Going form 5.9 to 10D this season

Breaking into 5.10? Climb more, overthink less. No need for a training plan or manual.

As an aside: Bouldering and routes are different animals. You can't expect to translate ability and grades between the two if you don't actively devote yourself to both.

Gym bouldering has really skewed perception of true V grades for boulders (i.e. grade inflation out the wazoo). A true V4 can be found on notably cruxy 12- routes, and in my experience, a route rarely has a crux as difficult as the "equivalent" V grade.  

Ted Pinson wrote:

Yeah.  A V1 boulder problem will typically be very juggy, whereas a 10d might be vertical crimps.  There's also the sustain factor...I'd say you would want to be able to climbV2/V3 to be able to send 10d, as it's very different doing something 10' off the ground compared to 60'.

Sort of. A true V0 or V1 can be very thin -- again, there are growing misconceptions about difficulty thanks to the recent gym bouldering explosion. But you're correct in saying that a boulder problem off the ground feels easier than the same movement way up on a route.

I have rarely encountered anything remotely approaching a true V3 on a 5.10 route -- that is definite 5.11/5.12 territory.

BrianWS wrote:

Breaking into 5.10? Climb more, overthink less. No need for a training plan or manual.

As an aside: Bouldering and routes are different animals. You can't expect to translate ability and grades between the two if you don't actively devote yourself to both.

Gym bouldering has really skewed perception of true V grades for boulders (i.e. grade inflation out the wazoo). A true V4 can be found on notably cruxy 12- routes, and in my experience, a route rarely has a crux as difficult as the "equivalent" V grade.  

+1 on all points

I'd say hit the moonboard.

^^You're probably right Jake.  I guess what I meant was "it won't be a limiting factor."  He can do the route without losing weight, even if losing weight will admittedly make it MUCH easier.  What I try to avoid is giving myself excuses; "I can't send this today because I still need to lose X lbs, which isn't going to happen in the next 20 min."

Stephen C wrote:

This isn't true. Also, an actual V3 is harder than a 10d.

Absolutely.  My point was that you don't want V1 to be your limit if you're attempting similar moves on a route, because you have the rest of the route to climb as well.  If you can climb V3, V1 will probably feel relatively easy and will be less of a stopper if it's the crux near the top of your route.

BrianWS wrote:

Sort of. A true V0 or V1 can be very thin -- again, there are growing misconceptions about difficulty thanks to the recent gym bouldering explosion. But you're correct in saying that a boulder problem off the ground feels easier than the same movement way up on a route.

I have rarely encountered anything remotely approaching a true V3 on a 5.10 route -- that is definite 5.11/5.12 territory.

If I found myself doing V3 moves on a 5.10 climb, I would assume either 1) I'm botching the sequence, 2) I'm off route, or 3) it's ridiculously sandbagged.  My point was simply that you want to be able to pull harder moves bouldering than you would on route, because they will feel much harder when combined with the rest of the route.

Ted Pinson wrote:Absolutely.  My point was that you don't want V1 to be your limit if you're attempting similar moves on a route, because you have the rest of the route to climb as well.  If you can climb V3, V1 will probably feel relatively easy and will be less of a stopper if it's the crux near the top of your route.

I don't agree, but that's fine. We don't need to agree. I have friends to who climb at about the V10/11 level and also the 14- level. If I'm following your reasoning correctly this shouldn't be possible.

Anyway, bouldering grade conversions are probably irrelevant to the actual conversation. Going from 5.9 to 10d in a season is very possible. I think it just comes down to consistent climbing practice, basic fitness and work on optimal body composition, and outdoor experience. Even for climbing short boulders losing weight is very beneficial. A lot of people would be shocked how much better and stronger they feel after losing 5-10 lbs. And most people have 5-10 lbs they can lose.

Hey guys thanks for all the replies, I'm now super stoked to attack this goal.

Ive added my height to the OP, to summarize, I'm 5ft 10in and 200lbs.

No more fast(convenient) foods and I've started cycling to work, 5 miles each way.

As for the comment on pyramids, I've been trying to do the below workout 1x per week for the last month, its on top rope and I feel I climb way different on TR than I do when leading.:

4x     3x     2x     1x   Rest  1x       2x         3x      4x

5.8    5.9   10a  10b          10d/c  10c/b   10a   5.9

Lena chita wrote:

How long have you been climbing? And how many 5.9s have you actually sent? (yes, I clicked on your profile :) but I was a bit confused by notes such as "sent it, hung a little bit at the 4th bolt")

Lena, on this specific climb the area is pretty loose and chossy.  I was able to climb clean to the 4th bolt, there are several obvious holds that have big "x" on them.  I have to hang at the 4th bolt to figure out how to get around the loose section. once I got climbing again I was able to complete the climb clean.

In the past 6 months how many routes have you actually sent?
I haven't been roped climbing too much these past few month, been focusing on bouldering, ive gotten into the v2+/3- range, Indoors.

Have you actually tried this 5.10d yet?

I have not tried it, ive been afraid of leaving gear on the wall if I cant send it.  but I recently discovered the stick clip and will be using that to work my way up to the bolts to set up top rope on it.

Mike Womack wrote:

Agreed with Aleks here... Don't focus on losing weight or even creating plans - but instead just go out there and climb, climb, climb.  Hop on your project and see what it's like.  I bet you'll get it a lot faster than you think.  Let me know if you need a belayer - I need to get back out to NJC! Cool place for sure

Mike Ill definitely take you up on that offer.  I seem to have a tough time meeting climbing partners.  I really enjoy NJC, I haven't been to too many other climbing spots.  id be willing to meet you in the LA area for some climbing as well.

My biggest mental block is my GF is usually my belayer, I weigh about 70lbs more than her. in the past I have taken a fall and I pulled her into the the first bolt where she fractured her pointer and ring fingers. she did everything correctly for belaying but the weight difference sucked her into the bolt. the incident is always in my mind when I'm leading and it sucks. I  have gotten the Edilrige Ohm to try to help keep her safe and give me the mental relief but we haven't used it outdoors yet.

Stephen C wrote:

...And most people have 5-10 lbs they can lose.

climbing friend,

would you be saying I am quite fat?

Daniel T wrote:

Hey guys thanks for all the replies, I'm now super stoked to attack this goal.

Ive added my height to the OP, to summarize, I'm 5ft 10in and 200lbs.

No more fast(convenient) foods and I've started cycling to work, 5 miles each way.

As for the comment on pyramids, I've been trying to do the below workout 1x per week for the last month, its on top rope and I feel I climb way different on TR than I do when leading.:

4x     3x     2x     1x   Rest  1x       2x         3x      4x

5.8    5.9   10a  10b          10d/c  10c/b   10a   5.9.

You are doing all of this, and you are worried about getting on this climb?

It really sounds, after reading your reply, that your main issue is lack of mileage on real rock. And also, just to be clear on climbing terminology: Sending means climbing from start to finish cleanly, without hanging.

You can use the number of hangs as a metric of your progress (e.g. the first time you tried a route, you hung on every bolt, the second time you tried it you hung on 3rd and 6th, and the 3rd time you tried it you hung on the 4th. -- progress! Great! But not sending. : ) )

Daniel T wrote:

Hey guys thanks for all the replies, I'm now super stoked to attack this goal.

My biggest mental block is my GF is usually my belayer, I weigh about 70lbs more than her. in the past I have taken a fall and I pulled her into the the first bolt where she fractured her pointer and ring fingers. she did everything correctly for belaying but the weight difference sucked her into the bolt. the incident is always in my mind when I'm leading and it sucks. I  have gotten the Edilrige Ohm to try to help keep her safe and give me the mental relief but we haven't used it outdoors yet.

Oh, and regarding this: get an Ohm. Or get a heavier belayer. :)

Lena chita wrote:

Oh, and regarding this: get an Ohm. Or get a heavier belayer. :)

We just got an Ohm, used it a few times in the gym.

Im working on finding other partners but it appears no one like to climb with low leveled climbers, at least here in SoCal.

Lose weight and climb more. I'm a fatso like you and  going from 195 to 190 makes a huge difference. In the off chance you're not fat and just jacked, skip leg day, chest day and biceps day for the next 6 months...

Rather than focusing your diet on losing weight, you could focus instead on eating healthy food. Its actually surprising how big a difference on peak performance eating a healthy diet is. Everybody is different, but that is referring to whether someone needs more protein, less cheese etc. Processed food including white sugar and flour are worthless for everyone, they have very little nutrient value. Try eating less of them, and instead add more veggies and whole grains. Eating rice for dinner? Make it brown rice etc etc. A lot of diets that help wieght loss are very hard on the body, and if you are trying to push your athletic limits would be a big hinderance

If you don't want to read or figure out your own training program, this is the least amount of mental effort you can put into training. Just follow the plan. 3 days per week about 2-3 hour sessions. Worked well for me. $15 per month, but you can try it out for 2 weeks for free, so there's nothing to lose. 

https://www.trainingbeta.com/route-climbing-training-program/ 

climbing friend,

quit your filthy toproping like the baby! unless you do climb the R or X route. it is a good way to make yourownself a weaker and less bold climber, all the while pretending like it has a neutral effect or no effect instead of the unparalleled  be-wussening it imposes upon you.

if you are no longer deathly and paralyzingly scared of hucking your meat into space, you for probable would climb the 5.11 by now

Yeah, I would definitely try to replace most if not all of your gym toproping with leading.  I noticed the biggest difference in my climbing when a dedicated climbing gym opened near me and I was able to do this.  Unless you're content to toprope your project (no shame there, honesty), you're going to want to build up your lead head so that the way you climb on lead is roughly the same as on toprope.  If your gf is too light to safely belay you where falls are expected, get an Ohm or climb with other people.  Maybe find another couple in a similar situation (this is super common) and pair up partners based on weight.

Not to be a negative asshole, but your current plan ain't gonna cut it. It's way too complicated, and unessecarily so. 

Get. Out. Doors.

Gym routes may help with endurance and basic technique, but it's nothing compared to real mileage on real rock. Avoid easy 5.9 jug hauls and focus on technical routes if your gym offers them. It also sounds like your lead game is compromised by fear. Solution? Lead more, TR and Boulder less.

A 70 pound difference is big, but that's what a stick clip and COMPETENT belay are for. And yes, 200 lbs at five foot ten leaves lots of room for weight loss.

My biggest mental block is my GF is usually my belayer, I weigh about 70lbs more than her. in the past I have taken a fall and I pulled her into the the first bolt where she fractured her pointer and ring fingers. she did everything correctly for belaying but the weight difference sucked her into the bolt. the incident is always in my mind when I'm leading and it sucks. I  have gotten the Edilrige Ohm to try to help keep her safe and give me the mental relief but we haven't used it outdoors yet.

If she broke fingers belaying, she was in fact doing it wrong. My guess is that her feeding hand (left) got sucked into the bolt because she was over gripping with it. Get her on a grigri if she isn't already and learn the device well.

Listen to Aleks Zebastian! He's giving the best advice in this thread, strangely enough. I don't think you need a true 'training' routine, just need to keep climbing consistently, 2-3 times a week ideally, and you'll get there. If your goal is to lead Espresso, try to find routes that climb similarly to this route (short and vertical, it looks like?) and get a bunch of mileage leading routes with a similar style. If your goal is to be a 10+ climber, just get as much mileage as you can on anything and everything. Get outside if you can. Climbing is the best training for climbing :)