Red Rock loop closing at 5pm starting 9/20/10?

Just heard the above rumor? Is this true? CLC Wassup?

True-- according to the BLM:
blm.gov/nv/st/en/fo/lvfo/bl…

remember your late exit permit:
mountainproject.com/v/nevad…

I'm not surprised that BLM would only give one day's notice regarding this terrible policy change. For years, they refrained from imposing a 5pm closing time until at least mid-Autumn. This year BLM is really giving it to the public; first a 50% use-fee increase and now this - "pay more, get less".

While the press release states: "The closing time of the scenic drive is adjusted seasonally based on daylight and visitation", I see in the almanac that the sun doesn't set on Sept 20 until 6:41pm, so the law enforcement officers will have a heyday handing out $125 tickets to the throngs of people enjoying the (finally!) cooler weather while there is still TWO HOURS of daylight left.

I'd also like to point out that the late-exit permit is not available to the users of the first three pullouts or Willow Springs. So if you're hoping to get in an after-work burn by sport climbing or short-approach trad cragging, well you just got screwed...

Wasn't it just a couple of months ago that Michelle Obama and Harry Reid were at Red Rock promoting exercise? I guess they just mean not on public lands?

Seriously, it's finally cooling off and the days are still somewhat long, this is prime Red Rock season!!!! Anyone who goes to school or has a job with traditional hours can't go out for a quick hike or climb now.

It is nice that they are charging us more to keep us from accessing land that WE OWN.

Release Date: 09/20/10
Contacts: Kirsten Cannon , 702-515-5057 , kirsten_cannon@blm.gov

The above was copied from the press release. I think it is absurd that the release date for this information and the start date are the same. I am going to be contacting the above person to voice my dissatisfaction. I rely on RR for my after work recreation/exercise.

Darren- you can call Kirsten, but her voicemail states that she is on vacation until the 28th.

I just called and found out that Kirsten is a the blm's media person and is not the right person to complain to.

You should call Robbie Mcabboy. You can and should call robbie at 702 515-5074.

You can also email her at Robbie_mcaboy@blm.gov

In your emails you should ask why the blm has changed from the normal schedule of closings, which was

Winter (November 1- Feb 28/29) Opens 6 a.m. Closes 5 p.m.
Spring (March 1 – March 31) Opens 6 a.m. Closes 7 p.m.
Summer (April 1 – September 30) Opens 6 a.m. Closes 8 p.m.
Fall (October 1 - October 31) Opens 6 a.m. Closes 7 p.m.

email sent.

E-mail sent.

straight from the horse's mouth: (lil' discerning for those that claimed to call earlier not to have mentioned this!)

there is confusion as to the new policy and it is nowhere near as big of a deal as we thought! this is straight from the mouth of Robbie Mcabboy, a reasonable person at the BLM:

the loop road ENTRANCE pay center will now be closing at 5 p.m.! this change is because they're not pulling in any paying visitors after 5 and they want to reduce overhead...

IF, a climber or hiker enters the scenic loop before 5 p.m. we are subjected to the parks normal closure hours! We CAN go climbing today and I AM climbing today at Willow Springs until after 5 p.m.! She assures me there will not be any ticketing until the time posted at each parking lot. these are the same times they've always been except that we will see the 5 p.m. closing time about 2 weeks before we are used to..

That is why they haven't changed the posted exit times! those times are still valid, we simply can't access the loop road after 5 p.m.!!

furthermore, she released the press release a month ago and was stymied concerning the media dragging it until last night.

all that being said, if any of you groups out there are mobilizing, the thing to mobilize toward is NOT going into the 5 pm closing time 2 weeks early... nothing else is really different here, and beureaucratically i do not feel it is possible to get BLM to open that visitor gate past 5 p.m because it is a decision linked to their annual budget... the only thing we can and should fight would be maintaining our normal seasons and closing times...

otherwise, i personally don't care if tourists can't get on the loop after 5 p.m... it actually seems like a less of all evils decision during economically pressing times...

i truly would have moved if this was what it appeared to be... i'm much relieved personally, hope that helps you all...

I hear that John... i guess i figured that folks getting off at 5 aren't going to have time to climb on the loop anyway...

Thanks Jon O. for getting the straight story. A false alarm I suppose. But the truth is still disappointing however. Like John W. mentioned, BLM used to simply leave the toll booths unattended after 5pm and allowed the few late arrivals to drive in for free. That was only fair if BLM couldn't afford staffing. Besides moving BLM offices into the nice new building, what exactly are we getting for the 50% increase in fees? It's not like we are getting any trail maintenance, are we?

After reading the clarification posted by Jon, I again e-mailed Ms. Mcaboy stating that I now understood the new policy. She e-mailed back shortly with a reply, again stating what Jon posted. Just thought that was nice.

Thanks for the clarification Jon. The BLM did a pretty poor job of explaining the change in their press release.

Although this isn't as bad for climbers, it is still a pretty crappy change after increasing fees. I'm sure there are quite a few people that do quick hikes after work that don't make it there until after 5. I agree with John W. we should still voice our opinion on this one!

For sure... anything anyone puts together i'm in! make sure you guys post any actions/meetings and i bet you'll see a big turn out...

Thank you everyone who "expressed their frustration". Gate hours back to normal.

blm.gov/nv/st/en/fo/lvfo/bl…

BTW, the new shiny visitor center is not from the ops budget, so it has nothing to do with the fee increase. It is part of the SNPLMA funding, sort of a use-it-ot-lose-it kind of thing. The fee increase covers operations, such as manning the entrance booths, cleaning the toilets, etc. If ya wanna really get riled up, check out the history of SNPLMA...

hell yea! a lil' community involvement does wonders! be great if we could mobilize to address the bolting moratorium next!

congrats vegas climbers, well done!

Scott, I believe the SNPLMA is how the BLM was allowed to sell public lands to housebuilders. This led to vast tracts of houses being built on the perimeter of Las Vegas. The homes were built so close together because at the time the developers thought people would buy anything. Now these extended areas of urban sprawl are blighted ghost towns. So by selling off our beautiful desert lands for cheap, the BLM contributed to the housing crash by flooding the market with cheap homes. What I'd like to know is where they all thought the water was going to come from for this building spree.

That's in the works. At this point community involvement is not necessary, since it would be non-solicited opinions and would not count. Don't worry, when the new Wilderness Management Plan proposal is up for public comment, it will be posted immediately. I would not hold my breath for the ability to legally place a new bolt, though. Too few people with too little funding trying to do too much work. Not much consolation, but it'll have to do.
John, you're right. However, sustainability doesn't appear to be a foundational thought anywhere in NV, from what I can see...

thanks Smassey, holler at me if you ever remember to when the opportunity arrives...

happy climbing everyone, thanks for fighting

Nice job to everyone that submitted a complaint to BLM. Here's a link to the story in the Las Vegas Review-Journal.

Red Rock schedule extended