Climbing...Just how dangerous is it?

Minor detail, but the "richy rich doctors" support government-run health care:
Poll Finds Most Doctors Support Public Option
From NPR, Sept. 14, 2009.

So as to not be a totally off-topic post: I followed up on Brian Adzima's post. Daniel A. Crowl lists the fatality risk of rock climbing to be 4000 fatalities per 10^8 hours. For a better perspective, this is about 1 fatality per 50,000 days climbing.

By comparison, Professor Crowl ranks traveling by car at 57 fatalities per 10^8 hours. About 1 fatality per 1,000,000 days driving. This equates to around 300 automobile fatalities daily in the U.S. (order of magnitude).

I wish he had listed references on these numbers.

Here
is another page which shows that (10 years ago) the fatality rate of climbing was on par with kayaking and scuba diving, twice as high as bicycling, four times as high as hunting, and eight times as high as skiing/boarding. The linked page lists references for these numbers.

Their data is copied below:

Activity Fatality Rate(1)
Scuba 3.5
Climbing (rock, ice, snow) 3.2
Whitewater Kayaking 2.9
Recreational Swimming 2.6
Bicycling 1.6
Whitewater Boating 0.86 (corrected for season length)
Hunting 0.7
Skiing/Snowboarding 0.4

(1) Fatality Rate is fatalities per 100,000 participants per year.

The fatality rate given above is based on a phone conversation, not a citable study (see the footnotes).

Don't confuse health insurance and life insurance.

You need to find a better life insurance company. Mine (State Farm), asked about climbing and gave me the standard rate.

I have a large Life insurance policy through Farmers.
I disclosed my climbing, etc...

Recently tried to get a policy on my son.
They wouldn't even write a policy because he told them he climbed 5.10 sometimes. He's on the rock maybe 3 or 4 times a year. Mostly in the gym.

A very strange, self centered and FUBAR industry is the insurance one.

Some persistence will probably help. My wife and I both managed to find life insurance policies at a decent cost, even after we disclosed that we climb. The determining factor in the cost of mine seems to have been a history (one event) of cancer in my family. This took a lot of shopping around. Like you, we found that some agents/underwriter/companies wanted premiums that were multiples of what it would have cost if we did not climb. Eventually we found an agent/underwriter/company that offered us a reasonable deal. We filled out a questionnaire that asked us about our climbing activities so they definitely knew about this. The quotes and processes were all over the map and the cost of a policy seemed to depend on the agent and underwriter more than the insurance company - we got two quotes via different agents from the same company that differed in cost by a factor of two or three. This seemed to indicate that at least this company did not have reliable data on the risks of climbing - unlike, say the risks of smoking or a history of cancer in the family.

So it's feasible but you may have to contact many agents before landing a decent deal.

Alex Burton wrote:OK...so I just went through the hassle of trying to get a life insurance policy as a climber. Obviously insurance companies seem to think that climbers are much more likely to die climbing than in another manner. So much so, the qoutes I got back were trippled just because of my climbing. So here is the question: Are there actual statistics out there on the percentage of people who climb and die while climbing? I'd be interested to see how much more likely I am to die climbing than driving, drowning, or choking on a hotdog.

Climbing is listed as a $2.50 different by most insurance companies. It's just a ratio, so if someone "normal" pays $100.00 in monthly premiums, a rock climber would be expected to pay $250.00. Snow/Ice (Mountaineers) are worse, $5.00.

However if it's not asked on the policy by the company, and you have a "mishap", they will probably pay out.

If you leave it off the policy application (and the application asked for it) and have a "mishap", hope it's after two years of you taking the policy out, or else they will probably rescind and your premiums will be refunded to your beneficiaries. Two years into the policy, they probably will pay out. This has been described pretty much as industry standard to me.

Please note, this isn't "professional" advice. I just happen to work with underwriters and I am taking LOMA Courses, which are certifications for the Life Insurance industry.

Check out the application... If it's not on there, they didn't ask, so it wasn't important. Regular Issue policies are usually easier to get and ask a lot less questions.

Another thing to keep in mind, talk freely to the agent, especially if they are an independent agent. Independent Agent don't work for any insurance company.

Bobby Hanson wrote:Their data is copied below: Activity Fatality Rate(1) Scuba 3.5 Climbing (rock, ice, snow) 3.2 Whitewater Kayaking 2.9 Recreational Swimming 2.6 Bicycling 1.6 Whitewater Boating 0.86 (corrected for season length) Hunting 0.7 Skiing/Snowboarding 0.4 (1) Fatality Rate is fatalities per 100,000 participants per year.

Dang, the only one of those I don't do is Skiing/Snowboarding...I'm in trouble. lol Hard to believe that SCUBA diving has that high of a death rate. I read an article recently that said climbing/working on communications towers has the highest death rate of any job in the USA, I guess it's a good thing I'm stationed overseas now, cause that's my job too.

I'm also in the military, and though they said the family doesn't get paid on suicide, it's not true. We had a Captain take his life with a handgun, family got paid.

Tim C wrote:That's a good point, I got my Heath insurance though work also. They didn't ask me any questions, I don't think. So would they deny coverage if I get hurt climbing because I didn't call them up and specifically tell them?

If you received insurance through work you are covered for just about everything. Businesses pay an exorbitant amount of money to get full coverage for all of their employees and families and it would be descrimination to not cover an individual based on their lifestyle. Hmmm why doesn't that apply to the insurance companies as well?