Best sport and trad shoes for wide feet

OK, here's an update.

This is my second to last post on this topic.

The last post will be when I actually receive the shoes, and I have wore them for a while. A review.

So I went to my local climbing gym and checked out the Butora Altura shoes they were demoing. They were awesome!

I had done a lot of previous research and reading in regards to these shoes. Seems that the rubber adhesion process is much better than that of the TC Pro, and they do not delaminates like the latter. The Altura's also use premium German leather (good Cow...nice Cow...we love you and treat you well, Mr Cow), and they are also not as "flat," which adds to the all day comfort.

Being that I am predominantly a boulderer, and that I am used to the tight fit of my 30-minute-max bouldering shoes, I contacted Butora beforehand, and asked for recommendations on the fitting of the shoes. (Super tight, tight, snug, or relaxed fit).

So with the intention of purchasing an all-day trad/crack climbing shoe, FOR COMFORT, I tried-on a full size larger than my street shoe size. I wear a size 7 street shoe, so I tried-on a Men's size 8.

Their suggestion was perfect. Spot on. (For me).

Compared to my bouldering shoes, these are a totally foreign fit.

But here's my specific situation. My right foot is longer than my left foot.

So if I were to wear a comfortable size 8 on my left foot, my left foot would be perfect. But the snugness on the right foot would take away from the all-day comfort to my right foot.

And when I wore an 8.5 on my right foot...it was perfect. But now the shoe on my left foot was too large.

That half-size (depending if I went with a size 8, or a size 8.5) was enough to make either one shoe too tight, or one shoe too lose.

But during the demo, I put-on a size 8 on my left foot, and a size 8.5 on my right foo...and absolute Nirvana. My perfect all day climbing companions.

So now that I knew, 100%, what size shoes I needed...I went home and contacted Butora.

Theresa and Taylor from Butora were awesome.

I ordered my Altura's on the spot.

Left shoe = 8.
Right shoe = 8.5.

I got the demo price, and I received free shipping.

It cost a few extra shekels to order a different size shoe per foot. But paying a few extra shekels is a small price to pay for a perfect fit!

Bottom line, I'm waiting on them to arrive.

Attached is a photo of me wearing a pair at the demo at my home gym. I'll also attach a photo of my wide barefoot dogs. The right foot is a smidgen longer than my left foot. And on top of that, it has a beauty-mark on the big toe from wearing tight bouldering shoes. The latter made a difference in the shoe sizing.

Anyhoo...looking forward to my early CHRISTmas present.

More later.

Thanks again, folks.

In Christ: Raymond.

That's so awesome that they were able to give you specific sizes for each foot, props to Butora!

Would you mind measuring the width of those shoes? I'm thinking of trying these along with some Astromans and Pinks..

How is the stiffness? I'm curious about where it bends at the ball of the foot mostly.. I have an injury at my big toe joint so the stiffer the better for me.

Glen Prior wrote:I wear 42.5 2E. Medium arch. Astroman fit well, but wore out quickly. Scarpa TechnoX are my go to shoe, and they have stretched to fit perfectly.

I hope you tip your ski boot fitter well....

O-Tay, folks...here are my parting thoughts on the Butora Altura (wide) shoes.

I've been climbing with them every time I go sport climbing. Both indoor and outdoor.

The very first time I used them was outdoor climbing on super smooth rock. It was also chilly cold that morning. And since the shoes were brand new (not broken in) and stiff from the cold, they were not "all that" on my first climb. But I did notice that the laced fit was excellent, and the stiffness was great. (Very different from my Evolv Shaman bouldering shoes).

As the day progressed and they started to warm-up and break-in. They started feeling a bit less stiff, and the traction got better. My first day using them.

Afterwards, I started using them for indoor TR and lead climbing. It took a little while getting used to them, as I have always worn the Evolv Shamans for indoors climbing as well. But in the end, the Butora's were awesome.

The traction is great, and I cannot recall ever slipping off a "no shadow" foothold with them. Mind you, they are NOT the super softest rubber...so do not expect fantabulous stickiness from them. But with decent footwork, you will be solid.

The edging is also great. Actually inspiring, compared to my bouldering shoes. So they are great for TR. Between the good edging, and the great lace-up fit, it helped improve my TR and Lead Climbing-Fu.

I have also used them for indoor bouldering. And...well...they are not bouldering shoes. So do not purchase them for bouldering.

I also tried crack climbing with them, but since I am so new to crack climbing, I cannot really comment on the shoe here...other than to say they are holding-up well after being jammed in cracks and twisted to high heaven. Might I also mention, that they also absorbe blood nicely. :)

A funny thought. I use the Black Diamond Ozone harness. And for those of y'all familiar with it, it is NOT the yellow color you see on the web photos. The BD Ozone harness is actually a light neon-green/yellow color.

Anyhoo...the Butora Altura (wides) are very similar in color to my harness. I didn't notice this until my climbing pardner pointed it out to me. I guess folks that don't know me will see me in matching harness and shoes, and consider me superficial. Ha ha ha. Guess I gotta get more blood on my shoes. :)

One of the readers (Carla) mentioned she wanted some measurements of the sole widths. I'll attach a few pictures with this thread. She also wanted to know where, exactly, the shoes gave way and bent. So I just placed a shoe on its heel (facing upward), and compressed it from the top. I am assuming this will give you readers an idea where it flexes.

So to end, thanks again for the tips and hints. The shoes are awesome, and the Butora folks were excellent to work with.

And as a reminder, the right shoe was ordered as an US 8.5. And the left shoe is an US 8.

Have a prosperous, and stimulating 2017.

Crush those ticks!!

In Christ: Raymond.

"I hope you tip your ski boot fitter well...." That's the truth brotha. Bring him a case of beer at the start of every ski season.Now he fits my kids as well, so I've been bringing him a decent single-malt at Christmas. A good boot-fitter is an essential, skilled craftsman in my life. In most sports, the feet are the critical interface.

Awesome! Thanks for all the details! I'm definitely going to order a pair of these and try them out.

Happy new year!

So...on the same topic....any suggestions on a good climbing shoe for WOMEN with big wide feet??

Kinda a long story so I'll put a TLDL at the bottom.

So the kidlet and I were looking for new climbing shoes instead of continuing to rent. The recommendation for her was to go to Evolv down in Buena Park (about 5 mins away from grandma) and get a few pairs from the closeout bin so she can grow and I won't be out a ton of money. Since she just grew out of two pairs of school schools in half the school year, this was sound advice.

I go to REI, where we are getting our harnesses and start looking for shoes for me. I'm a size 10 wide in women's. Depending on the shoe, I can fit into a 9 1/2 wide to a 10 medium. But on average I fall into a 10W with my widest part at the ball of my foot.

REI Northridge did not have a single climbing shoe for women in stock over a size 9. We finally got me into a technical mens size 11, but I kept having issues with the shoe hitting (and rubbing) my Achilles tendon. And after an hour of Grimms Cinderella, the suggestion was to go to Evolv (since I was going there anyways) and see what they had for me.

We go, most of the shoes are on closeout to make room for new shoes. Fantastic, I get cheap shoes. But I still wanted to try a more technical shoe instead of the flatter climbing ones. I felt that maybe having a shoe with more toe would help my confidence on smaller foot holds.

Another repetition of Grimms.....and I'm starting to despair, until I pick up the kidlet's size 9 1/2 women's flat shoe and manage to get my foot into it. I swear choirs of angels started to sing. It wasn't my foot, I kept trying to get my foot into the wrong type of shoe. And damn my 13 year-old girl has big feet.

We both ended up leaving with Electra's. Mine is a woman's 10, lace up style (only 10 they had) and she with a few pairs of Electras and 1 Defys.

I still want a pair of more technical shoes that has a bit of a wide toe box.....So suggestions???? The Electra's I got were size 10 womens, or 41.5

TLDR: I have big wide feet with an achilles tendon that gets irritated by the higher back of men's shoes so I need a women's shoes. I am a size 41.5 and want to find a more technical shoe that has a wider toe box to fit my mini snowboards into. Suggestions anyone?

What do you mean by "technical"?

Or better yet, what type of climbing do you do? Bouldering, lead, trad, crack, etc. Predominantly indoor, outdoor...or evenly both.

I know that in some shoes it irritates my Achilles' tendon with the high backs of certain shoes. But it is usually when the shoes are still new and stiff. Nothing a little climbers tape or moleskin on the Achilles' tendon will not fix. After a few days of breaking in, I don't need the tape any longer.

Seems you are on the right track though. From what I understand, you can wear either a men's or women's shoe. They are unisex. Women's shoes are just build for smaller, narrower, feet.

And if you are a man with smaller and narrower feet, or a woman with fuller and larger feet...

But if we knew what type of climbing you do, maybe we could recommend a wider shoe for that type of climbing.

In Christ: Raymond

.

For what it is worth...I have very wide dogs and have been strapping them into climbing shoes of all sorts for almost 45 years. After wearing all manner of shoes, perhaps 50 pairs and at least 25 types . I think the secret is to stretch them to fit. I do this by going to the climbing gym and wearing them into a hot shower and then climbing in them until I can't stand it, take a break and climb again. If they still are not stretched out, you can repeat the procedure another time. Canvas lined shoes take the longest to stretch out, natural leather stretch the fastest.

Nyte Knight wrote: TLDR: I have big wide feet with an achilles tendon that gets irritated by the higher back of men's shoes so I need a women's shoes. I am a size 41.5 and want to find a more technical shoe that has a wider toe box to fit my mini snowboards into. Suggestions anyone?

The ankle topline/collar heights aren't going to change on a women's shoe that is the same size as a men's. The volume ratios between the ball of the foot and the heel is the #1 thing that changes on a women's shoe.

Get mens shoes then mod the ankle randing mountainproject.com/v/modif…

Those are a few good ways to try. You can also just score the rand, not cut all the way through. Progressively putting more or deeper scores into the rand lets you find the sweet spot of having enough tension but easing off that pressure.

Also if you have another option other than REI for shoes do it. Never been impressed there with a fitting or what I've overheard

My 5.10 Anasazi shoes work fine for my foot jam and multipitch crimbing.

Raymond Moreno wrote:What do you mean by "technical"? Or better yet, what type of climbing do you do? Bouldering, lead, trad, crack, etc. Predominantly indoor, outdoor...or evenly both. I know that in some shoes it irritates my Achilles' tendon with the high backs of certain shoes. But it is usually when the shoes are still new and stiff. Nothing a little climbers tape or moleskin on the Achilles' tendon will not fix. After a few days of breaking in, I don't need the tape any longer. Seems you are on the right track though. From what I understand, you can wear either a men's or women's shoe. They are unisex. Women's shoes are just build for smaller, narrower, feet. And if you are a man with smaller and narrower feet, or a woman with fuller and larger feet... But if we knew what type of climbing you do, maybe we could recommend a wider shoe for that type of climbing. In Christ: Raymond .

ok so now that I'm not suffering from a 5+ day migraine, I can sit at a computer and answer...

I guess what I mean by technical refers to the curve of the shoe's arch. REI has them listed as Neutral, Moderate and Aggressive. Right now I'm wearing a flat neutral shoe. Right now, I am doing indoor top roping with eventually wanting to get into outdoor sport climbing (clips right? not anchor placing?). I don't feel confident about smaller foot placements. I like to be able to put my arch and ball on a hold and not support myself by my toe. So I feel a shoe that curves and has more toe support may help with that confidence. I don't feel secure so I'm not trusting this tiny wall chip to support my body weight and I'm afraid to climb higher...

The problem...well 1 problem, is the more downward pointed toes are too blasted small. Basically even a size 11 in mens required me shoving my foot in. I don't have the issue with the flatter shoes. Can't stretch them out if I can't get my foot into. I've been told by the saleman at Evolve that they are sized a bit differently and the more "technical" the shoe is, the smaller the sizes run.

As for the achilles tendon, mine is very pronounced. I have plantar faciitis in both feet from tight leg muscles, stemming from a back and hip displacement/twisting. It's not just rubbing, I know how to deal with rubbing. I have boots that rub. This is a sharp digging and pressing. In women's shoes, besides being made for a more "petite" foot, the heels are a bit lower in the back. I really need the lower heel rise.

Right now I have a pair of beginner shoes and they are very comfy. I've yet to climb with them (migraine, bad allergies and christmas) but I think once I break them in, I'll be very happy with them. I'm just looking for other options for when I want a new pair, or a pair better suited to different climbing. I want to know that I'm not just stuck with one particular type because I simply have big snowboards for feet.

Bazerker wrote:For what it is worth...I have very wide dogs and have been strapping them into climbing shoes of all sorts for almost 45 years. After wearing all manner of shoes, perhaps 50 pairs and at least 25 types . I think the secret is to stretch them to fit. I do this by going to the climbing gym and wearing them into a hot shower and then climbing in them until I can't stand it, take a break and climb again. If they still are not stretched out, you can repeat the procedure another time. Canvas lined shoes take the longest to stretch out, natural leather stretch the fastest.

Unfortunately, the gym doesn't have a shower form me to do this. I typically stretch shoes out pretty fast, and I know I need to break in this pair. ANy suggestions on how to stretch synthetics?

NorCalNomad Blank wrote: The ankle topline/collar heights aren't going to change on a women's shoe that is the same size as a men's. The volume ratios between the ball of the foot and the heel is the #1 thing that changes on a women's shoe. Get mens shoes then mod the ankle randing mountainproject.com/v/modif… Those are a few good ways to try. You can also just score the rand, not cut all the way through. Progressively putting more or deeper scores into the rand lets you find the sweet spot of having enough tension but easing off that pressure. Also if you have another option other than REI for shoes do it. Never been impressed there with a fitting or what I've overheard

I beg to differ. I have physically put two pairs of the same shoe, one men's and one women's together and there is a few inch difference. Maybe some brands just change the volume, but with the evolv shoes I was holding, there was a measurable different in the height. I guess on some people it doesn't bother them but on me, it's a deal breaker. It's not a rubbing but a deep pressing. Like someone put a rubber band on my ankle. As I said earlier, my tendons stick out a bit more then normal. But I do like those suggestions amd if my options for women shoes are limited, this may be the best way to get a pair of shoes I like and are comfy for me.

Rei was a bust for me. Women have feet larger than a size 9 and they didn't have any larger than that. Other then Evolv, I don't know where else to go. So I'm open to suggestions of place names.

FWIW...you can also run them under pretty hot water in the sink and strap them on tight for as long as you can and watch an episode of Deadwood. Th Deadwood part is important as you will realize what pansies we are today.

Nyte Knight wrote: Women have feet larger than a size 9 and they didn't have any larger than that.

That's because most of the time when women's feet get bigger than a 9 they start to be closer to the morphology of a "men's" last.

Also more aggressive shoes isn't really going to get you over you fear/ bad technique. That's something you need to work on yourself, either on TR or bouldering.

Ray Lovestead wrote:Big fat wide feet that wouldn't fit in a shoe box. Sorry you pansy ass narrow footed ballet dancers who consider 2E "wide". These: Butora Altura Wide

Yup. They perform pretty remarkably well too. I wore them in the gym to test a pair and I was impressed.

Rock and Resole is carrying these if you are in the Boulder area and you want to try them on. A + there is that you get a cert for a free resole with any shoe you buy there, and you can use it on any shoes.

Ray Lovestead wrote: Sorry you pansy ass narrow footed ballet dancers who consider 2E "wide".

2E is wide.



Sorry you have a complex about your outlier of a size.

Nyte Knight wrote: Right now, I am doing indoor top roping with eventually wanting to get into outdoor sport climbing (clips right? not anchor placing?). I don't feel confident about smaller foot placements. I like to be able to put my arch and ball on a hold and not support myself by my toe. So I feel a shoe that curves and has more toe support may help with that confidence. I don't feel secure so I'm not trusting this tiny wall chip to support my body weight and I'm afraid to climb higher...

A so called "more technical" shoe won't help you with this. These shoes are often softer and require more precise footwork.

Right now what you have to do is learn to trust your feet and use your toes. You should not be resting your foot on the arch and ball. You should focus on standing on your big toe and developing strenght in your feet. Getting some of the more advanced shoes could actually hinder you there since they don't offer as much toe support. (I know this is not always the case but for the sake of this argument, I don't think this is important)

By your description of what you are climbing, you should simply try to get a comfortable pair of climbing shoes and it looks like you did that with the electras. The rest of the improvement will come from climbing more and building confidence in your footwork. Other shoes are very unlikely to help you!

Raymond Moreno wrote:O-Tay, folks...here are my parting thoughts on the Butora Altura (wide) shoes. (...) I have also used them for indoor bouldering. And...well...they are not bouldering shoes. So do not purchase them for bouldering.

DOn't buy them for that, no...
But they did fine at it in my experience.
Then again, I was only bouldering 4/4+ problems at The Spot that day, so that's maybe 5.11, not hard.
The nice thing about bouldering in them was that I could walk around AND because they were fit loose enough to be comfy, come off the wall and land on my feet without pain in the feet.

Update: Still love the Butora's after a season of OW. But I have found that the adhesive is peeling all around the bottom of the shoe. Took them to rock n' resole and they agreed that it appears they may have had some prep issues.

I'll see how they do after a resole.

My TC pros have never peeled around the edges like this (and still don't). But then they suffer from the thread around the top of the hightop section unraveling.

Oh and sorry Norcal, guess my sarcasm was a little subtle.

Ray

The Butoras look like nice shoes.
I suffered through many pairs of climbing shoes with my size 11.5 EE feet (and Morton's toe, also). I was told many times that La Sportivas run narrow and never tried them but got a pair of TC Pros last summer and they are the most comfortable climbing shoe I've ever owned. They are a bit stiff and insensitive for sport climbs but I mainly do easy to moderate trad routes and they are perfect.