hypermobility syndrome

I'll try to keep this short.

I've been climbing a while, 10-12 years, but it wasn't until about 3 years ago I started to really push myself and set goals. About a year into it I tore/strained my middle finger A2 pulley, took 8 months to get healed enough for me to climb normal again. It was hell, the worse thing ever...bla bla bla, same story as everyone else. Since then I have just had problems with my fingers and hands, it seemed like I was in always in some kind of worrisome pain and/or on the verge of injury. Because of this I have be stand-offish of pushing myself. I've been to 3 orthopedic doctors, one a hand specialist, with little to no help about climbing. I don't know if this is normal with people at my level and I should just be cautious and push through, or is it a massive red flag that something is wrong. Yesterday was doctor #4, I'm desperate! He told me the reason I could be getting injured more than others is that I have Hypermobility syndrome. He explained to me that the joints in my fingers have a greater range of motion than normal and because of this the connective tissue in my joints is inherently weaker. What?!!!! I got tunnel vision as he was talking to me, I was on the verge of passing out and I felt the tears welling up in my eyes. I felt like I had so much potential, but now it seemed that wasn't going to happen.

I realize that it's not the end of the world if in fact what the doctor me is true (I hope!). I've sent many great routes up till now and I'll keep sending and having fun. I'm just not so sure about the future of my goals anymore.

Has anyone heard of this? Or been told the same? I just don't know because most of these doctors are really oblivious to climbing.

Thanks, would love to hear your thoughts, or you can just call me a wuss..that would be fine too! (I fail at short)

your probably just pullin too hard man. i had the same problem, i kept getting injured in my tendons until this lady i now climb with reeemed me about my footwork and technique. havent had a problem really since. it could be a crimp issue? try to stick with openhanded crimps or work on them. listen to your body too! try to finesse your way up instead of just pulling and fighting. i have no clue what level your climbing at but according to your ticks its 10's and 11's. my fingers never really pulled or popped until i was working on upper 12's when i shouldnt have been on it in the first place. im sure someone else will give you way better feedback than me, but hope it works out and you dont have to quit.

I have a connective tissue disorder, a form of Ehlers Danlos. It's not the end of the fuckin world, dude, but yes, it does prevent me from training hard, and I'll probably never climb 5.12 or above (chronic injury risk is too great for me). I gave up bouldering completely when I realized that my joints just can't handle it, even in fairly small doses.

Now, you may or may not have a legitimate, diagnosable connective tissue disorder. I am a little skeptical since you say only your hands are a problem. And, I'm sorry, but your A2 injury and rehab time is not that uncommon in the climbing world at all. That said, even people with normal connective tissue can have hypermobile joints in some parts of their bodies. But for the most part, those people don't face the same problems as those with actual diagnosable conditions (that affect the body as a whole).

Savvy orthos and PTs are often the first to finally notice and suggest such connective tissue problems (a PT friend finally figured my own problem out after years of chronic injuries in almost all joints in my body). But if you really want a better opinion, you need to see a rheumatologist. And stop being so dramatic. It's not like you were told you have hep C or ALS.

djkyote wrote:and from this wiki article, it isn't because the joints are weaker, they are more flexible, so your doctor is wrong (shocking)

When the ligaments around a joint are more lax, that creates instability in the joint. Joint instability equates with joint weakness. The doc said the connective tissue is weak. With ligamentous laxity, this is absolutely true.

Thanks for the replies!

dijkyote: I'm maxing out at v7/12c/d in the gym. I see your point but I think Aerili is right:
"When the ligaments around a joint are more lax, that creates instability in the joint. Joint instability equates with joint weakness. The doc said the connective tissue is weak. With ligamentous laxity, this is absolutely true."
If I don't have it (at least in my finger joints) then I must have really fooled the doctors. When the doctor first checked my hand she held it, palm down, and took all my fingers and slowly bent them back towards the back of my hand. Normal for me they made it to a 90 degree angle. With eyes bulging she ranted about how not normal it was. Granted I only have it in my hands...as far as I know. I am warming up and stretching, always! I'm not doing any specific hangboard training, would you recommend one?

Dr. Ellis: Yeah, I could be pulling too hard and could use more technique, guess it can always be better. I try to openhand as much as possible! But you're most certainly right..crimping a ton is not good for it, that was the most obvious.

Aerili: I'm so glad to hear someone who has firsthand knowledge of this. You're right, it's not the end of the world, if in fact this is what it is..But it's not just my A2, that was just the first of many. I hear what you're saying about not having it in other parts of my body. I should be thankful if it is, that it is just that I guess. You rock! That would be really hard for me.

Thank you, everybody so much!
Please let me know if you have anything else to add. I'm currently in PT but I really don't know how much it's gonna help. It may just be that I'm not built for anything over .12, (shrugs) I guess. I guess time will tell. My fingers will either explode or I'll send. Either way I'm not giving up or stopping.

That finger test your doc performed is not conclusive for joint hypermobility syndrome, just an fyi. Here's the beta on how you qualify for this special club. Here's some additional qualifying images (your finger performance included!).

The good news is that hypermobility disorders are not progressive. But my personal experience is that they "feel" progressive as you age. It is easier to get injured and harder to recover.

P. Hmbln wrote:I am warming up and stretching, always! I'm not doing any specific hangboard training, would you recommend one?

1. I would be extremely cautious with hangboard training if all your injuries have been in your fingers and hands.

2. If your joints are too loose, why are you stretching? STOP STRETCHING! A loose joint needs to become tighter, not looser.

Point taken, Aerili. I didnt even think about the stretching, Ill cut it. Also, yea, the hangboard seems not so much a good idea to overdo. Thanks! Youre right, i dont have anywhere near full blown hypermobility, not enough to be a syndrome. Went to PT today and the doc confirmed what you said. Thanks for the links and info. Im glad you said, i dont know why doctors dont feel like they need to fully explain things. That makes sense that it feels like its getting worse as you are getting older...djkyote is rtght I SHOULD be climbing 13, but everytime I start working the high 12s its like im promised injury. I have it in me to climb 13 im positive! But my fingers just seem like they wont let me. It might be better to stick with 10s, and 11s and have a longer climbing career instead of a short intense one.

P. Hmbln wrote:It might be better to stick with 10s, and 11s and have a longer climbing career instead of a short intense one.

This has become my personal viewpoint for my climbing goals. Maybe things could change one day, but when confronted with the recurring levels and types of injury I have faced, you eventually learn to accept what you're dealt and use it for all it's worth.

Aerili wrote: STOP STRETCHING!

+1 Your fingers don't really need it;what they need is a warmup(gently-like wiggling your fingers quickly). If you're doing that "bend your fingers over backward" thing, stop it.

On the encouraging side-I'll just say that I'm one of those dumb old school guys who never gave a thought to training (not true-we used the 3 Bees: Bachar ladders, Beer and Bongs...and trail running)
I've injured all of my fingers at some time or another. I never had it checked out, as I was climber scum, and didn't have any coverage. Long story; bottom line? Don't despair-be proactive. I'm cranking on crimps as thin as I ever have:mostly because of tape, and I've been trying to learn this damned sport since the hippies.

I have hypermobile joints - not all of them, just the major ones - hips, knees, elbows, ankles.

Two things I've learned in 3 different series of PT (hips, ankle, back):

1. Stretching the tissues that are already too loose is not helpful and can even be harmful. However, some of my affected joints have tissues that are too loose AND tissues that are too tight. A good PT helped me to figure out which ones I can and should stretch, as well as how to stretch them.

2. Stabilization exercises are never a bad idea. These exercises have helped to build stability in my affected joints, as well as the other joints both up and downstream of the affected joints.

The PTs that I've seen have been fantastic, and my time spent with them has been invaluable in helping me to understand how my particular body is engineered and how to get the most out of it while also protecting it.

Find a good PT, preferably one that climbs, and really pick their brain. You may not walk out of there "cured", but you'll know how to make yourself stronger, and more importantly how to keep from crippling yourself.

Again...good to know!. Thank you, for helping me because I would stretch that s*it out! Seriously, all the time and as far back as I could get those fingers.

Joe Huggins wrote: true-we used the 3 Bees: Bachar ladders, Beer and Bongs...and trail running) I've injured all of my fingers at some time or another. I never had it checked out, as I was climber scum, and didn't have any coverage. Long story; bottom line? Don't despair-be proactive. I'm cranking on crimps as thin as I ever have:mostly because of tape, and I've been trying to learn this damned sport since the hippies.

Haha...thanks for the support.

Brigette wrote:I have hypermobile joints - not all of them, just the major ones - hips, knees, elbows, ankles.

That's a bummer! I only have it in my fingers and ankles a bit. I'm glad you get so much from your PT. Stay strong!