Updated Colorado Safer at Home Order - 10-mile limit for recreation

Big Dick Johnson wrote:

Essential workers, especially in the food supply chain, need to strike RTF now, and stay on strike until N100 masks, hand sanitizer, paid sick leave are guaranteed.

A one day demonstration is horseshit.

Also, everyone should stop paying all rent, mortgages, credit card bills and Federal income tax.

We are going to lose local governments soon. They are going to be forced to hike property tax a shitton onto people who haven't worked for months and there will soon br 40-50% unemployment. We are going to lose small family businesses to the mega corporations.

As an individual, your only chance of surviving the next 5 years is with decentralized everything. Local level Mutualism and Agorism. Local level public services.

The Centralized Authority that is the United States will resort to a global war as a economic engine if we don't break it up. 

Yes thank you Dick.  A one time one day strike is horse shit.  May 1st marks the beginning of the general strike or a series of strikes. Even if we can start with one day for consumers to not shop and all workers to not go to work, we will do something that will have a huge impact on the US economy.  Those strikes should continue to happen and grow until our demands are met.   Here is the general strike page of Popular Resistance.   popularresistance.org/the-e…

Marc801 C wrote:

Exactly. When the UW model was published and the initial stay home directives/orders were issued, the underlying assumption was that there would be about a 50% compliance rate; it turned out to be closer to 95%*. That's a big part of why hospitals haven't been totally overwhelmed** (so far - the impact of quick lessening of restrictions remains to be seen).

*: Source - alas I don't have a link - it's my recollection from an article the other week
**: overwhelmed on a national level. Obviously there are some areas that are severely overwhelmed.

The number confirm your statement that CO hospitals are not currently overwhelmed.

Denver Dept of Public Health posts current ICU ventilator use via twitter: twitter.com/CDPHE/status/12… .  

Total CO ICU beds = 1800-2000 (according to CO SPH modelling assumptions: ucdenver.edu/academics/coll… ) 

This is from the Popular Resistance General Strike newsletter.  The #GeneralStrike has five demands:

(1) Protection from Covid-19

(2) Safe Housing.

(3) Living Wages.

(4) Medicare for All.

(5) Equal Education.

We would add a sixth urgent demand – saving the postal service.

From the Access Fund, if you're considering climbing:

Mark Rolofson wrote: Like it or not the new Safer at Home rules may be too soon.  The death toll in the US has quickly climbed to over 60,000.  China was successful in dealing with the situation.  The US response is too little too late.  The economic response by congress & the Fed demonstrates how totally incompetent our government is.  

Sorry, Mark, but these statements you seem to hold so dear to are completely false. Even given China's falsified numbers you can't say they fared any better than the U.S. The actual China numbers - if ever determined - will clearly be far worse than they claim. Given the fact that our death rate in the U.S. is generally low and our food / medical industries are just fine you would need to be just another reactionary Trump-hater to say our federal government is incompetent while at the same time giving state / local governments a pass. 

Laurie Mathis wrote:

Sorry, Mark, but these statements you seem to hold so dear to are completely false. Even given China's falsified numbers you can't say they fared any better than the U.S. The actual China numbers - if ever determined - will clearly be far worse than they claim. Given the fact that our death rate in the U.S. is generally low and our food / medical industries are just fine you would need to be just another reactionary Trump-hater to say our federal government is incompetent while at the same time giving state / local governments a pass. 

China was quick to respond with a total lockdown in big cities.  Their CDC warned the US on January 3rd about the serious nature of the COV-19 pandemic.  Trump (our clown president) ignored those warnings. US military intelligence warned the Trump administration about COV-19 back in November 2019.  Trump isn't the only problem, he's just our worst nightmare & the result of a corrupt two party system.  A two party system that is really a one party system, a two headed snake, beholden to Wall Street & the War Machine. 

China managed to get the spread of infections under control, while here in the US another 10,000 deaths are happening almost every day or two over the past week.  The economic response is also pathetic and demonstrates that we have socialism for the rich and rugged individualism for the poor in American.  What I am saying is backed up by lots of information.  Pull your Trump loving head out of your ass, stop watching Fox News & do some research.

Mark Rolofson wrote: China was successful in dealing with the situation.  

I agree with a lot of your points, but America needs to wake up about China.  If you believe the WHO and China numbers, you are very naive. There are so many groups in the US that refuse to say anything negative about China because they are essentially on their payroll.

It's easy to blame China, but they did warn us and Trump ignored them until it was too late.  The US response can not be blamed on China.

curt86iroc wrote:

Clear Creek County wrote plenty of tickets over the weekend for out of county cars parked at THs...

Just another "budget line item", nothing to do with safety. Pushback is in order!

Mark Rolofson wrote: It's easy to blame China, but they did warn us and Trump ignored them until it was too late.  The US response can not be blamed on China.

Yeah, "warned us" after the cat was out of the bag. The CCP is as complicit, or more,  in this as any possible entity.

Mark Rolofson wrote: It's easy to blame China, but they did warn us and Trump ignored them until it was too late.  The US response can not be blamed on China.

Yeah, it is easy to blame China.  They locked down travel to Wuhan internal to China, but allowed international flights leaving the country.  

I am not trying to make this political and I never said our response in hindsight was perfect.

Grandpa Dave wrote:

Just another "budget line item", nothing to do with safety. Pushback is in order!

and i suppose you also believe wearing masks is a plot to undermine Gillette...

curt86iroc wrote:

and i suppose you also believe wearing masks is a plot to undermine Gillette...

Nice red herring! [shakes head, can't believe it] ... masks are doing what they're designed to do. And that's just fine, but ticketing cars based on residency? Serious knee-jerk, refilling of the county bank account. 

Big Dick Johnson wrote: Also, everyone should stop paying all rent, mortgages, credit card bills....

Sounds like something a socialist would say.  I would rather pay for the goods and services I use, and be paid for the goods and services I provide...

slim wrote:

Sounds like something a socialist would say.  I would rather pay for the goods and services I use, and be paid for the goods and services I provide...

Under normal conditions, I would agree with you that I would rather be self sufficient.  However, this pandemic crisis has made it impossible for many small businesses to survive.  Most Americans are out of a job and they are not getting paid.  That is no fault of their own.  In most countries, governments are providing a strong social safety net to see people through this crisis.  Here in America the collateral damage will change the face of US business.  Big will get bigger.  There will far less small businesses.  Already large Pharmacies like Walgreens are buying up small independent pharmacies.since the crisis began.  I will say it again.  In America, we have socialism for the rich, rugged individualism for the poor.  The American way is to privatize corporate profits even when those profits carry a huge external cost on the environment or human health.  Then our government turns around and socializes the loses for large corporations, but not for small businesses or individuals.

but EVERYONE isn't in that boat.  calling on EVERYONE to do this is just plain silly hippy talk.  i am not saying tough shit to those folks who are totally hosed, but just ranting for a revolution is an eye-roller.

my boss, who is the smartest and most capable person i have ever known once said something.  "old hippies make the worst conservatives."  i think you can also look at the flip side of that and say that old conservatives make the worst socialists.

Claims that China handled the C-19 outbreak well make me smh.  In Dec 2019, a Chinese ophthamologist Dr. Li Wenliang, reported the appearance of a SARS-like respiratory disease spreading in Wuhan.  He was arrested and forced to recant his story by the police.  Denials were issued.  Chinese authorities later stated there was no human-to-human transmission and the WHO echoed this lie.  The rest of the world would have had several more weeks to prepare if not for the lies of the Chinese government.

Dr. Wenliang died in February from Covid-19.  He was 33 with one child and one on the way.

Grandpa Dave wrote:

Nice red herring! [shakes head, can't believe it] ... masks are doing what they're designed to do. And that's just fine, but ticketing cars based on residency? Serious knee-jerk, refilling of the county bank account. 

step back for a second and think about why they closed their county roads and THs...think about it...then think about it more....

...and then it will come to you...(hint: it has to do with all the people in the BC)...

Big Dick Johnson wrote:

So now we’re inventing synonyms for optimism?

John RB wrote: Claims that China handled the C-19 outbreak well make me smh.  In Dec 2019, a Chinese ophthamologist Dr. Li Wenliang, reported the appearance of a SARS-like respiratory disease spreading in Wuhan.  He was arrested and forced to recant his story by the police.  Denials were issued.  Chinese authorities later stated there was no human-to-human transmission and the WHO echoed this lie.  The rest of the world would have had several more weeks to prepare if not for the lies of the Chinese government.

Dr. Wenliang died in February from Covid-19.  He was 33 with one child and one on the way.

I'm not going to say China made no mistakes, but military intelligence had already warned the Trump Administration about the real possibility of a coronavirus pandemic, in November 2019.

  Furthermore, there were warnings from various agencies going back to 2003 that the US government needed to stock pile ventilators in case of a pandemic.  

So much of the blame China game by Trump, Biden & the US corporate media is part of a cold war strategy against China.  It is also an election issue.  Trump is blaming China and claiming they are intentionally trying to undermine his re-election.  US hegemony is threatened by China which has become an economic super power.  

Most importantly, China is beating us in creating an Orwellian artificial intelligence world of driverless cars, facial recognition, digital wallets, On-line only shopping, AI medical screenings as opposed to doctor visits and more.  This is another way that the rich & powerful will exploit the COV-19.  China's dominance in AI concerns the NSCAI (National Security Commission on Artificial Intelligence) whose board members include those at Goggle, Microsoft & other tech firms.  The following article by Whitney Webb "Techno-Tyranny: How The US National Security State Is Using Coronavirus to Fulfill an Orwellian Vision".   thelastamericanvagabond.com…  Webb's article in Last American Vagabond is based on a document from the NSCAI, she got from a FOIA request.  This is a must read!  What stands in the way of an artificial intelligence oriented society in the US are civil liberties & personal property ownership of cars & the desire to shop at stores with cash or credit cards.  

The enemy isn't China, it's lurking within our borders  Some of you may work for their companies and be unaware of what their long term business plan is.  Yes, there is much to criticize about China's police surveillance state. Here in the US, there is a need to place restrictions on the population during the crisis.  The question is, what will our world look like after the pandemic is over?  After 9/11 we got the Patriot Act and we still have it today.  Who will still own a small restaurant, climbing guide service or climbing shop?  Will we live in a AI dominated surveillance state? We need to decide the path forward not the oligarchs.