Spotting at the Gym

Ana Tine wrote: Thread revival! I agree with these comments. Last Friday I completely dislocated my elbow falling from the top of a problem at the gym. 1) A spotter would not have prevented the arm injury. No way they could keep me aligned as I was falling. And my head was fine. 2) A substrate to sink into may have helped, like the Ball-pit at McDonald's play area. I loved those.

Sorry to hear about your elbow, Ana. I hope it heals soon.

Similarly, I just sprained my ACL in my knee from a gym fall.
It also seems highly unlikely a spotter could have done anything about that, as it wasn't about my orientation, it was about striking the mat with one straight leg instead of two bent legs, and it was from only 3 feet up. Who in the world could be so quick as to bend my knee for me, in an unexpected pop, in a fraction of a second, as I'm falling?

Instead, I conclude that most of us need to practice our landings.

At least in my gym, where the bouldering area is 15' high, and has practically seamless 2' padding underneath, almost all of the spotting I see is on slab problems and falls into two categories..

One is an overbearing parent who doesn't allow his kid to try anything interesting under his own power, typically gives horrible beta, and blocks all surrounding problems by constantly standing there holding the kid's ass in the air.

The other is what the OP described pretty much perfectly. Mr. Hero standing there thinking he's the man and potentially copping a feel every awkward fall or two, also blocking all of the surrounding problems.

The only case when I've seen spotting and thought it's sensible is when a problem requires high heel hooks and such where the head is below the center of mass (like on a roof). I'm an engineer who designs airbags, and while forces on the legs, pelvis, and internal organs factor into how we calculate total % risk of serious injury, they're totally trumped by forces and moments to the neck, so I feel like all attention should be focused there. Whiplash from getting smacked in the back is way preferable to the momentum of your body crushing your upper spine into the ground.

On the less steep stuff, a rolled ankle or twisted knee would mean to me that I screwed up my landing, period, since the best way to avoid those injuries is to roll onto your butt/back ASAP on contact with the ground like parachutists do. I'd think a spotter keeping me vertical is only going to force me to absorb rather than redirect my momentum.

Jon Nelson wrote: ... Instead, I conclude that most of us need to practice our landings.

Climbing friend,

Yes!! You musrt for always have the slight bent knees and arms, ready to soften your fallings, and you must be able to roll like a judo master!

Where were you Aleks when i could have used a nice meathead to break my fall

Take up skateboarding. You'll either learn how to fall and likely end up with interesting popping noises when you move your ankles :)

Ana Tine wrote:Where were you Aleks when i could have used a nice meathead to break my fall

Climbing friend,

I would have grasped you shirltess, with meaty, veiny arms, gently cushioning your landing softly falling, like beautiful snowflake upon misty meadow, yes myah.

Ok, so I have a bit of an issue with this "spotter can't do this, spotter wouldn't have been able to do that." I remember taking repeated falls on the finish dyno of 45 degree roof in Hueco in the very early 90s, & I remember the falls, with two spotters & no pads being pretty cushy. Without spotters I think we would have been pretty beat up. If a spotter can slow you down for a controlled landing from that height, I think that they can do it from most indoor problems.

Spotting regardless of where you are climbing, gym or outside, can and does prevent injury. The big gym floors give a huge false sense of security, it breeds bad habits. People climb either well past their limit or are careless and that leads to injuries. Having a spotter will almost never negatively impact a falling climber, the outcome more times than not is positive.

People who don't learn to spot in the gym don't feel the need to spot outside and that is leading to more injuries happening out at the crags.

I feel gyms are doing a disservice to them selves and the climbing community by not teaching people to properly spot when entering for the first time.

Nick seems to have acknowledged in about the 7th post that there are lots of good reasons to spot in the gym which he hadn't initially thought of, which was big of him.
We all seem to agree that spotting in the gym is a good idea, what have we been talking about for the last 2.5 pages of posts?

4th picture, top row.

mountainstrongdenver.com/ou…

Good situation for a spot?

I would like this guy to be my spotter when I'm out bouldering.

(A more detailed write-up from Climbing Mag )

This whole thread explains why "bouldering" is completely retarded. Moral of the story, get your sorry A$$ on a rope, climb something worthy

Aleks Zebastian wrote: Climbing friend, I would have grasped you shirltess, with meaty, veiny arms, gently cushioning your landing softly falling, like beautiful snowflake upon misty meadow, yes myah.

This one is gold! You're back in prime form, Aleks.

Nick Drake wrote:Take up skateboarding. You'll either learn how to fall and likely end up with interesting popping noises when you move your ankles :)

Or both.

the schmuck wrote:Ok, so I have a bit of an issue with this "spotter can't do this, spotter wouldn't have been able to do that." I remember taking repeated falls on the finish dyno of 45 degree roof in Hueco in the very early 90s, & I remember the falls, with two spotters & no pads being pretty cushy. Without spotters I think we would have been pretty beat up. If a spotter can slow you down for a controlled landing from that height, I think that they can do it from most indoor problems.

schmuck.... the art of spotting is dead. It died with padded gym floors.

Way back when I did White Rastafarian, I went for it because I had John Long (maybe Aleks long lost father) shouting... "come on Keesee, we have like a whole mosh pit of big good spotters down here... do it"

Spotting is dangerous...for the spotter.

The other nite at Stoney, Young Joe flew off of Masters.... his elbow collided with Dave's face... blood everywhere, but no broken or sprained ankles.

See the photo... thats after we got to work on the bleeding, you can still see some on his neck, lots of blood....

Just don't be the person that decides to spot somebody without being asked and while they are unaware you are now in the path of their fall.

MojoMonkey wrote:Just don't be the person that decides to spot somebody without being asked and while they are unaware you are now in the path of their fall.

True .... I know this is about GYM spotting... but at Stoney and the other places I boulder at, it is customary for the climber to ask for a spot and the spotter needs to let the climber know.... "I got you spotted... " or somesuch communication.

My worst injury bouldering was while I was doing some short little problem on Stoneface Rock (Berkeley, CA).

My butt was about two feet off of the ground as I pulled into the first move from the ground. One of the holds I was on broke, sending me spinning backwards. Fortunately, my spotter (yes, my friend was spotting me on a lowball) was able to keep my head off the ground. I landed half on my pad. So far so good. No brain injuries!

But I landed on my left hand with my thumb underneath. I sprained three tendons leading into my left thumb, which put me out of commission for climbing for months. And that's the story of how I got into road bicycling and purchased my first road bike. It's a slippery slope...

But yeah, spotting is great. I very rarely ask for a spot in the gym. But I will spot if I see someone getting into an awkward move (asking first, of course).

An article yesterday in Climbing Business Journal
( climbingbusinessjournal.com…)
has a relevant quote to this discussion:

"This points to an urgent need for climbing and bouldering-only gyms to do more to educate new climbers on the risks of bouldering, increasing knowledge on proper falling techniques .... Other suggestions for reducing injury rates on the bouldering wall included discouraging spotting (which has been shown to be ineffective and potentially dangerous in facilities with continuous, seamless padded floors),..."

They cite a previous article:
climbingbusinessjournal.com…

The main point being that spotting in a gym may help in only very special situations and only by those with proper training. The article emphasizes instead the importance of learning how to land.

They mention one problem with spotting in the gym that I hadn't thought about: the weight of the spotters compresses the foam padding, depriving the falling boulderer of cushioning.