Drone at the Gunks Sunday Feb 28th

NESteve - the rangers WILL come and "enforce the rules," but they can't do so if they aren't aware there is an issue.

By your logic, there would need be a ranger within hearing range of any potential drone, and within sight of any dog. And, of course, backup rangers in case a few get called away to, you know, save a person's life or something.

It's certainly understandable that some people wouldn't care to be bothered to make a 2 minute phone call when witnessing something like a drone, but that they will then go on a discussion forum and invest time in complaining is sort of silly.

Happiegrrrl wrote:It's certainly understandable that some people wouldn't care to be bothered to make a 2 minute phone call when witnessing something like a drone, but that they will then go on a discussion forum and invest time in complaining is sort of silly.

As we've seen in other threads, this guy is a moron who gets his jollies by finding any thread where he can bash the Preserve and the Gunks in general. He's not really worth the time and effort to engage. His mind certainly won't be changed by anything written here.

sara pax wrote:Maybe the rangers should invest in a fleet of drones that could monitor all cliff activity. This would be a bigger initial investment on the part of the preserve, but it would equal fewer rangers needed on the ground with a much high rate of surveillance. I think this is a win win for everyone.

Couldn't agree more. A fleet of these would do nicely. Make the Gunks Great Again

sara pax wrote:Maybe the rangers should invest in a fleet of drones that could monitor all cliff activity. This would be a bigger initial investment on the part of the preserve, but it would equal fewer rangers needed on the ground with a much high rate of surveillance. I think this is a win win for everyone.

A reminder for all that even $3000+ professional drones have a max flight time of only about 30 minutes on a charge, some significantly less.
(Yes, I know sara's post was satire...)

I know New software updates included exemption / no fly zones where the device literally won't fly. They have it for airports, stadiums etc. I'm sure the preserve could do something similar.

sara pax wrote:Maybe the rangers should invest in a fleet of drones that could monitor all cliff activity. This would be a bigger initial investment on the part of the preserve, but it would equal fewer rangers needed on the ground with a much high rate of surveillance. I think this is a win win for everyone.

They could help with the over crowding situation too, especially if fitted with microwave and sonic crowd dispersal technology. They could be programmed to detect top rope gang banging activity and zap the offenders to force them to move on, or spray calmative agents on groups of screaming boulderers.

I've flown gas-powered model airplanes in the past and the hobby is highly regulated by the Academy of Model Aeronautics. The things can fly 80 MPH so it would be quite easy to kill someone with one. I'm surprised drones have not been included as "other" model aircraft and regulated similarly. I would never fly a model aircraft anywhere other than private land or at a designated AMA field. The noise pollution and potential for accidents is real when people send objects into the air that inevitably come down one way or the other.

worth russell wrote:I know New software updates included exemption / no fly zones where the device literally won't fly. They have it for airports, stadiums etc. I'm sure the preserve could do something similar.

They don't want to ban them, just control who/where/when they're being used on their property. If abuse becomes a regular thing, then perhaps they'll be forced to just ban them outright.

M Sprague wrote: They could help with the over crowding situation too, especially if fitted with microwave and sonic crowd dispersal technology. They could be programmed to detect top rope gang banging activity and zap the offenders to force them to move on, or spray calmative agents on groups of screaming boulderers.

In my day there were lots of calmative agents wafting around the Gunks.

hey hippiegrl yaknow some of us go to the Gunks to actually climb and not to play with our phones so we leave those things in the car and cant just call for the rangers from a root!!!! What should I do when I see a drone this weekend lower off a lead, rap and run down the carragige trail yelling MR RANGER MR RANGER COME HELP!!!! If somebody takes the gear I leave before I get back do I get it back or is it boooty!?!?! MR.801 calling names again because you don't like that Ihave and opinon that isnt the Gunks are awesome and everythig about the gunks preserve is awesome maybe you and HIppiegrl should get jobs drumming up business for them!

This is life. Drones are here to stay. Don't like it? Tough cookies.
Don't like your picture taken without your permission? Too bad, you're in public and I don't need your permission.
The gunks are awesome? Not really. Too many citidots. Not as bad as Harriman but close enough.
Need a ranger to "go find the offender"? again T.S.
do you're own thing and forget everyone else

Lex Bally wrote: There's surprisingly little power in the rotors. Professional quality drones weight less than 2.5 pounds, so it doesn't take much to keep them in the air. You can stop the rotors just by putting your fingers in them. It might hurt a little (about the equivalent of flicking it with a rubber band), but wouldn't even break skin. There's virtually no chance it would be able to cut a rope. Plus most of the higher quality drones have LiDAR or some equivalent to actively avoid collisions. Honestly, the operator is probably too deathly afraid of losing his $800 investment to risk flying it close to anything solid anyways. That said, the downwash of air underneath one of these things can be brutal/annoying, plus I'm personally not a huge fan of people taking my photo without my permission.

None of this is true. A DJI prop will easily cut to the bone of a finger or worse. No prosumer drones have onboard collision avoidance LIDAR.

A drone prop could probably damage the sheath of a rope.

Miller S wrote:This is life. Drones are here to stay. Don't like it? Tough cookies. Don't like your picture taken without your permission? Too bad, you're in public and I don't need your permission.

I'm pretty sure this is wrong in the case of an entity like the Preserve.

My understanding: there is no right to photograph on private property. The permission of the property owner is required; without permission to photograph you are trespassing. The individual being photographed may have no expectation of privacy, so they are photographable, but only if the property owner permits it.

Which they don't.

Miller S wrote:This is life. Drones are here to stay. Don't like it? Tough cookies. Don't like your picture taken without your permission? Too bad, you're in public and I don't need your permission. The gunks are awesome? Not really. Too many citidots. Not as bad as Harriman but close enough. Need a ranger to "go find the offender"? again T.S. do you're own thing and forget everyone else

Just because something may be technically legal doesn't mean you aren't an asshole for doing it.

So dumb question. what is the risk of these things crashing and chopping a rope? I've never climbed near one, but are they getting close enough to you that that is a risk...? I did actually google this but didn't find much discussion, which suggests nothing like that has happened... yet.
Yur gonna die dude

rgold wrote: I'm pretty sure this is wrong in the case of an entity like the Preserve. My understanding: there is no right to photograph on private property. The permission of the property owner is required; without permission to photograph you are trespassing. So the individual being photographed may have no expectation of privacy, so they are photographable, but only if the property owner permits it.

I'm not a lawyer, but I think, though privately owned, the gunks would be considered public space and therefore photography would be legal unless you were asked not to in person or by signage (slight difference - the right can be revoked vs. you must obtain)

The question of photography with a drone is more hazy I think if it was used to photograph somebody who has secluded themselves such that they normally would not be seen (even on public property). I haven't seen anything that makes it absolutely clear to me.

content.photojojo.com/photo…

Regarding rope cutting, here's a thought.

A few months ago, ranger Andrew posted a video of some guide who had "sawed apart" a rope under weight, by rubbing another rope back and forth across it. It was certainly and example of something extremely unlikely to happen, but in theory, it would not take much. It was like 4 or 5 pulls back and forth and the rope was severed.

So, a rope under tension - someone on rappel, having fallen or getting hauled through a sequence on TR - it seems to me, from watching the video I saw, that if a rotor from a drone contacted a weighted rope, it was certainly a possibility that it would cut the rope.

Someone who has a drone should run some tests. I suggest using a retired rope and hanging a weighted item other than a sentient being on it, though.

As for NESteve - You want the rangers roaming in number enough that they can "save you" from the maddening crowds, but making a common sense suggestion that you could call in with a complaint is ridiculous...?

I guess the best thing for you to do is just keep on as you are, having to suffer horrible experiences with your only redress to post complaints about them on the forums.

NateGfunk wrote: ...No prosumer drones have onboard collision avoidance LIDAR. ..

The new Phantom 4 does

I dont need rangers to save me from anything just to do the job my fee pays them to do. like I said Im not the guy needs to check facebook from the cliffs so my phone stays somewhere else when I'm climbing how am I going to call?!?! Yell REALL load from the cliff?!?! Thats a good idea LOL!!!! The'll probably just think I'm some dumbass boulderer pulling for the send bra gotta let everyone know I'm pulling real hard because someone on the carrage trail may not see me and my posse and our 1000 crashpads!!!! Do you really think a ranger is going to come running anyway? whos going to collect the fee and man the parking lot to make sure they can fit in as many cars (FEES) as possible? I wonder how they sneak a drone past the guy in the booth and then the one sitting at the bridge "he paid his fee sir, I guess I didnt notice the helicopter blades sticking out of his pack"

I love the Gunks, one of the places where rockclimbing was invented with Kraus and Wisener back before it became about a fasion show to show everybody how good they look in there new patigonia-puffy and Mt. Everest supersuit so I can post it on the internet for my fat relatives to see and look cool toproping some 5.5!!!I try to have some respect whn I'm out in nature for the place not the dumabasses who don't. Let me go outdoors so I can play with the toy mom and dad bought me seems like bullshit just like climbing with my phone so I can call the rangers to do there job. I see someone flying 1 of those stupid things when I'm there sunday we're gonna have a serious talk!!!

I guess Hiipiegril will just have to keep on how SHE is: sitting at her computer looking for anyone who has an opinion other than how perfect the preserve is and arguing with them until they try some of the coolaid too. Just because someone says something different than the preserve brochures say doesn't meeen there always wrong. I swear your being paid by the preserve to be there spokeperson to drum up business on MT.Project!!!! I bet your one of those people who dont even climb just sit in your van at cool climbing areas telling people to be quiet and stop having fun the minitue after "quiet hours" and then spending all day talking about how your going to climb tomorrow or something but right now I have to go to whole foods for more tofu or something. before climbing was cool you had to be cool to be a climber aint that way now!!!!

Every time I read NESteve rants on Mtn Proj I feel as if I've lost a few brain cells. Am I alone in this?