Cordelette Advise

How does everyone's cordallete seem so neat and nicely racked on their harness and mine is a cluster of cord hanging from a gear loop no matter which knot I use to tie it.

I have been using Sterling 8mm Accessory Cord as my cordelette that I got from EMS and asked them to cut it into a 20 foot section. Here is what I have: ems.com/sterling-accessory-…

Its bomber and it works good for building anchors.

I am looking for something a little more user friendly. Something a little easier to work with and possible something lighter.
The 20 foot section of cord is turning out to be a little too short to work with and I would like something a little longer and thinner.

These days 7mm is acceptable cordalette diameter? Or is 8mm still the standard?

Any recommendations on good cordallete material? Again just looking for something a little thinner and easier to work with. The 8mm is a bit bulky. I know most any Accessory cord will work but looking for recommendations.

Also any comments on the Powercord? I hear good things about it regarding using it as a cordalette:

backcountry.com/sterling-po…

Is this acceptable to use even though its 6mm diameter.

Thanks,

Roman

Not an expert at trad anchors but I have a 7mm and an 8mm. Both are Bluewater (I think), both are 20', and both have figure 8's at each end. There have been a few threads about this going back 6 months or so (and probably more before that) so a search may yield some answers. The idea behind tying each end separately is that it's more versatile and can be used when placements are further apart. I like to double mine up 3 times and put an overhand knot in the middle, then rack by the tied ends (and extra loops).

And Jake beat me to it.

Your cord is probably a cluster because you don't wrap it tightly enough before racking it.

You may find the following thread relevant: mountainproject.com/v/corde…

I was always under the impression 7mm nylon was the conservative choice of recent years.

Thread on cordelette diameter here:
mountainproject.com/v/corde…

I like the 6mm power cord..light and strong

sterlingrope.com/c/climbing…

extend your pieces with slings of you need the legs longer, you really shouldn't need anything longer than 20-25 feet for the cordalette.

Here's a cool video explaining one way of racking a cordelette:

youtube.com/watch?v=qF4A85C…

25 feet of 7mm cord works for me. To rack it I wrap it loosely around one of my hands, leaving about 2 feet of tail, which is wrapped around the coil and then passed through at the end.

Somehow, the Cordelette Carriers of the World have declared that you have to have your cordelette all wrapped up and clipped to your harness. This makes sense if you don't actually use the cordelette much, but otherwise it always seemed to me that wrapping and unwrapping the thing was just a waste of time, and harness real estate is already crowded with junk.

I don't use cordelettes much, but if I'm going to use them on every pitch for some reason, then it seems to me that carrying them over the shoulder is a much more efficient way to do things. Just double the cordelette, double it again, and carry on the shoulder. Keep the power point carabiner on it so that the loops don't get uneven. You may find, as I have, that some minor adjustement in the total length of the cordelette is appropriate in order to have an over-the-shoulder sling that is comfortable to carry.

If you are going to use the knotless cordelette depicted in the video above, then you can still carry over the shoulder by installing a quick EDK to hold things together.

I looked into getting the Powercord/Techcord/whatever flavor of aramid cord you like, but decided against it. Though it is very strong, aramid isn't as resistant to repeated flexing; nylon doesn't lose any strength over time due to retying and untying, whereas aramid cords do. The AMGA had an interesting report that aramid cords lost 40+% of their strength after repeated flexing, but that was all the way back in 2001, so perhaps things have changed.

rgold, I rack loose slings that way, and it didn't even occur to me to rack my cordalette like that! It would work even better for the cordalette, sometimes it's tough to find the right sling from my shoulder bandolier while mid-climb, but cordalette is mostly used at anchors...

Still makes sense to store it coiled, but when cleaning an anchor on a multipitch, just sling it over your shoulder and go... I like it.

Thanks for that thought, rgold. I'll give that a shot too. With figure8s in both ends of mine, the power point biner will keep it all in line very nicely.

Thanks for all the feedback guys

Roman

I use 5.5 mil teck cord way smaller lighter and still bomber.

rgold wrote:Somehow, the Cordelette Carriers of the World have declared that you have to have your cordelette all wrapped up and clipped to your harness. This makes sense if you don't actually use the cordelette much, but otherwise it always seemed to me that wrapping and unwrapping the thing was just a waste of time, and harness real estate is already crowded with junk. I don't use cordelettes much, but if I'm going to use them on every pitch for some reason, then it seems to me that carrying them over the shoulder is a much more efficient way to do things. Just double the cordelette, double it again, and carry on the shoulder. Keep the power point carabiner on it so that the loops don't get uneven. You may find, as I have, that some minor adjustement in the total length of the cordelette is appropriate in order to have an over-the-shoulder sling that is comfortable to carry. If you are going to use the knotless cordelette depicted in the video above, then you can still carry over the shoulder by installing a quick EDK to hold things together.

Climbing became just a little bit better once I started using your rope only anchor system. That little bit extra knowledge went a lot farther than I originally thought it would.

@OP:
I wrap my cordelette by grabbing the double fishermans knot only, and looping the other strand over my hand. Then I grab both strands and wrap it around my hand until there is a few feet left. Then I finish the loop similar to the video posted above. Sometimes it looks ugly, but it is super compact and it never gets caught on anything and is about the size of my fist.

I use 8mil and I feel that is overkill. I've used the excess to some surprising applications without it breaking.

7mm Perlon and 5-6mm Tech Cord (high Tenacity fiber, spectra, dyneema, vectran) are the standard. Sterling, Maxim and Blue Water all make Tech Cord. Regular 8mm is stronger than you need it to be, and too bulky to carry reasonably. My cords are 16' before I tie them into a loop with a figure 8 bend (flemish bend).

The test results show that 7mm really is the best product for anchors cords. 6mm perlon isn't really strong enough in a single strand situation, but it depends on what you like your margins to be like.

7mm Perlon here as well - I think 20 feet before tying.

8 mm cord will use up more of it's length in any given knot. So you might be surprised what a smaller diameter will do for the same length.

M Bageant wrote: I looked into getting the Powercord/Techcord/whatever flavor of aramid cord you like, but decided against it. Though it is very strong, aramid isn't as resistant to repeated flexing; nylon doesn't lose any strength over time due to retying and untying, whereas aramid cords do. The AMGA had an interesting report that aramid cords lost 40+% of their strength after repeated flexing;pg=PA50&lpg=PA50&dq=technora+cordelette+climbing&source=bl&ots=j2RI4iwHHh&sig=uxGuW9iqKUekS35yMNaBbdI2BgM&hl=en&sa=X&ei=DlWMVdLcKImWyQT_mYeIDg&ved=0CFkQ6AEwBQ, but that was all the way back in 2001, so perhaps things have changed.

Here is the actual paper this book references for people who want to see the data. It's an eyeopener. I noticed my 3 month old Powercord is much more supple than when I first got it. Maybe its time to switch back to Nylon =/.

"Comparative Testing of High Strength Cord": https://user.xmission.com/~tmoyer/testing/High_Strength_Cord.pdf 

Parent page with link to the actual numbers: https://user.xmission.com/~tmoyer/testing/

Cordage has changed a lot in the last 20 years since those reports. Aramid and technora type materials have been formulated to address this very issue.

I would suggest reaching out to manufacturers for current information if you have concerns.

8mm is like guide service for large amount of kids top roping. Especially if its a very abrasive rock.

7mm is pretty standard.

6mm is getting thin, but a lot of people are comfortable with it for multipitch and retiring it a bit sooner than 7mm.

5.9mm Sterling Power Cord is technora (improved kevlar) core, very strong, very stiff.

5.5mm dyneema/spectra core cord from various manufactureres is also very strong and very stiff.

5.4 V-TX and other thin dyneema or technora core cords are seldom used except by a few alpinists who are comfortable with the corners they are cutting.

Keep in mind that dyneema and technora core cords will lose strength faster when knotting/un-knotting compared to nylon or polyester... but will look about the same, so its kind of like a visually hidden wear, as well as a larger strength reduction with knots. The high strength cord PDF linked above is spot on.

I had the 5.5mm titan cord, i think it's called. It's really nice and yhin but I had to cut it up to bail and wasn't willing to spend that much again, and switched to quadruple length runners. I think they're 240cm,  and have been working great, but it's going to suck when I get stuck in a precarious situation again and not be able to cut/retie my dyneema stuff. 

Btw I've been double fishermanning my cordalettes, but they are pretty hard to untie if I had to (say, cut it for tat): anyone bother with two edks instead?