Double boot an overkill in CO?
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I am a rank beginner in mountaineering, but hoping to start with CO this winter and expand over to the Cascades, and Alaska over the next 2-3 years. I am more interested in expedition-style mountaineering (slow walking uphill for long distances) compared to vertical ice climbing. And I am looking for a pair of boots for the job. |
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I'm in the boat that thinks single leather mountaineering boots are outdated technology. What can the Nepals do that the much lighter Trango Ice Cubes and lighter/warmer Batura 2.0s can't? Doubles do still have significant advantages over super gaiter boots though. |
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I have a brand new pair of Nepal Evos for 'winter CO climbing'... still in the box. I also have a pair of Olympus Mons in storage and only used on Denali.
Not familiar with the G2 SM, sounds like it replaces the Spantiks in weight and warmth. So you could do a Denali with a Spantik and Forty Below overboot. If it is at all like the Spantik (which it sounds like it is) it will melt your feet in most scenarios in CO |
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Not this week... |
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I think the advantage of a single leather boot like the Mont Blanc vs a boot like the Phantom is primarily one of durability. The Phantom and similar boots are built with very lightweight materials and designed for use primarily on snow. Those same materials will wear quickly if used on rock, or if you have poor footwork and snag them repeatedly with a crampon. If you don't mind spending to replace them every other season, or you'll only ever use them on snow, the Phantom series would work for you. For Colorado and PNW spring and summer mountaineering, I think you'd get more mileage out of a good pair of leather singles. I have a pair for colder weather and alpine ice, in addition to a pair of 3/4 boots for summer mountaineering. |
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Winter in CO means a lot of avy risk, so if you haven't already, take some time to research that danger. |
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Dude, it looks like you are overthinking it. If you like the Nepal go for it, it's a great boot! |
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If you've got a wide, higher-volume foot, don't overlook the regular Mont Blanc, it has a little more volume than the Pro. |
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Multi day and below 0 f is my rule of thumb for when I switch to doubles. Done singles even at |
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Depends on how much walking you plan on doing and how much of it, it's going to be stop and go and stand around... If you plan on moving all the time (i.e. not much roped climbing, i.e. belaying), I would go with lighter single or super gaiter boots. If you plan on standing around a lot, go with doubles. They only feel as an overkill in the spring. |
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chrisccc wrote:G2 SM: I'm going to altitude or staying quite a few nights on a glacier and want my boot liners in my sleeping bag. My big, medium, or small "expeditions" fall here.I bought a pair of G2 SMs over the summer, but obviously haven't had a chance to use them yet. Have you used them in really cold temperatures yet? I'm talking, for me, 5ºF or less? Maybe add some exposure/wind to the mix? I have a trip coming up in January & I expect it to be single digits with full-on conditions. I read a blog post recently from Max Neale who said the G2 SM is a more technical climbing boot than the Spantik, thus, is not as warm. This was from his gear list for Denali ... Thoughts? |
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AlpineIce wrote: I bought a pair of G2 SMs over the summer, but obviously haven't had a chance to use them yet. Have you used them in really cold temperatures yet? I'm talking, for me, 5ºF or less? Maybe add some exposure/wind to the mix? I have a trip coming up in January & I expect it to be single digits with full-on conditions. I read a blog post recently from Max Neale who said the G2 SM is a more technical climbing boot than the Spantik, thus, is not as warm. This was from his gear list for Denali ... Thoughts?I've used them in plenty 5-6000m situations, probably down to around 0F. I've never been in a situation where I wished I had warmer boots while wearing them. Not really sure how somebody would consider them less warm than the Spantik. I know a couple guides who used them on Denali last season without overboots. They seem to breath a lot better than the Spantiks too. I was in a situation where 3 of us had G2s and one fellow had Spantiks. After a long hot day, the guy with Spantiks ended up with pretty messed up feet due to the moisture. Everybody with the G2s were happy. The G2s are way easier to climb vertical with than the Spantiks. Especially because you can really quickly tighten them and loosen them without taking gloves off. They seem to be just an all around superior boot. Having owned both, I can't imagine a reason to get the Spantiks over them other than the minor cost savings. |
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I'm not sure where you draw the line between "walking uphill" and ice climbing, and where exactly steep snow comes into your personal mountaineering objectives, but I'm gonna say that at some point you do want to climb snow couloirs. In CO, the season for that is in the spring due to snow stability concerns, and temps are usually pretty mild. It's been said by others and I'll echo, a single leather mountaineering boot like the LS Nepal or Scarpa Mont Blanc will probably be your best bet for an all around boot. IMHO, a double boot is indeed overkill for CO, unless possibly you are truly going on multi-day overnight trips in the coldest days of winter. |
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I have the same or similar question to the OP but think the question got missed in all of the responses so I'll ask it another way. |
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No. For a while, my only boot was Spantiks. I only hated them on warm spring days when I had to do a lot of slogging. |
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Thanks for the inputs folks. Very helpful. It seems singles would get more use now, are durable, and cheaper, so I'll just settle for them, and think about others when the time comes. |
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Mike Slavens wrote:Are the double boots going to be so warm that my feet are miserably hot and sweaty where I would end up buying a single or super-gaiter; or can I manage the extra warmth of the double in CO with thinner socks, just silk liners, or some other fashion?Mike - I've climbed a lot of waterfall ice in double boots and I can't remember the last time, if ever, my feet got "too hot." I've never been on a big peak and hiked on a glacier, but I've done multi-pitch in Hyalite Canyon, just outside Bozeman, MT and Ouray/Silverton, CO. Elevation 10k-12k and with wind, I was glad to have them. |
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Thought I would give an update and conclude this thread. I ended up ordering the Mont Blanc Pros and the Nepal Cubes in various sizes from backcountry.com as they were giving 25% off on these boots (it was my most expensive purchase order ever, and a big shout out to backcountry.com for letting one of their online agent place the order for me, fully knowing that I could return all the boots!) |