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I want to learn trad climbing
Old lady H wrote: Valid points and I totally agree...BUT I work from home. Though the stoke is high, if I turn around (literally!) and start fiddling with climbing gear, my day will have gone by and I won't have gotten much done. I probably spend too much time on MP as is :)
Nice! I will be practicing the same. Last bit I'm waiting on is my gear sling. I keep telling myself no more gear (for now) and somehow keep finding myself on the for sale forum.... |
Old lady H wrote: I think all climbers go out on a lot of first dates. MP has its own Tinder page devoted to it. Personally, I'm at a stage where many of my favorite and most trusted partners are fading from the scene with age-related infirmities, so to a growing extent it is first dates or no dates for me. The second date piece was, of course, born of the experience of various first dates, and it addressed a particular situation I'd experienced that struck me as fairly universal, which is a gym climber who is already pretty proficient indoors, perhaps with single-pitch outdoor sport experience as well, wants to go on a trad outing, and turns out to be not much fun to be with simply because they don't understand the basic routines. As a superannuated old fart with declining abilities, I'm not exactly prime date material myself. I'm typically looking for a nice moderate day without major hassles or epics and a decent level of shared common ground, whatever that actually means. But like King Tut, my successes in the climbing world (such as they were) were achieved only because of the help and advice of people who were willing to tolerate a noob and help them along the way, so in my twilight years I feel some responsibility to repay that debt by passing on whatever wisdom I've acquired, together with, I hope, an attitude to take that advice with a grain of salt and take other views into account before making one's own decisions. |
M. Morley wrote: Perhaps I'd be able to join you fellas as well, if that wouldn't be too much to ask. I have a feeling that I've seen you around PW one time or another. |
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Go get it. |
rgold wrote: Sir, I'll not hitch hike to do so, but this semi superannuated noob would move heaven and Earth to score a "date" with you! What a ridiculously nice group on this thread! I might have a chance to climb with two of you, but, all of you? If you are in Boise and feeling brave, ya got all the catches you want. You have to drive though. No car. :-( I love this thread! Best, Helen |
Old lady H wrote: Helen, agreed, great thread started by an 18yo and the community jumped in (with no snark!) I got into climbing as part of my mid-life "crisis" through working with my son's boy scout troop. My "strongest" days are behind me, but I'm not into bouldering as much and happily, climbing can be much more about movement and balance than power. Happy to climb with you anytime - for now, work, kids, and scouts keep me locked into my local crags (no time to travel). Cheers, E |
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A few mentions of Pipeworks on this thread so I created this other thread - https://www.mountainproject.com/forum/topic/112941176/partners-at-pipeworks Take a look if you're looking for some lead partners at PW, or if you're interested in leading and want to follow some routes and then have someone to take the lead test with. |
Anonymous wrote: I think we are starting a new thread here... https://www.mountainproject.com/forum/topic/112941624/flags-that-climbing-is-your-mid-life-crisis 1) when are are closer in age to the experienced guide than your fellow students 2) you have more equipment than time (also called a poser/gumby/etc) 3) your wife is happy that you have life insurance; and lets you climb with strangers 4) people ask you for advice, when in fact they are more experienced than you 5) your co-workers gasp and say "don't hurt yourself!" |
Old lady H wrote: I too have been enjoying this thread H. I'm now officially on my "last set" of mentorees, my youngest son (22) and his bride (25). When they are both solid (my concept of solid) at leading 5.10 old school Okie trad I feel my work shall be done. For me, teaching new people to climb has always been a pleasure. The first (and hardest) thing to impart is how to slow down, focus on the climbing, pace yourself and rest often. The second, to enjoy where you are and what you are doing. Third, how to think your way through tough spots and keep a cool head. The look on someone's face when they "get it" is priceless. Sometimes it happens at a hanging belay on a two inch ledge. Some things you just can't get at the "McClimbingGym" At 53 (nearly 54) I'm in the same boat as Richard, "a little old for the prom." Of the four guys I climbed with the most in my youth, three are dead and the last doesn't climb anymore, (though he does make occasional noises like he might start again at any moment). It's pretty cool standing on a ledge or at the top of a wall, looking around with 39 years of memories to pull from, along with the new ones being made. Sometimes I swear I hear those guys saying something when the wind blows just right..........then a boy scout goes "Mr. Barritt! Is this tied right?" I'm "juiced" that these youngsters are going to get the opportunity to learn from some old masters, we're a dying (and retiring) breed ;)
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Here is a link to an excellent video by DMM that shows the forces on an anchor in FF1 and FF2 scenarios. Note especially at the very end where the superiority of the Rope for constructing the anchor is made clear: |
King Tut wrote: Interesting. I'd seen that video before, but had forgotten the results. I suspect we will be building our belays out of rope, where possible. |
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Ok, me and Jake, Eric and Abdullah are headed to Lovers Leap on Wed. Trip report to follow. :) |
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That's great, Tut! All, I very recently had the great pleasure of climbing with M. Morley! Any of you who had a tentative offer with him, jump on it. Super good, and more important, super good guy. Climbing was fun, the long lunch just shooting the breeze was even more fun. I truly love climbing, but a huge part of that is hanging with people like all of you. Thanks again, Mike, and the rest of you too. Any of you ever wander through Boise... Best, Helen |
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We went climbing today! To start off, thanks John for being so generous with your time! We all learned a lot, and look forward to putting it to use in the near future. All participants were really easy going, focused, and generally cool to hang out with. We did laps on the first pitch of Surrealistic Pillar learning from John's placements. After that, we took shots at TR on the Direct start variation (Abdullah figured it out). We ran out of time to hit the more classic multi pitch routes, but plan on returning for more. Great day with great guys. |
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There is still hope for the world. |
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Wonderful day climbing, can't thank the guys enough. As Eric said, a cool group, all motivated to learn, which made the trip supper smooth. A truly amazing learning opportunity and a talented group of climbers. Cant wait to climb more with these guys (especially trad) as they truly demonstrate what the climbing community should strive to be! Thanks again John, Eric, and Abdullah!!! |
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Hey guys, super fun and beautiful day at the leap. Thanks to all for making it happen. Maybe less climbing than we hoped (party of 4 a little unwieldy) but a lot of anchor building and discussing of concepts. We were discussing "impact force" on a modern climbing rope and I did a little reading. This is a measure of the elasticity of a climbing rope and (if the rope is new) represents the max force generated by the rope in a UIAA test fall (~FF2). Ultra severe fall very rare in actual climbing. The max allowable by the UIAA is <12kn with most ropes in the 7-10 range. Came across this excellent link on the Petzl site that has some useful graphics and videos of various falls up to a pretty nasty FF1: Note that the max impact force generated by the rope in that situation is only 6KN and even humble and small wired nuts (ie BD #4-5) can hold 6KN. A fully equalized anchor of 3 could theoretically hold ~18KN or ~4000 lbs....3 times forces generated but we have to be careful to manage upward forces with one or more pieces (see video for how the most force on the belay in this situation is upward). A perfect Cam in a perfect 2" crack can hold 14KN (~3000 lbs)....fully equalized with 3 cams and it will theoretically hold ~9000 lbs (neglecting other factors for the sake of discussion).....literally 6 times what even a very nasty fall would produce...we like cams. :) Again the upward force is very important to manage. I should have talked about this more but if a severe lead fall really is possible 2 pieces (or more) for upward pull may be indicated on multi-pitch routes. This is why bolts are useful as directionally they are very sound. Some will say that every anchor should be built for the case of any kind of severe lead fall but reality is that no one places 2-3 cams for upward load and 2-3 cams for downward load at every anchor on a traditional route with all gear anchors. You have to use judgment and experience to know when that severe lead is coming up and build your anchors accordingly. Otherwise you will never get up anything in a timely fashion (to avoid all the hazards of being slow). Digest the numbers briefly but the take home message: Your anchor will essentially never fail when you are getting ideal placements and have directional stability. Get ideal placements. |
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Big thanks to Jake for initiating, Eric for driving and especially John for taking time out to teach us! I had a wonderful time and am already itching to get back out there. I spent the rest of my evening looking up videos of people climbing on Surrealistic Pillar :) My big takeaways:
Looking forward to getting back out there with you guys! |
Tomily ma wrote: :-) Agreed. Gents, there is a second apprenticeship shaping up from this thread. Lucky people, I'm jealous! Nice job, Tut, et al! Best, OLH |
Abdullah Mourad wrote: Abdullah, just my two cents, but the only way to avoid "ever" in climbing, is to not climb. Keep that in mind, and aim for "never", but consider how to mitigate the consequences if/when "it" happens, whatever the "it". Glad this went so well! I am truly happy for all of you. Best, OLH |
