Half Dome hike, spring break

FrankPS wrote:Rough crowd. Though I can see how the "not a run of the mill tourist" set it off.

"Run of the mill" Yosemite tourist gets lost on the Yosemite Falls trail and feeds the deer.

I think the original question was legit. You definitely could have done Half Dome this time last year.

Everyone's an expert. Yet most have probably not been up the cables preseason. I'd understand the piling on if he was a California local. But he's not.

Here's the only answer any of us can give without being up there: If it wasn't a high snow year it would probably be fine depending on recent storms. This year it is unlikely to be doable/safe at this time.

Perhaps people that have sacrificed a day of their lives to rescue an overzealous hiker/tourist or other gumbie who's ambition is far greater than their experience and therefore become a danger to themselves and others might be what set some off.

DanielHart wrote:Perhaps people that have sacrificed a day of their lives to rescue an overzealous hiker/tourist or other gumbie who's ambition is far greater than their experience and therefore become a danger to themselves and others might be what set some off.

It's just a pet peeve of mine when climbers don't think they're tourists, or average tourists, or denigrate other tourists.

AndrewArroz wrote: "Run of the mill" Yosemite tourist gets lost on the Yosemite Falls trail and feeds the deer. I think the original question was legit. You definitely could have done Half Dome this time last year.

How is it legit when you are planning an ascent of a 9000' peak in March and have no clue what the snow conditions in the back country are 10 miles from the trailhead?

Last year there was something like 15% of normal snow pack. One of the worst winters for precipitation in over 50 years.

This year there is 200% of normal snow pack. Which happens about every 5-7 years.

To look that up first is hiking 101 unless you are a newbie to the back country in March and (seeing as it is warm today) think winter is over.

Look, as above us crusty AF old dads may come across as dicks, but half of it is just having fun with so much snow, the other is **truly legit** wonder that anyone is so out of touch with what kind of snow is on the ground right now that this question would be posed. Classic no clue as to what is up in the Sierra that get record amounts of snow in normal years, let alone this one, and its still WINTER.

This is the sort of year that will have skiing in Ellery Bowl and Mammoth on the 4th of July and most resorts will close after Memorial Day...because people are sick of skiing, not that there isn't STILL snow to ski.

Rob Gordon wrote:Everyone's an expert. Yet most have probably not been up the cables preseason. I'd understand the piling on if he was a California local. But he's not. Here's the only answer any of us can give without being up there: If it wasn't a high snow year it would probably be fine depending on recent storms. This year it is unlikely to be doable/safe at this time.

No dude, in any kind normal winter it is very, very rare to be up the cables this early if ever done when there is clearly a huge amount of snow up there. Early in a dry year is May...

This is the link that also has a Badger Pass webcam. This is where you would start skiing the 10 miles to the cables right now:

nps.gov/yose/learn/photosmu…

One (dry) year I heard of people trying Snake Dike early...and found the little rivulets of water were frozen ice and had to bail. The cables face East and will be wetter than Snake Dike facing WWS.

But you're right, I have never been up the cables whether they are or are not raised. Been down them 3 times though. :P

King Tut wrote: How is it legit when you are planning an ascent of a 9000' peak in March and have no clue what the snow conditions in the back country are 10 miles from the trailhead?

Not legit would be assuming it's good to go and launching the mission. Dude was just asked a question. We helped him find out what he needed to know. I'm sure I've asked a lot of questions people thought were stupid. But it's not like I'm pointing a bullhorn at anyone's ear.

You're right about being stoked about all the snow. Planning some spring skiing at Mammoth as we speak!

King Tut wrote: Classic no clue as to what is up in the Sierra that get record amounts of snow in normal years, let alone this one, and its still WINTER.

That's why he asked - I don't think people should be given a hard time for seeking legitimate information.

C Brooks wrote: That's why he asked - I don't think people should be given a hard time for seeking legitimate information.

We can go round and round but it really wasn't mean spirited.

Fundamentally, knowing how to find out for yourself what backcountry conditions are is simple, and to not be up to speed at this late date that CA has had an epic winter with an upcoming trip planned is a little newbie-like.

Don't spoil our old crusty dad fun. :)

Conrad Malinak wrote:Kind of interesting to have a couple guys take a dig at me for something like that.

Welcome to mountain proj

Being crusty is as lame as being a noob.

I do stand corrected about how early Half Dome clears. I thought I went up Snake Dike on May 4th when in reality it was May 27th. So yeah. It is a bit early even without high snow... but once again... how the hell would he know if he's not local? Last year it would have been fine probably.

I remember people trying to scare us off before we did it. Saying the cables would be covered and avalanches... we dragged up an extra rope in case we had to bail. Fucking pain in the ass for no real reason. Other than a medium sized snowfield on top it was absolutely fine.

You don't want to rescue people? Don't join search and rescue. And maybe give friendly advice so people don't just not ask for advice because they don't want to get made fun of and then just try their plan anyway.

Rob Gordon wrote:how the hell would he know if he's not local? Last year it would have been fine probably. I remember people trying to scare us off before we did it. Saying the cables would be covered and avalanches... we dragged up an extra rope in case we had to bail. Fucking pain in the ass for no real reason. yourOther than a medium sized snowfield on top it was absolutely fine.

What you're saying is that other people won't necessarily give good advice, so go find out for yourself. Even locals won't know the conditions on Half Dome unless they've done it recently.

If I were the OP, I'd pack up my gear and go as far as I could until I felt unsafe. Use your best judgement.

FrankPS wrote: What you're saying is that other people won't necessarily give good advice, so go find out for yourself. Even locals won't know the conditions on Half Dome unless they've done it recently. If I were the OP, I'd pack up my gear and go as far as I could until I felt unsafe. Use your best judgement.

Um, look guy...I think this is pretty damn bad advice.

Did you read the things I have posted? Seen the web cams of the snow?

Mist Trail and Illouette Trail are closed due to snow and ice in the Merced River Canyon. Even if he went around the closed gates he would get soaked from the runoff by 33 degree water and need an ice axe and crampons...so you would get to the base after 7-8 miles soaking wet and possibly hypothermic with everything you own soaked.

Skiing from Badger pass on 10-20 feet of snow to the base of the cables is the other alternative. At LEAST 10 miles maybe more from badger pass one way.

The Base of the Cables is a sunny spot....but that means there are only feet(s) of snow there with continuous run-off that freezes every night on the slabs.

This idea that "no one knows" belies the fact that people with years of experience in Yosemite and many trans-sierra back country trips on skiis done in the past know that this has been a record year with record snowfall and more coming. This is something the very experienced in back country skiing would love to do (ski to the base of the cables) in a 2-3 day trip with full kit for a normal fit backcountry skier.

Going up the cables in these conditions is not remotely recommended by anyone that knows what conditions are currently between 8-9000' (literally 10 feet in the sunny spots, 20-30' in the north facing ones) and that is well know to all experienced back country skiers that are still active or current or former residents of the Park with back country in winter experience.

Can the cables be done or not by someone totally prepared and experienced once you get there? That is the only bit that is in question, but in my estimation it would be exceptionally fool hardy. Something about trusting icy stainless cables on a slab running with ice water just doesn't appeal.

This is not remotely like doing it in late May after a dry year right before the cables are put up.

I really don't think anyone who knows the area like people who have lived there is going to send any newbie up there that doesn't even know there is an enormous amount of snow to deal with and has no gear for dealing with the Sierra Backcountry in essentially full Winter conditions and then suggest he should head up 1000' of cables on a 45 degree slope with is gf.

How about you give it a try before recommending it to someone?

Do you have back country experience in the Sierra this time of year after a record snowfall?

Have you ever taken an avalanche rescue course? Do you own avalanche beacons? Avalanche probes? Full back country kit for winter in the Sierra?

Yea dude, its still winter.

King Tut wrote: Um, look guy...I think this is pretty damn bad advice. Did you read the things I have posted? Seen the web cams of the snow? Mist Trail and Illouette Trail are closed due to snow and ice in the Merced River Canyon. Even if he went around the closed gates he would get soaked from the runoff by 33 degree water and need an ice axe and crampons...so you would get to the base after 7-8 miles soaking wet and possibly hypothermic with everything you own soaked. Skiing from Badger pass on 10-20 feet of snow to the base of the cables is the other alternative. At LEAST 10 miles maybe more from badger pass one way. The Base of the Cables is a sunny spot....but that means there are only feet(s) of snow there with continuous run-off that freezes every night on the slabs. This idea that "no one knows" belies the fact that people with years of experience in Yosemite and many trans-sierra back country trips on skiis done in the past know that this has been a record year with record snowfall and more coming. This is something the very experienced in back country skiing would love to do (ski to the base of the cables) in a 2-3 day trip with full kit for a normal fit backcountry skier. Going up the cables in these conditions is not remotely recommended by anyone that knows what conditions are currently between 8-9000' (literally 10 feet in the sunny spots, 20-30' in the north facing ones) and that is well know to all experienced back country skiers that are still active or current or former residents of the Park with back country in winter experience. Can the cables be done or not by someone totally prepared and experienced once you get there? That is the only bit that is in question, but in my estimation it would be exceptionally fool hardy. Something about trusting icy stainless cables on a slab running with ice water just doesn't appeal. This is not remotely like doing it in late May after a dry year right before the cables are put up. I really don't think anyone who knows the area like people who have lived there is going to send any newbie up there that doesn't even know there is an enormous amount of snow to deal with and has no gear for dealing with the Sierra Backcountry in essentially full Winter conditions and then suggest he should head up 1000' of cables on a 45 degree slope with is gf. How about you give it a try before recommending it to someone? Do you have back country experience in the Sierra this time of year after a record snowfall? Have you ever taken an avalanche rescue course? Do you own avalanche beacons? Avalanche probes? Full back country kit for winter in the Sierra? Yea dude, its still winter.

Snow camping and hiking is not impossible or dangerous if you know what you're doing. Hiking and camping in the snow can be fun and beautiful. I didn't recommend going around any closed gates or violating any rules or closures. I also didn't recommend going up the cable route, but to "use your best judgement."

FrankPS wrote: Snow camping and hiking is not impossible or dangerous if you know what you're doing. Hiking and camping in the snow can be fun and beautiful. I didn't recommend going around any closed gates or violating any rules or closures. I also didn't recommend going up the cable route, but to "use your best judgement."

The other complicating aspect of hiking HD in current conditions is the need for avalanche knowledge on most of the approach.

^^^^

Yep, that's part of snow travel.

Images of the cables on 5/21/11 an average snow year:

Compared to web cam today:



Point being, that amount of snow in the first images is 2-months from now in an average year. This year, being 200% of normal and the OP was planning on going next week should set off alarm bells for most people as in "ur gonna die" amounts of snow.

:)

King Tut wrote:

Snake Dike ski run!

I was at the Glacier Point Hut last weekend - there was a lot of old snow, and by now a few inches of new snow. Personally I would not venture up Half Dome at this time.