Totems worth it in larger sizes?

I’ve got a full set of DMM Dragons and am looking to build out my double rack with Totems. ike the idea of diversifying my rack, but am unsure whether to bother with the orange/red totem and just get doubles of those sizes up to grey in Dragons.

Friends have their own racks so will never be completely lacking, but how often are people placing orange/red totems and are they worth it comparatively?

TLDR: Worth the full rack of Totems or just doubling what I’ve got? 

I place the red and orange totems often. If it looks a bit funky or shallow they'll be first choice, especially in pockets. If you're climbing all splitters it won't matter much.

Orange feels a little floppy in the hand but placing is fine once you pull the trigger. Works less well as a desperate shove-it-in piece than say a C4.

I like both the red and the orange. I know others think orange is too floppy. I have made a 2 lobe placement several times in a groove where no other pieces would have protected that section of slab. That alone seals the deal for the utility of the orange Totem to me.

I think your question is purely a matter of personal preference. 

I was not going to get the two largest Totems - red and orange. Gangly, floppy, large when racked. But I now happily rack black through red, giving me doubles through red Dragon size. I am not planning on adding an orange Totem.

They are indispensable for pin scar placements, IMO especially in soft sandstone. 

For pin scars, yes. For hand-sized cracks, not really.

I carry doubles of red totem and a single orange all the time and I place all of them constantly. Definitely worth it IMO. The orange totem is slightly smaller than a BD #2 which comes in handy enough to justify it for me.

Primarily climbing on granite - Sierras, Tahquitz, Jtree  (flared cracks are common for me)

Worthwhile for pin scars, pockets, and moderately flared cracks. 

Lots of support here, so here is another side:  I personally hate the orange and find red to be nearly annoying.  I've sold my green.  Any BD, WC, DMM 0.75 and above totally adequate and lighter and more compact. 

 BL:  black-purple worth while, green and above totally and completely NOT worth it.

Each shines in different situations.

Aid climbing (usually on softer sandstone) it's Totems all the way. They fit in flares and weird pockets where Camalots will skate. Totems are superior, though by the time you get to Orange size the floppiness is noticable. Fiddly to place but aid climbing that's okay, there's no rush, no pump.

Free climbing (usually on solid granite) Totems usually stay at home. Prefer the fast deployment of Camalots. This preference increases as size goes up. I was carrying a Purple and a Green for a while but virtually always reached for the Camalot first.

Generally I don’t like orange. Too floppy but found  the narrow head super clutch in Zion this spring. 

I would echo most of the comments above on the floppiness of the orange Totem, definitely not my favorite for free climbing. However, For aid climbing I think its worth having. I had an orange totem hold in a placement in the fisher towers where a C4 ripped on me.

I don't get the hate toward orange totem because of "floppiness". It's hand/fit size, when you place it you're usually pretty secure. Even on 5.11 (I know, soft grate for MP bros)  I've never had a truly desperate orange totem placement far above my head.

Bottom line, I don't see any advantage in other cams of the same size. A totem is a totem, it goes much better in weird placement, give you a marginal 2 lobe protection in shallow placement if that's all you have WHILE doing 99.99% of what other cams do. 

I would say yes but it depends on where you are climbing. Most people will probably say no and I can understand why.   The more irregular the rock the more useful they are going to be.  They can go in weird pods, horizontals and flares that a C4 or a dragon can’t or won’t as easily.  

Having previously climbed on a seaside sandstone crag for 10 years as my local cliff, I think the orange and red are just as important as the black or blue.  Climbing on granite cracks less so but still very versatile and confidence inspiring.

Pros:
More idiot proof placements, once you place one they pretty much instantly set because of the independent lobes where you might have to use a bit more brainpower and technique with a C4. Useful if you are tired or gripped.

Edward Totemhands is a real thing. They are worth it for gorilla aid if you have to slam cams in quickly and instantly yard your way through a section of climbing.

Weird pods, flares, irregular cracks.  The more flexible stem is better for horizontal cracks. Building anchors in less than optimal cracks “feels” faster. 

Placing and cleaning.  I personally think they are a bit faster to place, feel subjectively more confidence inspiring, don’t seem to walk as much and or as likely to get stuck but your mileage will vary.

Cons: 

Price, they are $20-$30 more than a standard C4. In the US they are about the same price as the DMM Dragon and the C4 ultralight 

Weight, the C4 ultralight is lighter but the standard C4 is basically the same. The Dragon is a bit heavier. 

#1 Red C4= 124g #2 BD Yellow C4=140g 

#1 Red C4 Ultralight =101g #2 BD C4 Ultralight=126g

Totem Red= 132g Totem Orange=144g

DMM Red Dragon=128g  DMM Gold Dragon=154g

*The stem*, some people really don’t like the larger sizes because of how flexible the stem is which I get but I think this what makes them great and more versatile. Some people think they are also too bulky.  I personally find the Dragons to be more annoying with their short stems but everyone is different.

Range, the range is close enough to the C4s and Dragons that they might not as useful as something that fills the gaps between sizes for pure parallel, crack climbing.  A gold Wild Country friend for example might be more useful because it’s a got bit more coverage on the wider end. 

I had a full rack, but strongly preferred a BD #2 to the orange totem. I sold the orange and use the rest in my primary rack. 

The biggest two totems are a full lobe skinnier than any other brand. They will fit where no other cam can fit. You probably don’t look for placements that shallow if you don’t have them, but you will start seeing them if you have them. The more splitter your cracks the less value they have, but if you climb funky cracks, they’re awesome.

Haven’t measured but I think metolius are just as narrow in the same size or at least close but still find totems fit wired flaring stuff better 

I sold my red and orange. I swear they were like grappling hooks getting caught on everything. They fit in cool placements but I always just ended preferring my C4s or friends.