Minimal Competence Require to Climb Big Walls
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Take it ST, Will S/BillS, you'll have more fun there. Honest and ego free discussions are what we do here. |
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Slow is too slow when you have other teams backing up behind you. Slow is too slow when you are affecting other parties experience. Don't forget that your experience is not the most important experience on a climb, others have worked hard to get the time off, and have spent money to travel to Yosemite to climb. The best experience is where everyone wins. |
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Mark, |
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Xam, that's a tough one. The whole idea of moving along and not affecting other parties and having the skills to climb a route is difficult. The walls are simply crowded these days, there are a lot of climbers out there who want to climb walls. |
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DaEyeDoc wrote:Mark, I feel like you are asking way too much when you suggest that people should be considerate of others! If only this principle could be applied to all walks of life and not just big wall climbing.Totally, eh! |
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Mark, |
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My point is not gumbies getting in the way of crushers. That is not the point of this post. EVERYONE I have personally climbed up behind has been more than willing to let me pass, that's not my point. |
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BigB, to tell you the truth, if I were starting out today, I wouldn't know where to go. Kevin Deweese is probably going apoplectic right now, yelling at his computer screen, "look in the freakin' guidebook! There are literally hundreds of route that see less than 2 parties in 10 years!" |
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Mark Hudon wrote:My point is that climbers need to take a more honest assessment of their skills before going up on a route.Maybe this should be a thread starting. How to assess/match abilities to routes. |
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Check out a climbing club or get a guide (if you can invest in enough gear to do a wall; you can afford a 1 day sesh with a guide) then do what Chris Mac and Jared Ogden said to do; go out and clean climb a 5.11 crack and time yourself until you make some serious progress. Sit at the top of the pitch and set up a 2:1 haul system (see Mark Hudon or Pete Zabrok) from scratch. Haul 125 pounds in a 1:1 system so you know what it feels like. Boulder with aiders on skyhooks so you know what sound rock is and how sketch a hook move on a slab crack can be. Set up a portaledge from scratch on 2 bolts (doing it in the garage is not real) while hanging. |
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Mark Hudon wrote: Maybe showing up and scoping the start of the Mescalito or Dawn Wall, P1 of the Trip or the first few of the Dihedral.Thanks, Mark...this is what I was looking for. I certainly understand the standard progression but was hoping for alternatives to the standard first walls to do that don't contribute to the cluster. I hate climbing at my limit with someone stuck bored behind me, which is what I would expect for my first few walls. If anyone has similar suggestions for Zion in addition to those above, I would appreciate it. |
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Another tip, Xam, would be try to hit the trades is the very off season. I'm not familiar with where you might find a nice 2 pitch route to practice aid on but being creative and thinking out of the box is the first requirement of big wall success. |
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I agree with you Mark. If you have to climb a chimney by aiding up your big bros...I mean come on, youre not even climbing anymore you just pulling on gear. |
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Xam- |
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Rob T wrote: Organasm and The Pulpit are great for general skills practice. Prodigal Sun and Disco Inferno are nice longer routes where you're unlikely to run into free climbers.Thanks Rob T! There are plenty of single pitch climbs around here to practise aid on but it is great to get suggestions for a first big trip to look forward to that gets a bit away from the fray. |
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Thanks for speaking up Mark- really appreciate your posts on the site. Cheers and have fun out there. |
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Ever drive during rush hour and have a traffic jam that is caused by some slow drivers? Seems like your argument in a nutshell. The traffic will never change if anything it'll just get worse. |
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Mark Hudon wrote:My point is that climbers need to take a more honest assessment of their skills before going up on a route.It also applies to non-wall climbing like one-day multipitch routes, though I can imagine the scale of the problems caused by being unprepared is a lot higher on walls. |
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Mark Hudon wrote:... I'd even say that understanding of big wall systems is 30% lower than what it was in the 70's. A fast ascent, these days, is a few days longer than an average ascent back then...i would be way beyond shocked if people are doing walls slower than they were in the 70's. no frickin way man. there's just a lot more people out there so it is more readily noticeable when things are going slow. |
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I don't know what it is but a disproportionate percentage of the sketchy, low-skill level people I have climbed with have expressed interest in wall climbing at one point or another. |