Woeful Lack of Masks/Distancing at Rumney

ubuwrote:

By your logic all the anti-mask yahoos out there can do whatever they want, whenever they want, while those of us playing by the rules take the hit.  This is basically victim blaming.

Victim of what might I ask?

Of you! You are boring!

Mark Frumkinwrote:

Of you! You are boring!

Insults, i would expect no less.

It's not an insult it's a fact! Yawn.

Bart Simpsonwrote:

Victim of what might I ask?

Sigh.

Mark Frumkinwrote:

It's not an insult it's a fact! Yawn.

Fact? Honest question, are you on the spectrum? Do you know what "facts" are? A victim of what? Did this person have any nefarious act committed against them, or did everyone else in the area just not bend to this person's will, and that triggered the "Karen" instinct in them?  These types of people think and feel they are being wronged whenever someone disagrees with what they FEEL is the right thing to do.  This is what the core of the whole lock-down/precaution argument is about, what feels right?  Do masks help, maybe?, but you know what helps even better if you don't feel safe about being in those situations? Staying out of those situations.  Lock yourself down if you don't feel safe, but don't get poopy pants when others don't feel the same way you do about the whole situation. 

Bart Simpsonwrote:

Do masks help, maybe?, but you know what helps even better if you don't feel safe about being in those situations? Staying out of those situations.  Lock yourself down if you don't feel safe, but don't get poopy pants when others don't feel the same way you do about the whole situation. 

Masks definitely help - there is no question at this point; the science is irrefutable. If *everyone* wore masks right now when around others *and* practiced physical distancing...

1. Over 60K lives can be saved between now and the new year

2. The spread can be brought to manageable levels - adding in extensive testing and contact tracing at a national level can go even further.

The resolving the economic impact and life normalcy WILL NOT HAPPEN until the pandemic is brought reasonably under control 

It has nothing to do with "personal feelings". Refusing to wear masks is akin to being anti-vax and a flat-earther.

I find the conjecture, about how many lives wearing masks will save, amusing.  60,000! 100,000! Pick a big number and we'll use it!

Remember, it's "science." Don't question it.

FrankPSwrote:

I find the conjecture, about how many lives wearing masks will save, amusing.  60,000! 100,000! Pick a big number and we'll use it!

Remember, it's "science." Don't question it.

No, the difference is scientist use actual data and models to try and estimate a number. That number may be off and can be updated as new data and models develop. Deniers are the ones using conjecture by proclaiming that the number is zero, unknowable, or irrelevant. 

Marc801 Cwrote:

Masks definitely help - there is no question at this point; the science is irrefutable. If *everyone* wore masks right now when around others *and* practiced physical distancing...

1. Over 60K lives can be saved between now and the new year

2. The spread can be brought to manageable levels - adding in extensive testing and contact tracing at a national level can go even further.

The resolving the economic impact and life normalcy WILL NOT HAPPEN until the pandemic is brought reasonably under control 

It has nothing to do with "personal feelings". Refusing to wear masks is akin to being anti-vax and a flat-earther.

Responding to your quote that is in bold - is it really?

https://www.cdc.gov/mmwr/volumes/69/wr/mm6936a5.htm

This report is interesting, for it states that 85% of cootie patients reported always or very often wearing a mask. That is strange because we have been told masks are our saving grace to this cootie catching rate.

Also, what then if a new round of pandemic/s happens? Are we to just not worry about our economy, and normal way of life? 

The intro music is goofy, but you should watch it nonetheless:

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=3MKzKAzKCNk

Bart Simpsonwrote:

A victim of what? Did this person have any nefarious act committed against them, or did everyone else in the area just not bend to this person's will, and that triggered the "Karen" instinct in them?  These types of people think and feel they are being wronged whenever someone disagrees with what they FEEL is the right thing to do. 

You couldn't be more off on this.  I'm not a confrontational person, this was my first post on MP forums, and I don't "feel I was wronged". I saw behavior contrary to public health recommendations & as other posters have mentioned the RCA reopening measures and was curious if others felt similarly, or why if not.  By all means disagree or debate the safety of indoors vs outdoors etc, as many others have, but shouting down someone for bringing up a potential safety issue in the first place seems quite poor form and dangerous in and of itself. 

This issue also has nothing to do with my "will" or any other singe persons', but how we interact as a society and in this case the rules set forth by a group like the RCA with the hope of making those interactions safer for everyone.  Do you not think they have a mandate to do so?    

Rumney Maskswrote:

This issue also has nothing to do with my "will" or any other singe persons', but how we interact as a society and in this case the rules set forth by a group like the RCA with the hope of making those interactions safer for everyone.  Do you not think they have a mandate to do so?    

Correct me if I’m wrong.  But the RCA doesn’t own the Crag.  The National Forest owns it and the RCA just works to advocate for access and parking and bolting and such?  But my point being the RCA can do things to promote Rumney but they can’t restrict access or put in rules or anything.  That would be the National Forests responsibility? Hence why masks and stuff have been suggested and encouraged for but are not required or anything.  

BigFeetwrote:

This report is interesting, for it states that 85% of cootie patients reported always or very often wearing a mask. That is strange because we have been told masks are our saving grace to this cootie catching rate.

From the report (emphasis added):

Case-patients were more likely to have reported dining at a restaurant (any area designated by the restaurant, including indoor, patio, and outdoor seating) in the 2 weeks preceding illness onset than were control-participants (adjusted odds ratio [aOR] = 2.4; 95% confidence interval [CI] = 1.5–3.8). Restricting the analysis to participants without known close contact with a person with confirmed COVID-19, case-patients were more likely to report dining at a restaurant (aOR = 2.8, 95% CI = 1.9–4.3) or going to a bar/coffee shop (aOR = 3.9, 95% CI = 1.5–10.1) than were control-participants. Exposures and activities where mask use and social distancing are difficult to maintain, including going to places that offer on-site eating or drinking, might be important risk factors for acquiring COVID-19. . . . 

Direction, ventilation, and intensity of airflow might affect virus transmission, even if social distancing measures and mask use are implemented according to current guidance. Masks cannot be effectively worn while eating and drinking, whereas shopping and numerous other indoor activities do not preclude mask use. . . .

To help slow the spread of SARS-CoV-2, precautions should be implemented to stay home once exposed to someone with COVID-19,** in addition to adhering to recommendations to wash hands often, wear masks, and social distance.

The report is saying that the risk appears to increase when people remove their masks to eat and drink at a restaurant, bar, or coffee shop.  This would tend to confirm the position that masks mitigate risk, and the report says as much when it endorses the recommendation that people "wash hands, wear masks, and social distance."

Marc801 Cwrote:

Refusing to wear masks is akin to being anti-vax and a flat-earther.

Thinking masks are the only thing needed to make the situation safe is also practically anti-vax/flat earther. Masks are quite literally the backup plan and people treat them like they are the only plan. 

Princess Puppy Lovrwrote:

Thinking masks are the only thing needed to make the situation safe is also practically anti-vax/flat earther. Masks are quite literally the backup plan and people treat them like they are the only plan. 

Only you do, in this thread I've stated more than once masks, hygiene, and social distancing work in tandem.  I'm just regurgitating what the officials have been saying for 7+ months.

If you have a better plan the entire world would like to hear from you, like yesterday.

BigFeetwrote:

This report is interesting, for it states that 85% of cootie patients reported always or very often wearing a mask. That is strange because we have been told masks are our saving grace to this cootie catching rate.

For the last friggin time:

Your mask doesn't protect you.

Your mask protects others *from* you.

BigFeetwrote:

Responding to your quote that is in bold - is it really?

https://www.cdc.gov/mmwr/volumes/69/wr/mm6936a5.htm

This report is interesting, for it states that 85% of cootie patients reported always or very often wearing a mask. That is strange because we have been told masks are our saving grace to this cootie catching rate.

Also, what then if a new round of pandemic/s happens? Are we to just not worry about our economy, and normal way of life? 

The intro music is goofy, but you should watch it nonetheless:

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=3MKzKAzKCNk

Indoor, you need to wear a mask, absolutely. Outdoor, unless you are shoulder to shoulder packed in, little benefit. You will be fine. 

Bart Simpsonwrote:

 Lock yourself down if you don't feel safe, but don't get poopy pants when others don't feel the same way you do about the whole situation. 

You keep bringing up this straw man.  Nobody on this thread is asking for a lockdown.  Nobody.

Instead, people are asking you, and others like you, to wear a damn mask while in public.  Why?  Because we'd like to see fewer people die, and see the economy get back to business as quickly as possible.  Masks will do both.  It has nothing to do with how you "feel".

Kevin Heckelerwrote:

Only you do, in this thread I've stated more than once masks, hygiene, and social distancing work in tandem.  I'm just regurgitating what the officials have been saying for 7+ months.

If you have a better plan the entire world would like to hear from you, like yesterday.

You must have missed the thread that was about gym safety and how safe or not safe a gym was based on mask policy. Or the fact restaurants are open. Or movie theatres or large public venues or weddings. Everyone justifies these things as okay because they are wearing masks.

Rumney masks justifies rumney as being safe missing the whole part about avoiding group gatherings. It is probably just as bad to go climbing in rumney as going to wedding. The only thing I was trying to point was the hypocrisy in the original post.