How do you avoid backstepping in this situation?

Redacted Redactberg wrote:

Don’t go on urban dictionary or ever use the internet, or interact with anyone below the age if 50. You’re gonna get really pissed all the time. You will see people using words in ways you’ve never seen before.

If it's on the Internet, it must be true. Don't doubt the Internet. :)

Colonel Mustard wrote:

“Watch the rope” is exactly the same amount of syllables and does not conflate an already accepted term.

Before this thread, somebody would literally have had to explain to me with a small paragraph what they meant by “backstepping” in the sense you mean. So, no, “we” did not all get what he was saying.

Why should “backstopping” refer instead to “outside edge?” Same number of syllables, and outside edge is a much better description of the technique, which as far as I can tell has nothing to do with stepping back. 

Colonel Mustard wrote:

“Watch the rope” is exactly the same amount of syllables and does not conflate an already accepted term.

Before this thread, somebody would literally have had to explain to me with a small paragraph what they meant by “backstepping” in the sense you mean. So, no, “we” did not all get what he was saying.

Sure, if all “you” get that you’re talking about a safety issue versus a technique issue, then within that context it’s fine. If you’re shouting ambiguous gibberish at old crusty psychos like me while I climb, maybe it’s not so helpful. Then again, if you’re always backstepping the rope, maybe you need all the shorthand you can get. I bet it could be shortened further for those who truly can’t manage to remember the concept.

“Backstepped” is two syllables. “Watch the rope” is ambiguous as it could be that the rope is snagged around a feature on the rock and you want your climber to flick it. I’d rather communicate the specific dangerous situation faster than appease some old crusties on some beloved climbing technique. Personally, i call that technique “turning your hip in” and i have absolutely no qualms about it taking more syllables ;)

David: How much do you want to give up Mountain Project for a year?  

Also it’s clearly called rope heeling.

David Weisberg wrote: Quite a lot after seeing the shitshow this thread became.

No, you misunderstood. WE all want you to quit, a lot. How much MONEY do you need to give it up for a year?

slim wrote:

Sometimes it is helpful to realize this is going to be a problem from below (if possible). For this situation something that could help is tying into both ends of the rope and using them like doubles. Left strand basically gets you up to the bolt, and keep going with the right strand. If it straightens out after thjs and you can ge to a stance you can untie and drop the left rope if need be (ie if pitch is longer than half a rope length).

I dont really think a more slack belay would help. would just the traversing strand under him a bigger floppier loop.

This is actually a great answer. Thank you! I guess it makes sense why the europeans use those double ropes a bit more for a situation like this.

Also…..Congratulations! You are the only one in this thread who actually took a close look at the situation, and didn’t give me unhelpful cookie cutter advice like “foot other side of the rope” or “foot outside the rope”, or turned the thread into a shitshow around whether I’m using the right word or not.

Redacted Redactberg wrote:

This is actually a great answer. Thank you! I guess it makes sense why the europeans use those double ropes a bit more for a situation like this.

Also…..Congratulations! You are the only one in this thread who actually took a close look at the situation, and didn’t give me unhelpful cookie cutter advice like “foot other side of the rope” or “foot outside the rope”, or turned the thread into a shitshow around whether I’m using the right word or not.

Yo David, It's called 'rope behind the leg'
Just cause you're wrong, you don't need to double down bruh.
I started climbing in 2016 : )

The climber’s mistake is that he was frontstepping, which happens when you step in front of the rope. Pretty common mistake. The obvious solution is don’t frontstep. The climber should have backstepped, keeping his legs back behind the rope. Easy solution!

Hson P wrote:

Why should “backstopping” refer instead to “outside edge?” Same number of syllables, and outside edge is a much better description of the technique, which as far as I can tell has nothing to do with stepping back. 

Backstopping is presumably a baseball term. Don’t know.

Backstepping is short for back of the inside edge stepping. I just made that up, but it makes a lot of sense, is concise, and, funnily enough, widely understood.

In case it doesn’t come across, I’m not mad, I fully appreciate you all going for the curmudgeon crown. Gas lighting entire understood usages to mean whatever you mistakenly thought they meant when you first heard them is completely the spirit of our times. 

I suppose what puzzles me more than the apocryphal jargon is that the topic itself denotes a subset of climbers who need such shorthand. It really should be an ingrained habit to know exactly where the rope is in relation to your legs. If the rope is behind my leg, I’m 100% aware of it and am working on the situation.

First it looks like a bad bolting job and second, leader failed to protect the route properly.

The fist pro [ cam? on far left ] should have been removed once they clipped the bolt beside it. Once the upper bolt was clipped, the first bolt should have been back cleaned or radically extended. 

"Backstep" is a type of movement. "Watch your leg" is the correct term to use for stepping over the rope. As is "watch the rope" for problems with the rope.

What’s back clipping?

Redacted Redactberg wrote:

This is actually a great answer. Thank you! I guess it makes sense why the europeans use those double ropes a bit more for a situation like this.

That’s not why they use double ropes.

Also…..Congratulations! You are the only one in this thread who actually took a close look at the situation, and didn’t give me unhelpful cookie cutter advice like “foot other side of the rope” or “foot outside the rope”, or turned the thread into a shitshow around whether I’m using the right word or not.

We’re doing you a favor, using the term “back stepping” to describe this makes you sound like a gumby.

The route is Gorilla My Dreams at Index, which I've done many times. The rope in the pic is a bit of an optical illusion in that it is not sticking out far enough from the wall to likely catch your leg in a fall. Keep your feet on the flake you are lay backing there and you'll be fine. The bigger concern is the next bolt is a ways up and if you fell just before clipping it, you could hit the ledge below.  

Edited to add some fresh pics of the route I took last weekend that illustrate how far the flake sticks out vis-a-vis where the rope lies.

 

Tradiban wrote:

That’s not why they use double ropes.

We’re doing you a favor, using the term “back stepping” to describe this makes you sound like a gumby.

It's been explained correctly so many times now and the upvote score of this strange game/thread is about 190 upvotes to 7, I vote that the hearing is adjourned. 

I feel bad about some of my earlier comments. I totally need to backstep and think about my priorities.
Sorry y’all.

Is it like dabbing? We could call that rope behind the leg thingie duh-step.

I think I saw this once in a Monty Python movie. At what point did the OP clippity-clop their coconuts on out of here?

You can avoid the rope running behind your leg with good footwork and awareness.  You can avoid the rope inverting you if you're evaluating your position relative to the rope when you make moves.  Don't overthink it.  It's not that difficult to avoid.

Urban Dictionary might help here for the old and crusty types such as myself. Definitely relevant definition.
https://www.urbandictionary.com/define.php?term=Take%20a%20Step%20Back

 Our AI overlord has spoken. But seriously this thread is some next level gumby shit. If you are confusing "watch you leg"  with "back stepping" than please stick to TR and Autobelays in the gym. And if you're already climbing outdoors, please ask your gym about their "CRAG TO GYM" program!