Touchstone wall descent anchors

This past week I had the pleasure of climbing some beautiful routes in Zion. We were, however, shocked at the state of the anchors for the Touchstone descent gully. I know it is possible to rap the route, but we were under the impression that the gully was the standard descent. Either way, almost all of the anchors for this rappel route were total garbage, consisting of poor drilled pitons and antique bolts. I don't think that this appropriate to a trade route with frequent traffic, and am encouraging anyone with the knowledge to upgrade these with a modern bolt at the least. If no one gets around to it I'll do it myself, but don't know the next time I'll visit Zion.

A fatality waiting to happen: one star drive and a shitty drilled piton.

Looks like the tat is the weakest link to me! 

Welcome to zion!!

Kauait wrote:

Looks like the tat is the weakest link to me! 

Welcome to zion!!

The question is why does this exist? No one would tolerate this as a belay anchor on the route. I've climbed a fair bit in the desert and am no stranger to crap anchors, but there is no justification for just dismissing it as "welcome to Zion" when it is logistically, legally, and ethically straightforward to improve the anchor.

Garrett R. wrote:

The question is why does this exist? No one would tolerate this as a belay anchor on the route. I've climbed a fair bit in the desert and am no stranger to crap anchors, but there is no justification for just dismissing it as "welcome to Zion" when it is logistically, legally, and ethically straightforward to improve the anchor.

drilled angles seem to be standard...  Sure the drive-in sucks, but drilled angles can be quite bomber.  And you're only wrapping on it, not taking whippers... Could it be better?  Of course... Ifnyou feel passionately about it, go do it.  But can the entitled attitude of "Oh someone else should go fix this for me"...  Replace the tat and it appears to be an adequate anchor (at least from what I can see in the picture).

Stagg54 Taggart wrote:

drilled angles seem to be standard...  Sure the drive-in sucks, but drilled angles can be quite bomber.  And you're only wrapping on it, not taking whippers... Could it be better?  Of course... Ifnyou feel passionately about it, go do it.  But can the entitled attitude of "Oh someone else should go fix this for me"...  Replace the tat and it appears to be an adequate anchor (at least from what I can see in the picture).

As I stated in my first post, I'd happily replace it. However, I don't expect to return to the area for at least a year or two. And yes, drilled pitons can be good; this one isn't.

I felt true concern about the integrity of the anchor while rappeling. I don't want others to experience this (or worse), so I am taking steps to bring about change.

I don't understand the push back against advocating for reasonable modern anchors on a frequently utilized rappel route. If you don't want to replace it that's fine, but there are others who would.

Is that the anchor midway down the gully halfway down a larger rap? If so that anchor can be skipped if rapping with one rope which may explain why it's still there.

Yur gunna die

Garrett R. wrote:

As I stated in my first post, I'd happily replace it. However, I don't expect to return to the area for at least a year or two. And yes, drilled pitons can be good; this one isn't.

I felt true concern about the integrity of the anchor while rappeling. I don't want others to experience this (or worse), so I am taking steps to bring about change.

I don't understand the push back against advocating for reasonable modern anchors on a frequently utilized rappel route. If you don't want to replace it that's fine, but there are others who would.

Fair enough...   Perhaps I misinterpreted your original post and was a little too critical.

Pm me

I thought that that drilled angle was pretty good when I placed it after the 7th ascent in 1981 with Kevin Kelly.

If you want a third go ahead, but the comment about the tat rings true.

When it comes to using the chains on the lower route (the first in Zion) why must people add slings?
If they are too stupid to clip in with an eye to retreat they should not be up there.

I climbed Touchstone a few weeks ago. I rapped the route because I had read that the descent anchors were junk, and I don't know how (yet) to replace bolts. If there is anyone on this thread that knows how to replace bolts and wants a partner to get the job done, PM me. I would like to learn. 

I know most (if not all) of the on-route anchors were replaced with nice glue-ins (THANK YOU!). Does anyone know if the descent anchors were replaced?