Unsolicited Beta

I am sure we have all received unsolicited beta at some point - my usual response is to pretend I did not hear it and continue on but I am finding as I am coming back from injury and going to the gym at a different time (so I no longer am climbing with my usual group) I have gotten an onslaught of beta! 

I want to know how others deal with this in a fun way! I do not always feel like having the 'don't give unsolicited beta' conversation and many times when I do ignore it, the perpetrator will come up to me after the fact and give a play by play of all the things I did differently than they wanted me too :/

Only ask about the heel hook, where is the heal hook, how high is the heal hook: waist level? Armpit level? Ear level?!?  Then when they go back to crimp, Gaston, sidepull, BS, ask again about the heal hooks and only the heal hooks.  Maybe, just maybe they will get the point.  If not, interrupt them over and over again with only the heal hook beta questions, and keep them coming till they STFU. 

I have a few approaches… 

Mostly I just play dumb then ignore it.

Sometimes I’ll play along and go “ohhhhhh thanks” then ignore it.

Sometimes I’ll play up that it’s helping then do the opposite for my size/shape/reach.

I’m tall (5’11”) and guys shorter than me love giving me beta for what works for them for some reason, when I can usually just… reach up. It’s hilarious.

My wife reports that headphones and a scowl are a good deterrent.  Not a "fun" way, but a way.

I interrupt their spray with a firm "I don't want beta", and it has always worked for me. 

A lot of men commenting in the women's forum about how we should be more grateful for unsolicited beta. The irony is startling. Cheering someone on is one thing, telling someone exactly how you think they should do a climb when they didn't ask is different. Its unsolicited for a reason. OP, I think P Degner is right, just tell them you don't want beta and they need to take no for an answer. Eliza Earle makes a shirt on etsy that says "I don't want your beta" on the back which could also be helpful lol

Dirtbag Betawrote:

People don’t shout beta because they think you’re weak, they do it because they’re stoked and want to feel part of the send. It’s not that deep. You can ignore it, but don’t act like someone kicked your dog.

This “I’m a big girl, I don’t need help (and I definitely don’t have daddy issues)” routine? It’s tired. You’re not in a vacuum, you’re at a crag or gym, around other climbers. Sometimes people get excited. Get over yourself.

Take the beta or don’t. Just stop making it a moral issue.

You are the point.  Congrats.  

Live Perchedwrote:

You are the point.  Congrats.  

To be clear, I never offer beta. Whenever I watch someone climb, I am trying to use telekinesis to make them fall. Is that better?

Dirtbag Betawrote:

To be clear, I never offer beta. Whenever I watch someone climb, I am trying to use telekinesis to make them fall. Is that better?

Yes, better at proving why they pick the bear. Are you the victim here yet?

I wear one of these...

https://www.instagram.com/p/CkJ9zrJvQte/

For real.

Best method I've seen is to bring your index finger to your lips in a shushing gesture. Sends the message clearly without requiring a major confrontation.

Well, my line is "Thanks, I am really enjoying the route/my time in here and I don't need a beta".  Sending a route after a route is overrated, too... Leave ppl alone, if they don't ask for beta, let them enjoy their climb. Better to keep your energy for ticking your own send boxes. Not everyone is trying to tick a send list or prove that they are strong enough and can do it alone each time they hop on a climb... At the same time, I don't mind it when someone points out a hold when it's desperately necessary -  that someone being most of the time the caring belayer..  

“I’d rather figure it out myself”.

…or any variation of it (“thanks, but it’s more fun for me to unlock the sequence on my own”)

Nothing’s wrong with just saying “I don’t want beta”, but the above variations come across “friendlier”, if that is what you are trying to do.

at the end of the day, if the new time/new crowd is going to be your new normal, you probably will want to make a few friends, because that’s a large part of what makes climbing fun. So you can talk to people while you are resting, and expand on the “I don’t want beta”.

Of course all of this is just because you are asking for a “fun” way to say it. It doesn’t have to be “fun” or “nice”, if you don’t want to engage. 

Dirtbag Betawrote:

To be clear, I never offer beta. Whenever I watch someone climb, I am trying to use telekinesis to make them fall. Is that better?

Dirtbag Beta wrote:

People don’t shout beta because they think you’re weak, they do it because they’re stoked and want to feel part of the send. It’s not that deep. You can ignore it, but don’t act like someone kicked your dog.

This “I’m a big girl, I don’t need help (and I definitely don’t have daddy issues)” routine? It’s tired. You’re not in a vacuum, you’re at a crag or gym, around other climbers. Sometimes people get excited. Get over yourself.

Take the beta or don’t. Just stop making it a moral issue.

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Wow! I did not expect my comment to offend anyone.

There is nothing as deep as you suggest here - I just want to zone out and be left alone when I climb.

I say “quiet on set”.

Climbing is a solo sport done with a belayer.

Juanawrote:

 I just want to zone out and be left alone when I climb.

I don't even know how to boulder indoors without headphones.

Get a pet training spray bottle. When someone is telling you the "right" way to do a move is to use a certain hold, tell them you can't use that hold because it is wet. They will of course be confused. Proceed to spray the hold with water. Hopefully this leaves them sufficiently flustered that they leave you alone. At minimum their beta is now useless so they should shut up about it. The bottle can also be used the standard way for negative reinforcement training.

Get multiple sets of headphones of different sizes. Whenever someone tries talking to you and you don't feel like engaging, add a set of headphones. If they continue trying to talk to you, add another pair on top of the previous. Repeat until either they shut up, or you can't hear them at all.

Lena chitawrote:

Of course all of this is just because you are asking for a “fun” way to say it. It doesn’t have to be “fun” or “nice”, if you don’t want to engage. 

Yeah, I got stuck on the "fun" part.

One thing I haven't seen suggested is to type up a few sentences and print it out on a little slip of paper, carry a few and just silently hand one to the person trying to give beta.  If I actually had any desire to be nice, mine would say something like:

"I appreciate that you are trying to be helpful, but a lot of the joy I get out of climbing comes from figuring things out.  You giving me beta interferes with my climbing experience, and I would bet that is not your goal. But if and when I do want some beta, I'll ask for it.  Thanks and have a nice day."

lol, Dirtbag Beta comes to women’s forum, gets triggered, goes on to spew gibberish, then says to “get over yourself” with irony zipping over his head.