major climbing destinations-where are they?

I'm confused as to why you dismissed the New River Gorge without any explanation.  And have you been to City of Rocks recently?  I'm not sure why you think it doesn't have enough numbers to be a destination. 

The New sucks.  It's not a destination unless you like long approaches to short, heinous cliffs, terrifying runouts, and the occasional banjo music emanating in the woods. It's the worst crag in the US, go to the red instead. 

richard aiken wrote:

places to which climbers travel far and stay for weeks or longer? central climbers hang out i.e. campground or cabins or whatever (e.g.camp 4, HVC, Miguel's

FRANCE

Chamonix, Ailefroide, Calanaques,Buoux, Verdon, Fontainebleau (IMO Ceuse and the other great areas don't get the numbers-am I incorrect? Did I miss any?)

Verdon --Yes.

Ailefroide -- Yes perfect fit.
. . . (and I have no interest in climbing there a second day).

Calanques? - No. Climbing sectors have always been very disconnected, and now with all the excellent new crags opened within an hour or two driving, even more so. I guess there's a campground which would be the obvious choice for visiting Americans who made it there to tick off some (now well-polished) routes they saw in some climbing magazine 30 years ago, and can't be bothered to purchase a modern guidebook.

Chamonix ? Not a good fit to the narrow definition above.

Buoux ?? I'll guess it's been 25 years since that was something like a "destination" under the definition above. So much new rock has opened since -- that overall region doesn't fit the definition -- (and I keep going back there).

. . . (Orpierre might be a better place in that general region nowadays to connect with visiting Americans who haven't purchased a recent guidebook).

Ken

P.S. ?? Rumney?? as a place where people travel long distances to spend several weeks? central climbers hangout?

P.S. ?? Gunks ?? thousands of climbers hanging around there for multiple weeks? Maybe twenty years ago? or is it thirty?
. . . Well there now is an obvious central climbers campground (perhaps you haven't been there in a couple years?)

richard aiken wrote:
> central climbers hang out i.e. campground or cabins or whatever (e.g.camp 4, HVC, Miguel's

This is an old-school definition of "destination". 

Nowadays we have mobile phones and there's AirBnB, and MP + FB to connect with other climbers, and guidebooks + beta in our smartphone apps.

Why bother to have everybody sleeping in the same place? - when you can just send texts or post on FB or MP to agree which coffee shop to meet in the morning, or which bar to meet at in the evening.

By going for the "campground" social route, you limit your partners to visiting climbers not smart or experienced enough to have found quieter (or cheaper) places to sleep "off the radar" (in their customized van or RV), or found a suitable cheap AirBnB (or in France, "gite"). Or don't know how to use social media effectively.

Ken

P.S. And in limestone areas, following the herd and hanging around with un-savvy climbers, is a good way to spend lots of time on polished rock.
. . . Maybe even some "hard rock" areas -- tried the opening moves on Disneyland in the Gunks lately?

I think in Canada, Skaha would be worth adding. Not quite as major as Squamish, but at least as major as Rumney IMO.

kenr wrote:

richard aiken wrote:
> central climbers hang out i.e. campground or cabins or whatever (e.g.camp 4, HVC, Miguel's

This is an old-school definition of "destination". 

Nowadays we have mobile phones and there's AirBnB, and MP + FB to connect with other climbers, and guidebooks + beta in our smartphone apps.

Why bother to have everybody sleeping in the same place? - when you can just send texts or post on FB or MP to agree which coffee shop to meet in the morning, or which bar to meet at in the evening.

By going for the "campground" social route, you limit your partners to visiting climbers not smart or experienced enough to have found quieter (or cheaper) places to sleep "off the radar" (in their customized van or RV), or found a suitable cheap AirBnB (or in France, "gite"). Or don't know how to use social media effectively.

Ken

P.S. And in limestone areas, following the herd and hanging around with un-savvy climbers, is a good way to spend lots of time on polished rock.
. . . Maybe even some "hard rock" areas -- tried the opening moves on Disneyland in the Gunks lately?

This is definitely true, but there are plenty of climbing locations where the internet connection is still spotty right? As an example, GL getting internet access anywhere in Joshua Tree proper. 

A central campground/hangout definitely makes the impromptu beer party around the fire more convenient (and thus likely to happen?). It almost always happens in the pit at Bishop or in HCVG in Joshua Tree.

Foster Conklin wrote:

I spent a couple weeks at Miguel's, and if you're looking for tons of people and loads of bolts, Kentucky is the place to go.  

You must have missed the North book on the shelf....all gear up there.

It may not have quite the mass numbers as other areas, but Horseshoe Canyon Ranch in Arkansas is a good destination. There's always climbers, but it doesn't feel as crowded because the canyon is so huge. If you're looking to spend days on end, it's a good place to call base camp for day trips to other nearby crags, Sam's Throne, Invasion, etc. 

Keep in mind, I'm a little biased.

San Vito Lo Capo, Sicily!

Why bother to have everybody sleeping in the same place? - when you can just send texts or post on FB or MP to agree which coffee shop to meet in the morning, or which bar to meet at in the evening.

By going for the "campground" social route, you limit your partners to visiting climbers not smart or experienced enough to have found quieter (or cheaper) places to sleep "off the radar" (in their customized van or RV), or found a suitable cheap AirBnB (or in France, "gite"). Or don't know how to use social media effectively.

Errrrr...

Well if I'm going to be travelling & climbing for weeks/months, I'm certainly not going to airbnb my way for that long. Maybe you're a week-end warrior and that's fine for short trips, or maybe you're flushed with cash. Or maybe you're a little more bourgeois and can't do camping, requiring a flush toilet at all times.

There is also something to be said about not living in a purely transactional world where you deal digitally with everything as much you can, because, ugh, people. There also are middles ways between big party places (like Miguel's) other climber-favored campgrounds that remain quieter. You don't have to be dumb to prefer being with actual people and/or like party places....

Canada - Cirque of the Unclimbables 

Definitely a destination with an international reputation, and anyone who has gone that far is going to hang out for at least a couple weeks.  From wikipedia, "The Cirque's most famous peak – a must for every serious climber - is the Lotus Flower Tower, featured in Fifty Classic Climbs of North America."

Old lady H wrote:

Idaho thanks you for keeping us off a list, though. Much appreciated!

Not very hard to leave Idaho off the list :) 

Hank Caylor wrote:

Riglos, Spain. They have a few 5.11+ testpieces but three 1,000' loafs of mega-classic 5.9's, 10's as well as the 11's. There might even be a 12 or two but mainly on the more moderate side. And drop dead gorgeous views with minimal approaches to the crags, and a climbers bar and refugio right there.

https://www.mountainproject.com/area/108851610/riglos <------- feast your eyes!

edit~ I personally think the New River Gorge is my favorite crag in the USA. Miles of routes, great approaches, civilized camping galore, DWS in the Summer and every 100yds or so is a cool ass crack climb and these never seem to get the attention the thousands of sport routes get. Routes range from every grade you could think of, almost, and with all the whitewater rafting and kayaking you get a good mixed crowd of other user groups.

^^^^^^^^ Unique culinary choices too!^^^^^^

Off topic, but it's great to see Tudor's getting some love.  I grew up in West Virginia, and I still could eat a Mickey every morning and never get tired if it, if I could get them in NYC! :)

Mike Brady wrote:

Not very hard to leave Idaho off the list :) 

The Fins are unreal.  Most places I go in the US just make me miss the NRG (I'll second whoever said it was the best crag in the US), but the Fins are a special place.

Mark Paulson wrote:

The Fins are unreal.  Most places I go in the US just make me miss the NRG (I'll second whoever said it was the best crag in the US), but the Fins are a special place.

I was, for the most part, just poking fun. CoR is one of my favorites.

I’ll put a second in for norwest Arkansas. Base camp out of Sam’s or HCR, you have thousands of routes available and everyone at both those camp grounds are climbers. HCR on a nice weather weekend will probably have 150+ climbers out there. Shelf is a good one as well.