2024 Rope Discussion

70 lets you easily do son of easy o in one pitch and lower off, and that's enough of a reason for a 70 imo.

Dare I say it… half ropes?

Trevor Joneswrote:

To Andy's point - Unfortunately, we all have to use an N of 1 experience. I was just reading (by reading I do mean watching YouTube videos) how there is not yet an abrasion standard for ropes. Mammut seems to be working on this problem for their Alpine cords that are very exposed to sheath shearing potential. That being said, Thank God we are discussing how rad our super safe enough ropes are and not taking about who broke their back taking a 3-foot whipper on static hemp line. 

Also for anyone who cares - I have had my new rope out for a few sessions, and I do love it. It has been really awesome having the extra rope to link multi-pitches, skip a rap or two, and have zero cause for concern at my crag. It is, however, a lot of rope! The Fixie product seems to be excellent, and I am looking forward to seeing how it ages. 

Thanks for the update. Thinking of trying a Fixe rope next time.

Rich Cwrote:

What raps can you skip at the Gunks with an 80?  Someone told me Ursula. Can you do Double Crack with one rope? 

Also what belays can you skip that you couldn't before with a 70? I generally run pitches together whenever I can. The only times I've come up short is Limelight by about 10ft and Strictly into the Ceiling by a lot.

Trying to decide between 60, 70, 80 for my next rope. Primarily climbing at the Gunks too.

Hey Rich - Double Crack you come up short by about 8 feet... You can turn some of the 3 rap lines into 2 rap lines. For whatever reason I have been able to skip a few rap rings. 

An 80 lets you link Madam G in one from the ground and rap to the 5.0 gully in one. I linked the Ceiling in one Mega Pitch, but my partner had to simul-climb a few meters to give me enough rope. 

I will also admit, its generally more rope than you want, but I have found it to be useful and fun to have. 

Matt Wetmorewrote:

70 lets you easily do son of easy o in one pitch and lower off, and that's enough of a reason for a 70 imo.

Super true - I have had to snip the end of both my 70s thus far and Son Of turns into a knot stopper. 

I’m often surprised gunks climbers want to carry an additional 10 or 20 meters of rope around for the off chance they want to TR son of easy o, or save an additional rap for a select few climbs. Bonnie’s direct in a single pitch is more worth it, but I think it’d be doable with a 60 (can anyone confirm?). If anything, double ropes/tagline seem much more worth it (and safer) if you want to go this route. I understand wanting to carry more crap for “training weight” lol  

Then again, gunks climbers seem to egregiously default to extending placements, even when  unnecessary/dangerous (so many times I’ve seen fully extended first pieces that leave the climber in unnecessary ground fall position), so maybe doing unnecessary things with gear is  just a gunks thing.

I too used to unnecessarily extend placements and lug a 70 around until I starting climbing at Twall and my partner called me out on it. 

Maxwell Hvolbekwrote:

I’m often surprised gunks climbers want to carry an additional 10 or 20 meters of rope around for the off chance they want to TR son of easy o, or save an additional rap for a select few climbs. Bonnie’s direct in a single pitch is more worth it, but I think it’d be doable with a 60 (can anyone confirm?). If anything, double ropes/tagline seem much more worth it (and safer) if you want to go this route. I understand wanting to carry more crap for “training weight” lol  

Then again, gunks climbers seem to egregiously default to extending placements, even when  unnecessary/dangerous (so many times I’ve seen fully extended first pieces that leave the climber in unnecessary ground fall position), so maybe doing unnecessary things with gear is  just a gunks thing.

I too used to unnecessarily extend placements and lug a 70 around until I starting climbing at Twall and my partner called me out on it. 

Gunks is the only good concentrated trad around so it pulls in a lot of newbies who make these mistakes. 

Maxwell Hvolbekwrote:

I’m often surprised gunks climbers want to carry an additional 10 or 20 meters of rope around for the off chance they want to TR son of easy o, or save an additional rap for a select few climbs. Bonnie’s direct in a single pitch is more worth it, but I think it’d be doable with a 60 (can anyone confirm?). If anything, double ropes/tagline seem much more worth it (and safer) if you want to go this route. I understand wanting to carry more crap for “training weight” lol  

Then again, gunks climbers seem to egregiously default to extending placements, even when  unnecessary/dangerous (so many times I’ve seen fully extended first pieces that leave the climber in unnecessary ground fall position), so maybe doing unnecessary things with gear is  just a gunks thing.

I too used to unnecessarily extend placements and lug a 70 around until I starting climbing at Twall and my partner called me out on it. 

I didn't want this thread to turn from a discussion of ropes into me putting my life on the line to defend the Gunks but I gosh darnit I will.  

I don't feel the need to die on the 80m hill. I got an 80m rope and now feel like it is worth it to report back to this thread. I also travel a good bit to climb, and some places suggest an 80 (Owen's River Gorge for example). Final thought - when traveling to Red Rocks and Yosemite, I have on more than 1 occasion wished I have a few extra meters of rope. I have never used double ropes, I am sure they would work just fine for folks. 

Right on Trevor. The rope length debate is a tastes great / less filling sort of thing imo, especially with the easy approaches here. Linking pitches is fun but does introduce risk. A strong partner once encouraged me to lead Directissima all the way to the top of High E in one (70m). It was memorable and fun as heck but he had to climb the 5.8ish ramp at the beginning basically unprotected. Arrow in one is fun but you’re not allowed blow it above the GT. Birdland is fun in one and nice to have extra rope to run an anchor around the trees and belay from the edge to see / photo your follower. I recall needing the full 70 to lower off of the Falled on Account of Strain anchors after linking the two pitches. Lowering off Teeny Face in one is another where a 70 is just barely enough. Never needed an 80 tho, but if you chunk your rope falling on Balrog like I did then you’ll end up with a 70 and be golden (-:  

Edit: And there’s the 35m anchor on the Mac wall . . .  

Jared Ewrote:

Dare I say it… half ropes?

I have a pair of Edelrid Starling Protect Pro Dry 8.2 ropes in 70m and I absolutely loved them the few times I've been able to use them. I've used them for ice and objectives where weight is a concern. They have proven to be pretty tough and don't have any noticeable fuzziness or wear after doing Exum, Tuolumne Triple, and various Zion peaks (used just one rope folded in half for these).  I would have gone skinnier if they were purely for ice but opted for thicker ropes since I intended to use them for alpine rock. 

I've switched to a 60 at the gunks after years on a 70. The 70 doesn't help, at all. There are some fringe cases but it's really no help when compared to the burden. There are very very few climbs where you can't go from the base to the trees with a 60, and all of those it's not a great idea to do it even if you have a 70.  There's not a single rap station you can skip by using a 70. There are however a few you can skip by using an 80, but no way that's worth it.
BTW you can toprope doublecrack on a 70 if you stand all the way to the right. 

Maxwell Hvolbekwrote:

I’m often surprised gunks climbers want to carry an additional 10 or 20 meters of rope around for the off chance they want to TR son of easy o, or save an additional rap for a select few climbs. Bonnie’s direct in a single pitch is more worth it, but I think it’d be doable with a 60 (can anyone confirm?). If anything, double ropes/tagline seem much more worth it (and safer) if you want to go this route. I understand wanting to carry more crap for “training weight” lol  

Then again, gunks climbers seem to egregiously default to extending placements, even when  unnecessary/dangerous (so many times I’ve seen fully extended first pieces that leave the climber in unnecessary ground fall position), so maybe doing unnecessary things with gear is  just a gunks thing.

I too used to unnecessarily extend placements and lug a 70 around until I starting climbing at Twall and my partner called me out on it. 

Guess it comes down to personal preference. I had a phase of using a 60 at the gunks but went back to using a 70 as it comes in handy sometimes and I don't always know what I'll get on that day. The extra 10m is like 1.3 pounds more with a thick rope and the Gunks ain't alpine climbing. 

80m can almost always rap (sometimes with a tiny bit of down-climbing) from the GT ledge to the ground, skipping an entire rap. You can also take every climb in the Trapps from the ground to the trees in a single pitch, assuming you space and sling your gear appropriately. Personally, I don't do enough multi-pitching to warrant the added weight, but this could be nice for a big volume day.

70m is required for a fair number of classics including Teeny Face, Son of Easy O, No Man's Land, etc. but if you're avoiding those, a 60m is sufficient. 

I miss when this was a rope discussion and not a Gunks nerdfest

It's not carrying the rope - It's the extra 10 meters you have to flake through and coil. Before you know it, you'll have unnecessarily handled kilometers of rope. 

Lothian Busswrote:

It's not carrying the rope - It's the extra 10 meters you have to flake through and coil. Before you know it, you'll have unnecessarily handled kilometers of rope. 

That's what the Gunks nerds call "training" (-:

Ah, the good ole days when I stressed about going with the standard 45m (150’) rope or springing for the super long 50m (165’) cord. (11mm diameter, of course).

bridgewrote:

80m can almost always rap (sometimes with a tiny bit of down-climbing) from the GT ledge to the ground, skipping an entire rap. You can also take every climb in the Trapps from the ground to the trees in a single pitch, assuming you space and sling your gear appropriately. Personally, I don't do enough multi-pitching to warrant the added weight, but this could be nice for a big volume day.

70m is required for a fair number of classics including Teeny Face, Son of Easy O, No Man's Land, etc. but if you're avoiding those, a 60m is sufficient. 

?
Son of easy O can be lead on a 50m rope. You can link those pitches and top out with a 60, i've done it.
I've actually climbed almost all of the moderates left of the stairmaster with a 60 from the ground to the trees in one pitch getting in my birthday pitches. 

It's very common for people to go from the ground to topout on Pas de Deux and City lights in one go, on a 60. Those are right next door.
I've definitely lead Teeny Face multiple times on a 60 as well. .

I believe the area around No Glow requires a 70 to topout from the ground. But I've lead Arrow from the ground to the top chains on a 60 at least 10 times.

are there significant structural differences between Beal/Mammut/Edelrid/Maxim etc? I've always just bought whatever was on sale but wondering if there's more to consider

Beal has some unicore ropes

Edelrid and mammut have their own versions of aramid threaded ropes. They do it in a somewhat different way. Besides that no