

I've since realized that it's a net gain for me to just haul a Gri-Gri up the climb with me to belay the second. There's so much energy saved at the top that the weight is worth it. It does require extra care in rigging, but if I'm hauling my 10.2 around we are just doing relaxed cragging anyway.

If I'm really climbing something long and hard we will be using thin ropes (8.5 doubles or 9.2 single), either of which is just fine in my Reverso 3 (or ATC Guide).

Since you already have an ATC Guide and 10mm rope, I know that doesn't help a lot. If you don't feel like running out and dropping the coin on a Gri-Gri, a Rocklock or William might help, but the biggest thing is careful rope management. Set yourself up directly over the second, and pull up slack on the second's line before pulling it through the device. Enjoy the hulking triceps you will develop.

Tayte Campbell wrote:the petzl williams is always my go to biner

+1

I use the BD Gridlock

Black Diamond Gridlock

As has been mentioned, position and management are important. Being under the device is key. I use old-style Attaches. The new ones wear out too quickly in a sandy environment. I would say that in your case, using an Attache or Williams is the only thing that will really help. My standard general purpose rope is a 9.4, and after guiding Epinephrine 2:1 and pulling 4K' of rope through the device, I'm not really feeling my hulking triceps so much as my elbow tendonitis that develops from that repetitive motion. For casual use, buy a new biner. For more constant use, get a skinnier rope. For professional level use, or if you have bad elbows, buy a Kong GiGi. It's an older device, and as such cost me $18, but feeds much more smoothly in guide mode.

bobmirko wrote:I use the BD Gridlock Black Diamond Gridlock

I wasn't sure if I'd like the BD Gridlock, but I've been using it a while, and it's pretty nice.

Any rounded carabiner that locks will do you well, the thicker the spine the better.

When I first started using my guide in autolock mode to belay the second it was a real chore as well.

What has helped me reduce the amount of work it is for me is to make sure I set up the anchor and belay so that I'm below the guide and can easily handle both strands from around my waist. Actively feeding slack with the climber strand will help reduce the work effort as well. Play with it a bit more and you should find a sweet spot that'll work for you.

tl,dr- I use the petzl attache or the BD pearabiner screwgate. Whichever is closer on my rack when I'm setting up the belay.
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Work on your belay set up, and you'll find some ways to make it feed more smoothly.

Rounded for sure, no I-beam's, pear'biners of old work great, anything with a big open rounded smooth running surface.

I've tried several different biners and the ATC guide is still difficult to use in guide mode with thicker ropes. If I know I'm going to be using it in guide mode I just bring my thinner (9.4mm) rope and it works great.