Free Soloing

why does ken get into intardnet fights on almost every thread he posts on?

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=N70DLM8Az_8&feature=related

AMAZING!!!

Why did she do it?
Jake

Ken Cangi wrote: It's true that most of the low-angle Flatiron slabs offer numerous paths of little resistance. My comment included a broader scope of the issue that you raised. Moreover, it is possible that the soloist wasn't using his best judgment. I don't know because I wasn't there. The problem here, however, isn't with the soloist; it is with your bad attitude and smart ass comments about the situation and anyone, myself included, who doesn't sympathize with you. I don't know who pissed in your Wheaties, but get over it. Your sarcasm doesn't inspire serious discussion. It just makes you look like an asshole.

Don't know how this thread blew up all the sudden, but well said Ken.

John Langston wrote:Who cares?

A lot of people do. It can be a very contentious topic; people can feel very passionately about it--on all angles of the subject.

--Marc

Ken Cangi wrote: I just read his BRC bio, and I am surprised at his attitude about this soloist. As I said earlier, it's not so much about the soloist as it is about Joe's approach. His snide remarks, defensiveness, and Cool Guy comments don't represent him well as a professional guide. I met another AMGA guide from BRC, who seemed to believe that only AMGA guides were worthy of guiding in Europe. He was pretty cocky about it, which didn't impress me much - especially considering who the guide in question was, and his immense experience compared to this relatively new AMGA guide.

My covers been blown!

Hey Ken, I read through my first post again, I am sorry you took offense to the way I used Cool Guy instead of soloist. If I could of substituted those words would the thread of suited you more? I did not mean to fire you or anyone else up. After rereading the post, I fail to see the attitude and still stand by my words. It could just be my personality.

My approach at the time with the soloist was very professional and I tactfully made my comments to him when he reached my belay away from my guests. I pride myself on professionalism and feel that I have some how offended you. I only wish you could see me work and how I carry out my profession when in my element before you judge. I may be witty, semi sarcastic and animated at times, but Professionalism always comes first and I do pride myself on client care and quality of experience.

As for AMGA guides that rubbed you wrong, Sorry for that, I think there are incredible guides all over the world who do not carry certification and I have nothing against them. In every bunch you will get all types, so don't judge the AMGA based on a bad seed if that is the case. Don't know your scenario with the BRC incident, but I don't need to know about here in this forum either.

As for Europe and guides, There Government regulates who can guide there. By law only IFMGA/UIAGM guides can work in Europe and it is an incredible opportunity and more importantly a Privilege. The AMGA allows folks like myself to pursue the full track certification in all disciplines and legally work in Europe where the guides, recreational users, general public and fellow climbers get along without incident and have incredible relationships. It is quite incredible to see. Something that is lost in the American climbing community do to permits, land managers, competing concessions and folks who just think there better than everyone else.

Sorry to everyone else who wants this thread to go were it started. I did not direct it this way and feel I have ruined the discussion. Now you all know who I am and I still stand by my comments.

If need be I will start a new thread and you can all slander me there.

PS Will solo for chicks, money, beer, photographers, and bragging rights, but if you want me to do it with my shirt off thats extra.

PSS: I don't know what part of my initial post implies I was crying. Please stop bullying me, That is a cry.

mobley wrote:why does ken get into intardnet fights on almost every thread he posts on?

For every one of you who thinks I'm fighting, there are a half dozen who find my input to be insightful. I am not politically correct. I am honest, and I try to address these discussions objectively, instead of being driven by emotions.

I am not easily bullied, and I refuse to blow smoke up people's asses for the purpose of PC. I am not always right, and what I say is ultimately just my opinion, although I try to base my comments on personal experience.

Let me ask you this, Mobley: What is your professional background, and how would you have handled the situation in question? Try adding something constructive to the discussion.

JPVallone wrote: My covers been blown! Hey Ken, I read through my first post again, I am sorry you took offense to the way I used Cool Guy instead of soloist. If I could of substituted those words would the thread of suited you more? I did not mean to fire you or anyone else up. After rereading the post, I fail to see the attitude and still stand by my words. It could just be my personality. My approach at the time with the soloist was very professional and I tactfully made my comments to him when he reached my belay away from my guests. I pride myself on professionalism and feel that I have some how offended you. I only wish you could see me work and how I carry out my profession when in my element before you judge. I may be witty, semi sarcastic and animated at times, but Professionalism always comes first and I do pride myself on client care and quality of experience. As for AMGA guides that rubbed you wrong, Sorry for that, I think there are incredible guides all over the world who do not carry certification and I have nothing against them. In every bunch you will get all types, so don't judge the AMGA based on a bad seed if that is the case. Don't know your scenario with the BRC incident, but I don't need to know about here in this forum either. As for Europe and guides, There Government regulates who can guide there. By law only IFMGA/UIAGM guides can work in Europe and it is an incredible opportunity and more importantly a Privilege. The AMGA allows folks like myself to pursue the full track certification in all disciplines and legally work in Europe where the guides, recreational users, general public and fellow climbers get along without incident and have incredible relationships. It is quite incredible to see. Something that is lost in the American climbing community do to permits, land managers, competing concessions and folks who just think there better than everyone else. Sorry to everyone else who wants this thread to go were it started. I did not direct it this way and feel I have ruined the discussion. Now you all know who I am and I still stand by my comments. If need be I will start a new thread and you can all slander me there. PS Will solo for chicks, money, beer, photographers, and bragging rights, but if you want me to do it with my shirt off thats extra. PS

I appreciate your making the effort to clarify your comments, Joe. Also, I hold the AMGA in high regard. Alan Jolley trained me, and I have nothing but respect for him and the organization. Maybe that is why the snide approach rubbed me the wrong way. At any rate, just look at my comments as an effort to keep us all in check.

And about the BRC incident, it happened years ago, and the person and I have been in the Boulder climbing community for years. It's no big deal. My relationship with BRC goes all the way back to when they first opened for business. I have worn many BRC hats - guide/instructor, sales manager, route setter, and all around colorful character - as most who know me will attest.

P.S. I'm calling you on the crying. You were definitely whining like a Chihuahua in your opening post. My grandmother would have slapped you silly for that outburst. lol

Cheers

Good Lord!
Solo don't solo, I could care less!
I solo at least twice a week, the same few routes that lam familiar with, sometimes their is a crowd , sometimes not, but bottom line this is a freedom of climbing expression, I have had looks, comments etc.. but all in all its about me and my experience, don't worry about dropped cams, newbie climbers etc.. the soloist should understand what is at risk. In the words of Peter Croft, "do it for yourself and no other".
Be careful, have fun , and stop worrying about the other guy!

Well said, Dave.

--Marc

Dave Miller wrote:Good Lord! Solo don't solo, I could care less! I solo at least twice a week, the same few routes that lam familiar with, sometimes their is a crowd , sometimes not, but bottom line this is a freedom of climbing expression, I have had looks, comments etc.. but all in all its about me and my experience, don't worry about dropped cams, newbie climbers etc.. the soloist should understand what is at risk. In the words of Peter Croft, "do it for yourself and no other". Be careful, have fun , and stop worrying about the other guy!

It is about freedom of expression, but Peter was talking about perception, not actually putting someone else at risk that wasn't willingly or knowingly accepting it.

Hank Caylor wrote: Don't know how this thread blew up all the sudden, but well said Ken.

Thanks, Hank.

It's all my fault. I can't help myself. lol

God I did not want to get in this...
Please tell me , other then falling (me) how am I putting others in risk!?!?

now that a flame war has broken out i am obligated to post these images:

Jon Ruland wrote:now that a flame war has broken out i am obligated to post these images:

That is soooooooo wrong, it's almost right.......but still wrong.

Jake O wrote:http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=N70DLM8Az_8&feature=related AMAZING!!! Why did she do it? Jake

I always thought she was HOT! Man, I can't wait for those shorts to come back into style. This one is even better.

Ken Cangi wrote:Man, I can't wait for those shorts to come back into style.

You really miss wearing those, huh, Ken? :)

--Marc

Marc Horan wrote: You really miss wearing those, huh, Ken? :) --Marc

Almost as much as I miss seeing her in them.

Ken, brother, I'm afraid you may recognize aggression more readily in others than in yourself. The questions were pointed at the least, enough so that I waited to see how JPVallone would answer; strongly as it turned out. It's not a question of political correctness, it's a question of conversational tone rather than combat or cross-examination tone.
EDIT: Special thanks to you and JakeO for the Catherine D links!!

Dave, I don't think (without rereading the thread) anyone is calling on others not to solo, only to be considerate of the complications they may create. Joe illustrated a few in his posts and Mark and I alluded to some as well. Some posters expressed why they choose not to solo, but usually with express support for a different choice by others.

Jon--Heh heh, you're back in form!

Shawn Mitchell wrote:Ken, brother, I'm afraid you may recognize aggression more readily in others than in yourself. The questions were pointed at the least, enough so that I waited to see how JPVallone would answer; strongly as it turned out. It's not a question of political correctness, it's a question of conversational tone rather than combat or cross-examination tone. Dave, I don't think (without rereading the thread) anyone is calling on others not to solo, only to be considerate of the complications they may create. Joe illustrated a few in his posts and Mark and I have alluded to some as well. Jon--Heh heh, you're back in form!

Shawn,

I'm well aware of how I am perceived by some online, and I am also very aware of how I am perceived by people with whom I interact in person. It is about political correctness when people are offended by straight talk, and I know that I am not alone in that opinion.

As some have mentioned in the past, it is difficult, at best, to translate inflection with words alone unless you are Hunter Thompson, so I have come to accept that there will always be misunderstandings in online forums. It's just the nature of the beast.

I do, however, appreciate your thoughts and observations, although you need to know that I am very comfortable in my own skin. I initially take what I read in here at face value, and then I wait for people to elaborate. But most importantly, I take none of it personally, and I try not to judge "the person" until I have interacted with her or him in person.