RAPPING into 3rd pillar of Dana!?

9-17-17

Went to climb the 3rd pillar of Dana and arrived to a 5 person group, rapping in on the main route... There was a party at the base about to climb, and two more nearing the base to climb. The group of 5 still proceeded with the dangerous act of rapping in and leaving gear anchors at every station. Never have I seen this type of debauchery on an alpine route. For the record this not a professionally guided group from the best of my knowledge. 

What does everyone else think?

That sounds really lame and poor form on many levels.  Also, after leaving gear at each anchor what rack were they planning on climbing with? I guess they must have brought a bunch of extra gear between all five.  I recall one anchor set up being semi-marginal including a slung horn above the chimney too. Sounds like good booty for the other teams on the way up though yarr.  Either way doesn't sound like the best way to appreciate the awesome position and solitude of that route. 

I was the leader of the 3rd party at the base and ended up bailing after the 1st pitch because it was a clusterfuck up there. Found out a couple of guys in the big group had only been climbing for 6 months. Never have I wanted to get into a fist fight on an alpine"ish" climb especially after having to bail then go up the decent. Really bummed to see this kind of shit happen. Guess where they were from......... LA. 

Matt Kuehl wrote:

That sounds really lame and poor form on many levels...Sounds like good booty for the other teams on the way up though... 

Yes and yes.  Must've been scared of the descent gully?  

Did anyone talk to the group?  What did they have to say about it?

Rapping in on a feature like that isn't inherently a bad thing since you hike to the top first.  If someone established a separate rap line that didn't put others at the base in the line of fire, perhaps that would be safer for a trade route like the third pillar.  But rapping the actual route and building gear anchors on the way down is pretty strange and definitely sets up user conflicts.  

There are areas where rapping in is the standard, and it works out ok.  The Black Wall at Mt. Evans comes to mind.  Some routes at the Black Canyon.  But I don't think these routes see the same amount of traffic (multiple parties in a day).

I'm trying to wrap my very insignificant brain around "why?"  That descent is insignificant, easy and straightforward.  

Though the Third Pillar is in the Alpine, due to its short approach, it's subject to the kind of over popularized route shenanigans that you will hopefully never seen on a truly remote alpine climb. Still, rapping the route is rarely safer than a deproach and rapping on top of other parties carries the additional chance of inconveniencing and/or injuring someone. Seriously uncool. 

We are all guilty of making noob mistakes when we started climbing. Hopefully this experience will serve as guidance for them on future outings. 

The descent is so straight forward, even fun, so leaving a bunch of gear all over the route is an extremely odd decision to come to... The fact that the third party decided to bail because of this is pretty ridiculous. I guess that's what happens when you bring an entire crag crew to an alpine climb.

Did they at least realize their mistake?

boo wrote:

I'm trying to wrap my very insignificant brain around "why?"  That descent is insignificant, easy and straightforward.  

What about morning early season when there's still a lot of snow and/or ice in the gully? I sorta recall that was the rationalization for establishing the rap line. 

Marc801 C wrote:

What about morning early season when there's still a lot of snow and/or ice in the gully? I sorta recall that was the rationalization for establishing the rap line. 

but that wasn't the case..........

Climbin Symon wrote:

Guess where they were from......... LA. 

So were many of the Stonemasters.  Let's just say they were noobs with little to no judgment and call it good.  Honestly, someone who's only been climbing 6 mos. doesn't really have any business on that route unless you're getting hauled up it.  

BTW, someone mentioned an established rap route.  I don't believe there is one.  In any event, the descent is straightforward and unremarkable given the alpine setting.  It looks like the circus (or is it virus?) is migrating from Cathedral Peak.  

Marc801 C wrote:

What about morning early season when there's still a lot of snow and/or ice in the gully? I sorta recall that was the rationalization for establishing the rap line. 

Even then wouldn't it be more logical and safer to rappel the lower angle gully and set real alpine anchors down the gully as opposed to rappelling a much steeper and riskier face?

Dj3 wrote:

Even then wouldn't it be more logical and safer to rappel the lower angle gully and set real alpine anchors down the gully as opposed to rappelling a much steeper and riskier face?

lol

Climbin Symon wrote:

I was the leader of the 3rd party at the base and ended up bailing after the 1st pitch because it was a clusterfuck up there. Found out a couple of guys in the big group had only been climbing for 6 months. Never have I wanted to get into a fist fight on an alpine"ish" climb especially after having to bail then go up the decent. Really bummed to see this kind of shit happen. Guess where they were from......... LA. 

Glad someone else that was there that day found this! I'm sorry you also had to bail, I somehow bit my tongue when I was watching the last dork rap in. I'll be back though, hopefully it's quieter.... I won't be able to handle a scene like that again. Cheers symon 

Dj3 wrote:

Even then wouldn't it be more logical and safer to rappel the lower angle gully and set real alpine anchors down the gully as opposed to rappelling a much steeper and riskier face?

Nailed it.  haha

Fat Dad wrote:

So were many of the Stonemasters.  Let's just say they were noobs with little to no judgment and call it good.  Honestly, someone who's only been climbing 6 mos. doesn't really have any business on that route unless you're getting hauled up it.  

BTW, someone mentioned an established rap route.  I don't believe there is one.  In any event, the descent is straightforward and unremarkable given the alpine setting.  It looks like the circus (or is it virus?) is migrating from Cathedral Peak.  

Good call. Just get sick of LA noobs bringing the 405 freeway with them to the mountains. 

There's really nothing to say but they suck.

I mean, I've been up there with multiple parties, I think I would just climb through them or take that 5.10c variation or whatever it is that joins from the right. That's a bit of a hoof to get completely skunked.

Also, five of them? 

Sir mustard,

Yes 5..... with three parties already at or very close to the base, a real shitty move on their parts.  

boo wrote:

but that wasn't the case..........

Of course. I was responding much more generically about rapping instead of descending the gully and regarding the rumored existence of a rap line climber's left of the route. 

I totally agree about the rapping in over the route by a n00b party of 5 being a dick move.

Rappeling shenanigans aside, I don't see why a group of five can't show up to climb it. They'd probably split up into a group of two and a group of three, right?  Rapping in, though, seems inconsiderate.

FrankPS wrote:

Rappeling shenanigans aside, I don't see why a group of five can't show up to climb it. They'd probably split up into a group of two and a group of three, right? 

In a rational world - one where trump wasn't elected - yes, but these days that may be a lot of wishful thinking.

I can tell you about the time I encountered a party of 4. On the second pitch of a 5 pitch route. With a single 60M rope....

Climbing Symon didn't mention that the guys had been sleeping on the top so that when everyone else was hiking in they saw the guys on the top waking up and scrambling to rap in before anyone else could get down the gully. That's why it's totally messed up to me. Sleeping at the route and they still couldn't get their shit together enough to not cause a cluster fuck before everyone else walked in from their cars.