Keene RR Cut Drytooling/off season climbing

I hate to dive back in but...

Please DO NOT climb in the Keene cut when it is not frozen.  Yes, there are one or two pure rock routes, and yes there are a couple pure dry routes that can take the abuse but largely the venue CANNOT handle warm weather climbing with tools and crampons, as evidenced by the large number of new blocks lying on the ground, the sheared off moss and dirt and the root balls/hemlock trees that have been pulled off since last winter season.  Its blasted rock, its loose, its wet.  Almost all top outs are on turf or dirt.  All things that make for exceptional mixed climbing when frozen but ruin routes when climbed otherwise.   A single summer has seen more damage than the massive influx of winter users over the last 10 years.  Build a plice wall.  Go to the gym and use those weird plywood tools.  Please do anything but continue ruining this resource. 

I get your concern and I’m not advocating for anyone to climb when it’s warm and screw stuff up but I’m just thinking, for one it’s blasted rock so the entire reason it exists is because humans screwed up nature. More on the practical side of things the loose stuff is going to come down eventually, that doesn’t ruin the routes it just changes them. Won’t the cliff just become more stable as time goes on and the choss gets knocked off? 

This is better than the bozos who decided to dry tool intertwine at crow hill. I don’t advocate ruining others fun but I thought railroad cuts were fair game for dry tooling, no? Where else do chuffers who dry tool go? Intertwine at crow hill I guess. I mean their personality is right in their hobby name.

Here's 2 cents from a local, ignore the OP. If you want to drytool there in summer,  go for it but be warned. It smells like shit and the bugs will carry you away but it's what the place is for.  It's not some valuable resource, it's a chossy railroad cut and so full of gumbys in the winter that there's more ice on the ground than on the walls.  That's why some of us climb there off season, minimal shit show. 

FYI I'm aware of all of this,  I've left too many biners and anchors to count plus me and my partner have bolted routes here so calm down. 

I've decided to retract the opinion I shared, because ultimately people are going to make their own decisions and everyone's going to have their own impact, myself included, like it or not. So it is what it is, and to each their own. Happy climbing, everyone.  

I think you should have left your rant of a post where you told me to fuck off up for all to see. IMHO

Mike Swrote:

I think you should have left your rant of a post where you told me to fuck off up for all to see. IMHO

Actually I still think it would be well and fine if you did that. You've obviously proven your only concern is for yourself. I especially love the irony of you stating that it's not a "valuable resource" despite your own use of the place. Thanks for your "contribution" but your tat and biners have been cut down by the loggers last week and are all laying on the ground if you'd like to reclaim them.

Funny thing is I was trolling the OP but you took the bait.  Time to down climb that high horse you're on. 

I'm going to assume it's not the right thread, but I'm going to ask anyways, is there climbable ice in the cut yet?

Mike Swrote:

Funny thing is I was trolling the OP but you took the bait.  Time to down climb that high horse you're on. 

nice to see this is the state of the climbing "community" in 2024.  

Jackson Malonewrote:

I'm going to assume it's not the right thread, but I'm going to ask anyways, is there climbable ice in the cut yet?

yes

Joseph W. Duttonwrote:

I get your concern and I’m not advocating for anyone to climb when it’s warm and screw stuff up but I’m just thinking, for one it’s blasted rock so the entire reason it exists is because humans screwed up nature. More on the practical side of things the loose stuff is going to come down eventually, that doesn’t ruin the routes it just changes them. Won’t the cliff just become more stable as time goes on and the choss gets knocked off? 

good points and questions and a fine line to ride.  this particular place is inherently unstable except when frozen.  no amount of cleaning is going to make it more stable at least in our lifetimes.  so what I take issue with is climbing established routes (when not frozen) and "cleaning" or maybe just not knowing when you should or shouldn't pull off a loose block or try and hang off that partially frozen dirt clump.  sadly ultimately it doesn't matter.  everyone is going to do what they want to do when they want to do it with whatever justification they have for themselves no matter what I or anyone else says.  we have no standards for this kind of stuff in the "community", gyms have propagated the "take" mentality (I'm here, I have a right to "own" the route/place) etc.  If I sounded like I was on a high horse (Mike S) I'll back down.  I just ask that people be thoughtful, like long term thoughtful, about how they use all our resources especially the winter ones, especially the heavily used ones.  Contrary to the Gumby comment there's some real high quality routes in this little chosspile that deserve to preserved for as long as possible.  

It would be nice to have a dedicated area for off season surely. Nevertheless, these discussions are really helpful for ppl to be familiar with the local/general ethics rather than going there&swinging  tools without thinking about the impact...