Dear Mr. Greyrock Retrobolter

Dear Mr. Greyrock Retrobolter,

This has nothing to do with the bolts you've added to existing routes without the permission from the FA team, this has nothing to do with your poor climbing ethics... I'm writing this in regards to your "practice bolts" that you've left at the base of the NW Slabs. What the fuck? Greyrock is a very beautiful and special place, the remote NW Slabs even more so. You've already doubled the bolt count on existing routes - turning once spicy (awesome) moderate climbs into tame ones. Does 30 feet of 5.6 warrent six bolts? You've also created an eyesore that takes away from the natural beauty of the place - the reason I and the majority of others visit this place. When I stumbled across one of your hangerless "practice bolts" along the base of the slabs, I couldn't believe it. Please refrain from placing any more belly-button or nipple level bolts along the base of those beautiful slabs.

Oh No. I love that place, and the climbs. This seems to be the norm everywhere these days-pretty sad... The, "me" trend continues.

What kind of dumbass needs a practice bolt? And if you need to, to do so on your back patio.

Your photo is spot on - WTF is that bullshit??? Hopefully they get a clue and stop the nonsense.

Is that a huge flapper on your "salute" finger? Classic.

Yep, that's a huge flapper from Vedauwoo. No wonder I'm so pissed off!

- Keep in mind that this is not a roadside crag. The NW slabs are a good 60-90 minute steep hike from the road and the large majority of visitors are hikers, birdwatchers, etc... The hike is worthy in it's self, as this is one of the most beautiful areas around Fort Collins. Obnoxious, shiny hunks of metal along the base of the outcropping are unacceptable - also, I have yet to see one camouflaged bolt amongst the dozens of new bolts up there. If these mad bolters are out there and reading this - please paint any further hardwear a neutral grey.

bummer, I've only climbed one route at greyrock... and it certainly wasn't overbolted, also fun and beautiful!!!

The area is great, and the last thing it needs is for hikers to see nasty bolts up there. Who the hell puts practice bolts in a real rock anyway. go find some shitty boulder on the side of a road.

Terrible to see this kind of crap. If I knew how to do it properly I would go chop those myself.

Kevin - is that a Grand Traverse shirt you're wearing?

Kevin Landolt wrote:No wonder I'm so pissed off!

Calmer than you are.

I think that bolt really ties the rock together, dude.

No trial, straight to execution. Fucking bros.

AJS wrote: Calmer than you are. I think that bolt really ties the rock together, dude.

...I'm staying. Finishing my coffee..

kennyt wrote:What kind of dumbass needs a practice bolt? And if you need to, to do so on your back patio.

+1 If you have to practice then you have no business bolting; even if you properly placed all of them you couldn't figure the sequence, clipping stance, rope drag...

Ty Harlacker wrote: +1 If you have to practice then you have no business bolting; even if you properly placed all of them you couldn't figure the sequence, clipping stance, rope drag...

that's a rather dumb statement. you gotta learn at some point. even the most prolific route developers had to 'practice'.

Dear Mr. Greyrock Retrobolter,

Who are you? This has been a continuing problem at Greyrock that definitely needs to stop. Whats amazing to me is how unknown this bolt-happy person is? I have been working on the Poudre Canyon Guidebook for over 2 years now. I have met plenty of local climbers I never knew before while researching history and ascents, and still nobody knows who's doing this?

Not to make a public hanging for this person, but someone needs to have a rational conversation with them. If anyone does know how to contact this person please send me an email. I would like to talk with them before the guidebook is finalized.

thanks
Ben Scott
NCCC (Northern Colorado Climbers Coalition)
www.nococlimbing.org

That bolt three feet off the ground is really goofy. The theory that it is to anchor a light belayer is the most plausible I think, though I can't imagine what advantage you would be getting from that. Also, you see a lot of new climbers tie in to a bolt like that from the attachment at the back of the harness you use for your chalk bag. This will completely flip a belayer upside down if they catch a good fall. I've seen it.

Blake, Yes everyone has to learn but you don't practice at the base of the route. good thing it didn't take multiple trys to figure it out

obviously. i was merely speaking to the blanket statement that if you have to practice placing bolts then you have no business bolting...which is a dumb statement.

practicing on a cliff, at the base, is also dumb. i have no problems practicing on talus (small talus)...or, just placing bolts under guidance for the first few times.

OK, so some douchebag tard is retrobolting a bunch of routes at this area. He probably feels he's restoring or upgrading some old forgotten area to better suit the his needs and that of the "community".

I see this sort of thing all the time, nothing new ya know.

What I don't understand is why everyone is so willing to bitch publicly about "retro-bolting" and yet, no one is willing to do anything about it.

"Someone should talk to/kick is ass", "Someone should chop those bolts", "Someone should do something about this"...

...well guess what??? That "Someone" is "YOU"!

Get up there, find him/her, stop them. Sure, try to find them first to see whats up. Some dialogue goes a long way, but if they want to remain anonymous and bolt in the shadows, then you are in no way obligated to speak with them first.

Retrobolting can not even begin to be tolerated, period. It's a downward spiral that quickly gains acceptance and accelerates.

Now get up there and chop that crap. Don't be a puss and wait for someone else to do it. Have some initiative for Christ sake or STFU!

Salamanizer wrote:What I don't understand is why everyone is so willing to bitch publicly about "retro-bolting" and yet, no one is willing to do anything about it. Have some initiative for Christ sake or STFU!

Looks to me like the very first response was someone willing to do something about it. As far as the OP, most people (that I know anyway) don't regularly take out tools to remove bolts when they're out climbing. The guy went out climbing, saw the bolts, and now is reporting on it. Who's to say that he wasn't planning on heading back out the next time he goes climbing and chop it? Personally I'd prefer someone wait and return with the proper tools to remove and patch the hole, then do a half-assed job with what he had.

Obviously most of this stuff gets posted on the internet because we're all bored at work behind a computer. Much like your useless response, it was something to say. And much like your useless response maybe doing some good by encouraging someone to take action who might have otherwise sat on their ass, these threads may do some good by raising the issue that this is not ok to some passerby who might have otherwise gone and done the same thing. If it is commonplace, as you assert, then obviously the message needs to get out there more.

Most importantly, the picture made me laugh.

anyone ever thought about adding more bolts to a given retro-line, say make the spacing 2'-3' or so & really screw up their masterplan?

just thinking outside the box here

Mark Nelson wrote:anyone ever thought about adding more bolts to a given retro-line, say make the spacing 2'-3' or so & really screw up their masterplan? just thinking outside the box here

retro the retro'd route. brilliant!

i like where you are going with that...

WiledHorse wrote: retro the retro'd route. brilliant! i like where you are going with that...

Or place bolts next to their bolts. Climber could skip the retro bolters bolt altogether. You could also use them as anchors and now pitch it out every 20 feet or so and claim an FA on each pitch.