Half Dome's Snake Dike is being retrobolted - get involved!

M M wrote:

Byra is winning the troll contest bigly, I didn't expect it 

I think Byra is a bot.

Marc801 C wrote:

I think Byra is a bot.

I think an older “trad” climber stole his girlfriend or boyfriend. 

Daniel Shively wrote:

I think an older “trad” climber stole his girlfriend. 

OMG! I think that’s it!!

Adam Byra wrote:

It’s called Yosemite national park, not boomer national park. People should be able to recreate how they want to. It’s everyone’s park. If someone wants to clip draws, it doesn’t stop other people from placing gear. Taking out the bolts that someone put it stops other people from enjoying the park the way they want to.

Instructions unclear....I took my motocross bike up the falls trails, I shot guns at peregrines while on el cap cause they probably taste good, caught fish by using huge nets across the merced cause I suck at fly fishing, brought a jack hammer to make good stairs to the top of mt watkins cause climbing it would be way harder, reinstated the REAL fire fall cause that shit seemed dope AF.....
Why is everyone mad at me? What does blacklisted mean?

Todd Berlier wrote:

I'm a Gen Xer and I don't think anyone not using their full name is arguing in good faith. Sorry, not trying to be a dick, but if one can't stand behind their name, then their position is lacking from the onset. There are a few good reasons but a lot of bad excuses for not using full names.

Many of the most experienced and thoughtful people here don't post under their full name. You don't think phylp phylp, Glowering, rgold, or Tal M are posting in good faith? Just because someone doesn't want random climbing memes and debates about Snake Dike to be on the first page of search results for their name by potential employers doesn't mean they are insincere or have something to hide. I just don't think my memes could compete on the current job market.

Collin H wrote:

Many of the most experienced and thoughtful people here don't post under their full name. You don't think phylp phylp, Glowering, rgold, or Tal M are posting in good faith?

They are, but not as good of faith as using one's full name. Good faith isn't black and white. It's on a continuum, imo.

I'm also thankful for all the above's input on this thread (and yours) and MP in general. Always thoughtful and thoughtful provoking. I'm not trying to slander them.

 Just because someone doesn't want random climbing memes and debates about Snake Dike to be on the first page of search results for their name by potential employers doesn't mean they are insincere or have something to hide.

To me this falls into the bad excuse category.

 I just don't think my memes could compete on the current job market.

I don't understand this.

Sorry, that last bit about memes on the job market was supposed to be a joke haha. The joke being that other applicants have better memes than I do and that in reality employers almost certainly don't care what I post here. My basic point is that one might not have a great reason for their decision to remain partially anonymous, but that's independent of whether or not they are being sincere about their own beliefs and their efforts to understand those of others (which is my definition of good faith). My bad for the confusion and further thread derailment!

Todd Berlier wrote:

They are, but not as good of faith as using one's full name. Good faith isn't black and white. It's on a continuum, imo.

I'm also thankful for all the above's input on this thread (and yours) and MP in general. Always thoughtful and thoughtful provoking. I'm not trying to slander them.

To me this falls into the bad excuse category.

I don't understand this.

I made a similar point that you’re making about posting using a pseudonym in another thread. Phylp replied that she did this because of concerns of harassment and specifically because she is a woman. Everyone who knows anything knows who rgold is. Tal’s identity isn’t really a secret. Many of the others are just OG forum users from when a forum handle was just a clever nickname but everyone knew who they are. It seems after hanging around here for any length of time it’s easy to know who everyone is. Some people just can’t handle the perceived exposure. Sure, I would prefer if everyone used their name and claimed what they write, but it is what it is.  Realistically I could be anyone I claim to be and so could anyone else. Maybe my next profile will be under the pseudonym Friedrich S Earbreather. 

It took me over a year to figure out who rgold was, boy was I slow. Not that I ever knew him. There are several people I suspect I have met, BITD, but don’t have any real idea about who they are.
I don’t mind the mystery.

Todd Berlier wrote:

They are, but not as good of faith as using one's full name. Good faith isn't black and white. It's on a continuum, imo.

I'm also thankful for all the above's input on this thread (and yours) and MP in general. Always thoughtful and thoughtful provoking. I'm not trying to slander them.

To me this falls into the bad excuse category.

I don't understand this.

Todd didn’t you just say “I don't think anyone not using their full name is arguing in good faith”? Doesn’t sound like a continuum to me!

Just messing with ya. Not that I need an excuse, but my profile on here used to use my last name, I only changed it once my brother started making a career in climbing because I did not want my MP shitposting to potentially affect him. I’ve never aimed to keep my identity private, even my Reddit account is very clearly linked to me as an individual. The lack of SEO results is indeed pretty nice though. Bit of a generational difference, as mentioned - I’ve now been on multiple podcasts saying all of the same dumb stuff I say on here, so certainly not a fear of standing behind my positions.

Also, I know half you mf pronounce my last name wrong (and probably my first) when you read it in your heads and that bothers me so I’d rather just have you botch my first name when you’re talking trash about me

Tal M wrote:

Todd didn’t you just say “I don't think anyone not using their full name is arguing in good faith”? Doesn’t sound like a continuum to me!

Just messing with ya. Not that I need an excuse, but my profile on here used to use my last name, I only changed it once my brother started making a career in climbing because I did not want my MP shitposting to potentially affect him. I’ve never aimed to keep my identity private, even my Reddit account is very clearly linked to me as an individual. The lack of SEO results is indeed pretty nice though. Bit of a generational difference, as mentioned - I’ve now been on multiple podcasts saying all of the same dumb stuff I say on here, so certainly not a fear of standing behind my positions.

Also, I know half you mf pronounce my last name wrong (and probably my first) when you read it in your heads and that bothers me so I’d rather just have you botch my first name when you’re talking trash about me

Lol! 

Y'all are right, sorry for the drift and misplaced criticism! 

Mr Rogers wrote:

Instructions unclear....I took my motocross bike up the falls trails, I shot guns at peregrines while on el cap cause they probably taste good, caught fish by using huge nets across the merced cause I suck at fly fishing, brought a jack hammer to make good stairs to the top of mt watkins cause climbing it would be way harder, reinstated the REAL fire fall cause that shit seemed dope AF.....
Why is everyone mad at me? What does blacklisted mean?

FREEDUMB!

M M wrote:

FREEDUMB!

YEAAAAHHHH! FUKYOOUHWONTDUWHAYATELLLLMEEEE!!!!!MUTHAFUUUKKERRRR!YEAAAAAHHHH!!!!!

I bet Sloan rides an e bike 

Adam Byra wrote:

If Harding was alive today he’d be partying with Sloan, talking about what a bunch of conformist losers we’ve all become. RIP Warren. RIP climbing. 

I seriously doubt that.  Harding was an excellent nailer and would have placed bolts as a last resort.  Even Robins acknowledge that after removing many of Harding's bolts up the initial blank sections of Dawn Wall.  Back before power drills, placing bolts was a lot of work, often standing on shakey holds.  They were only placed when absolutely necessary--hence, the runouts.

bob steed wrote:

Hey Russ, would you post some photos of the protruding bolt studs?  This will help those with specialized tools better prepare their kit to cleanly remove and patch.

Bumping this as I think many would like to see the current state of the chopped bolts. @russ do you have any pics you can share?

M M wrote:

I bet Sloan rides an e bike 

Unless he's illegitimately stealing Strava KOMs, who cares?  

David Buchanan wrote:

Unless he's illegitimately stealing Strava KOMs, who cares?  

I heard joe everless paid his soulmate nanook sloan everless to covertly motorpace him with an e bike in a failed attempt to steal the KOM from Scurvy Village to Boyztown. 

M M wrote:

I bet Sloan rides an e bike 

Which would be fine, because unlike adding bolts, riding an e-bike doesn't affect anyone else

From the federal current plan circulating (make your comments soon!) on fixed anchors.

NPS: “The occasional placement of a fixed anchor for belay, rappel, or protection purposes is appropriate in wilderness, and does not violate the Wilderness Act or necessarily impair the future enjoyment of wilderness. However, climbing practices with the least negative impact on wilderness resources and character will always be the preferred choice.”

Yosemite is wilderness and managed by NPS. There it is in black and white. The least negative impact. Chop the retro bolts.

I’m gen X. In the 90s when I first started climbing and heard about bolt ethics I didn’t get it. “Why not add a bolt anchor so I can TR a classic 5.9?” But after thinking about it for a couple days I got it. As you can probably tell from my replies I try to think about all sides to an issue and come up with what I think is the most reasonable position.

I’ve seen many other people from all the generations go thru a similar experience regarding retro bolts. As long as they have an open mind.

Speaking of an open mind. I love sport climbing. I see some people (almost always boomers or even silent generation haha) say climbing is supposed to be dangerous or they don’t think sport climbing should exist. I can see not wanting to sport climb, but to reject why some people love it is as short sighted as saying everything should be fine to retro bolt. Sport vs Trad is a different experience. And in my opinion that’s a great thing. And they usually take place in different environments. Owens River Gorge is a predominantly sport area. It’s super fun and challenging physically and has a huge number of sport climbs (a number of great 5.7s). It’s not wilderness. The climbing must mostly be bolt protected. If you want a bolted 5.7 with low risk go there (or just climb one of the  trad 5.7s in Yosemite where you can place as much trad gear as you want). It’s not that far from Yosemite  

Snake Dike is in a National Park Wilderness. A different experience that should be respected.

And I’ll repeat my opinion that we should not be adding the bolts that Beck suggested. I heard Bridwell said he would chop any bolts added. The route has been established for over 60 years as is with thousands of ascents and no serious issues due to the runouts. The second ascent already fixed the issues on the FA. A lot of people want the runouts and looked forward to them as a way to get comfortable on easy/appropriate to the grade runouts. And Becks proposal of where to add bolts doesn’t make sense in terms of actually reducing the risk on the route IMO.