Ice Tools
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Getting into ice climbing and alpine climbing. I've been doing a lot of research online about axes. I want a tool that's great on ice, climbs mixed terrain well, and is good for alpinism. I've been looking at the BD Vipers, Petzl Nomic, or the BD Fusion. I've read reviews on most of them. Seems that the Viper or Fusion may be more suited for alpine climbing. Where as the nomic is more strictly for steep ice/mixed climbing. Does anyone have any suggestions? I know this topic has probably been beaten to death. I tried to do a seach but couldn't find anything substantial. Thanks for any input. cheers. |
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I think the Viper is what you're looking for. Like you said, the Nomics and Fusions are more for mixed climbing or super-steep ice, whereas the Viper tends to be more of an all-around tool. |
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Also check out the Petzl Quarks. I used to do all my climbing on a pair of Vipers; they're solid tools no doubt. However, once I picked up the Quarks, I never looked back. All my climbing is done now with Nomics for hard ice and mixed, and Quarks for everything else. |
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Mike Hasse wrote:Also check out the Petzl Quarks. I used to do all my climbing on a pair of Vipers; they're solid tools no doubt. However, once I picked up the Quarks, I never looked back. All my climbing is done now with Nomics for hard ice and mixed, and Quarks for everything else.What do you like about Quarks over Vipers? |
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Quark, Viper, Grivel Matrix Tech or Light. As your first set, any of those will be great to learn and grow on. Just find a set at the best condition/price ratio and get them. |
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In my very humble opinion-- money aside-- the only tools to consider are Cobras and Nomics. Cobras for alpine and lower angle ice; Nomics for higher angle ice and mixed. If you have any ambition for harder climbing get the Nomics. You can make them work in the alpine and they excel at everything else. Bear in mind that no tool is really good everything and most climbers have to think realistically about how much actual alpine climbing they will be doing compared to waterfall or mixed lines. |
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Grivel Matrix lights with horns are great for the alpine/WI3. Worked like a dream on Rainier and Hood. |
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Having had both quarks (previous gen. not the latest with the trigger) and now the latest version of the vipers I would say try both out if possible and see which one fits your grip best. I really liked my quarks but after using the vipers the grip just fit my smaller hands better than the quarks. |
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If you want the best of both worlds , then petzl quark , black diamond cobras, or the grivel matrix , and the vipers as well .I'd also look into the camp all mountain .im assuming your interested in plunge ability ? For alpine , they will all plunge just fine despite the finger rests. |
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Try as many tools as you can before you make a decision. Cassin tools would be one way to go. Try both the All Mountain and the X Dreams to see what you like best. |
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Kirby1013 wrote: Try as many tools as you can before you make a decision. Cassin tools would be one way to go. Try both the All Mountain and the X Dreams to see what you like best.The All Mountains would be a good choice for all-around, but if the OP wants tools that could be used for alpine climbing, I would not recommend the X-Dreams. I have a pair, and the ridged metal bit on the end of the handle gets poor traction on icy terrain. These would pretty much suck at caning, compared to the many superior options. Grivel Matrix/Quantum Techs, Quarks and All Mountains would all be more versatile. |
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Definitely try minimally a pair of BD tools and a pair of Petzl tools. They may vary model to model, but I pretty consistently don't like BD's feel and do like Petzl. I tried a partner's DMM apex's for a pitch or so, and liked the pick but not the swing. DMM and CAMP are both worth checking out. |
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So it seems as though the Nomics or Cobras are the way to go. I guess in a perfect world one would have a pair of Cobras for more alpiny routes and a pair of Nomics for the steep ice and mixed routes. There is no axe out there currently that is a quiver killer. |
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Maybe the X-All Mountain, maybe the Quark (no first hand experience with either). I suspect If you're asking about tools and looking for a quiver killer any of these tools will get you (and me) up anything you're shooting for IMO. |
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I'm not necessarily looking for a quiver killer. Just looking for the axe thats going to allow me to climb a little bit of everything. I'm leaning towards maybe getting a move agressive tool so i don't outgrow a lesser pair. I'm leaning towards the Nomics. But the Cobras are awful tempting as well. Although they are $$$ |
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jim.dangle wrote:In my very humble opinion-- money aside-- the only tools to consider are Cobras and Nomics. Cobras for alpine and lower angle ice; Nomics for higher angle ice and mixed. JimI don't understand why so many people say that the cobras are only good for "lower angle ice". Most of the climbers I know that lead WI6 lead it on cobras. I think that the ice conditions play a larger role in what tool to use than the steepness. Nomics will climb better on more featured or hooked ice. The cobras climb better on smooth ice. |
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IMHO a tool for all round climbing is the first generation of BD Cobras. They really do it all. Best of all one can find a pair used for price of one new tool: |
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I am also looking at the Grivel Quatum Tech, Grivel Matrix Tech, and Petzl Nomics for mixed and steep ice. Does anyone have any thoughts about the Grivels, as they don't have a trigger? |
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The Quantum and Matrix Techs are fantastic tools. Great steel. Great balance and swing. The Quantum, to my knowledge, are a carbon/alloy mix, not full carbon. They do dampen the impact a bit on ice, so that took a little to get used to when I used my friends for a few laps. |
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Try every Tool you can get your hands on! Swing geometry is different for everyone, I doubt you would have the same experience as your partner(s) when trying the same pair of tools. When you've tried out a few of the more notable brands on this list you will figure it out for yourself. |