new grivel north machine carbon tools-

Just got to handle the new north machine carbon tools-I was looking at replacing my quantum techs and getting these-not any longer.

The finger guard is diminutive to say the least-not much protection at all-barely will cover your pinky These appear to be much more oriented to alpine routes-which they'd be awesome for-but not for my liking as a dedicated ice tool. In comparison-the guard was smaller than the vipers, Petzl quarks and so forth.

From the looks of it epic tv agrees, best for alpinism.

I just bought a pair of North Machines, and will be trying them out as an ice + alpine tool. I really like how the tool rotates around on my pinky, in combination with with the sturdy heads and picks. I think this is improved by the now smaller guard, which does not get in the way of a nice flick.

It's interesting these come with the Ice-Plus pick, which includes a mounting point for the hammer/adze. I hope Grivel eventually makes this pick available on the aftermarket for those wanting hammers on their Tech Machines, without changing the stock pick angle.

Steven, forget anything New for quantum tech, that line is now obsolete, start stock pilling blades because once they are all gone thats it ....

I bought three extra sets for my wife and my grivel tools for that reason.

I don't own any of the old Quantum series of Grivel tools, so I do not need a stockpile of the new Machine picks for awhile. I really like the swing of Grivel tools, even after climbing on Nomics for 5 years. The swing and picks convinced me to switch from Petzl. The pathetic reliability of the head/shaft interface of the Nomics was also compelling evidence to switch.

I'll post some thoughts once I get a chance to try out the North Machines on ice.

Did you try the x dream? especially with the new alpine handle!!

I am broken with a badly sprained ankle from earlier this month. Getting back on ice is a top priority, so I will post some thoughts on the North Machines when I get a chance. Hopefully within the next 2 weeks.

I also have Tech Machines. I was skeptical the upper grip on these would be garbage for figure fours, but I actually really liked it during my gym session today.

Anyone get out on some NorthMachines yet??

Still broken! Medial ankle sprains suck. Another 2 weeks...

Any detailed reviews for these tools yet?

I am looking at buying a pair of North Machines to replace my Matrix Light / Quantum Tech combo for alpine climbing and WI/M 3-5 ice climbing. I also have a pair of first gen Nomics, but I definitely prefer the Grivel tools for less than vertical climbing.

I got a chance to fondle the 3 different versions in a shop (adze, hammer, no attachment). In most respects the North Machine appeared to be an improvement over the Quantum Tech. In particular, I like that the shaft is now stiffer and stronger. However, I did not like how the additional weight from the larger adze and hammer affected the swing.

The North Machine version, without the adze or hammer, had a swing similar to the Quantum Tech. The versions with the adze and hammer were significantly heavier and did not have the same natural swing of the old quantum tech. I do like the functionality of the large hammer and adze, but I am not sure that the additional functionality is worth the increased weight / change in balance.

Funny to hear you say that Karl. My experience with QT's is that the only way to improve their swing would be a tad more weight in the head. Different strokes!

Karl, you considered the machine 3.0? May be the best of both worlds.

Zac.St.Jules wrote:Karl, you considered the machine 3.0? May be the best of both worlds.

What is the advantage to the Machine 3.0? From reading the specs, it appears to be heavier and doesn't come with the adze/hammer option. The Machine 3.0 looks fine for cragging, but the North Machine appears to be the better option for alpinism.

I have never had problems getting my Quantum Techs to penetrate ice, as long as my tools were sharp. I never felt like extra head weight was needed. Penetration with the Quantum Tech has been as good or better than for the Nomic, with better precision and less effort. For me, the swing of the Quantum Tech sets the bar by which all other tools are measured.

The only thing I really do not like about the Quantum Tech was extreme flex in the shaft when stein pulling or torquing on the shaft, while dry tooling.

Karl Henize wrote: What is the advantage to the Machine 3.0? From reading the specs, it appears to be heavier and doesn't come with the adze/hammer option. The Machine 3.0 looks fine for cragging, but the North Machine appears to be the better option for alpinism. I have never had problems getting my Quantum Techs to penetrate ice, as long as my tools were sharp. I never felt like extra head weight was needed. Penetration with the Quantum Tech has been as good or better than for the Nomic, with better precision and less effort. For me, the swing of the Quantum Tech sets the bar by which all other tools are measured. The only thing I really do not like about the Quantum Tech was extreme flex in the shaft when stein pulling or torquing on the shaft, while dry tooling.

I didn't realize it didn't have the hammer option. Yeah thats no good.

All the new Grivel machine series picks are interchangeable, so you can run a hammer or adze on any new Grivel tool.

Their websites are rubbish. There are 3 picks:
Ice
Ice-plus (hammer/adze option)
Mix (hammer/adze option), which is thicker and I believe steeper pick angle (I heard this second hand)

I hope your local supplier is smart enough to stock all versions. I don't think MEC is.

I have taken my North Machines on one alpine outing. They are excellent tools, and drytool moderate terrain extremely well. The hammer is great for pounding pins - watch the carbon shaft. I love the swing, and still think it is quite natural like the old Quantum's while being a bit more head heavy. I never owned the Quantums, but have used them a few times and immediately drew a comparison.

After more use, I've realized why the NMC is awkward to swing for me. It's not the small diameter grip per se (which does bother me, with long hands), but the fact that the small diameter is almost round and symmetric. For larger hands (and perhaps smaller ones as well) this makes it trickier for me to orient the tool by feel alone using the fingertips, compared to (say) the quarks or nomic which have a slightly larger and more elliptical handle.

I pick up quarks with eyes closed, and in an instant have it properly zoned in the hand with pick straight forward; i'm certain it's going to be a good swing. I pick up the NMC with eyes closed, and i can get it roughly there, but definitely not to as fine an accuracy...there's a lot of uncertainty in the pick angle.

To me, this is quite a disadvantage compared to other tools; i find my NMC pick more frequently mis-oriented on palcement than other tools. With other tools I can easily adjust into the proper grip between swings by feel, using the fingertips, without looking or waiting for the first placement's feedback.