Why do so few climbers have a good fingerboard routine?

Fingerboard training is probably the most effective isolation exercise for becoming a stronger climber, and yet I meet so many climbers who don't do it, or who have an ineffective routine.

Why is that?

Is it because it's difficult? Boring? Annoying? Hard to keep track of? Are people just not in the know?

Agreed, you gots to practice!

Pretty simple: climbing is fun, hangboarding isn't.

It's a question of relative benefit. Most people will see substantial gains from just climbing for many years (stupid generalization: up to 5.12). Sure, you might make gains faster if you include regular hangboarding, but the difference isn't substantial enough to persuade the average 5.10 climber to go through the process of developing a routine and sticking to it. It is a recreational activity after all. And I'd guess the average climber will never climb 5.12, anyway.

NTH wrote:Pretty simple: climbing is fun, hangboarding isn't.

This, which applies to a lot of goal setting in general. People in general don't like to make sacrifices (perceived or actual) in order to achieve a goal.

It is boring, but it doesn't take that long. Put on some gangster rap and it's over.

I always lose my routine because I never think it's safe to hangboard around the days when I've been climbing. For example, if I climb all weekend then i usually feel like i need to rest my fingers Monday and Tuesday. Then by Wednesday I would rather go to the gym. Then it's almost the weekend again. I guess I really don't know how much rest to build into a routine, assuming that I'm not willing to skip a good weekend due to hang boarding.

Yeah, I have the same problem. If given the choice between climbing or hanging, climbing always wins. You can hang after a moderate climbing session, but it's also an easy way to blow a tendon if you're not careful.

(Bearing in mind that ive been climbing less than two years) I bought a hangboard a year or so back I've found I simply don't use it much. Here's why:

It's boring.
I don't always have the energy for it after work (depending on what I've done that day).
I find sticking to any workout routine to be difficult.
I'd rather go boulder at the gym because that works my whole body.
After looking objectively at what I want from climbing, I'm not currently interested in pushing above 5.10 right now and feel hand and finger strength is not what's holding me back from climbing that grade solidly (on bolts or gear).
Due to a wrist injury a while back, it's painful to hangboard because of wrist positioning.

Does anybody have a good routine for someone who's goal is to be solid on 5.12 trad? I have no real desire to Boulder hard.

Boulder hard. Lol, but seriously...bouldering is a great way to train for harder climbing.

Don Ferris wrote:Does anybody have a good routine for someone who's goal is to be solid on 5.12 trad? I have no real desire to Boulder hard.

Indian Creek or Eldo? IE crack or face 12s?

Gabriel Silk wrote:Fingerboard training is probably the most effective isolation exercise for becoming a stronger climber, and yet I meet so many climbers who don't do it, or who have an ineffective routine. Why is that? Is it because it's difficult? Boring? Annoying? Hard to keep track of? Are people just not in the know?

climbing friend,

The idea that fingerboarding is somehow better for improving than hard climbing is ridiculous most.

It's most unclear that fingerboarding is any better than pointless for improving, unless you truly cannot get to a crag or boulders or climbing gym 3-4 times per week. This would be especially true if you are beginner or intermediate and can only crushing the 5.10 or 5.11 climbing rocks.

Just look at irony of "traning beta" podcast featuring pros who climb v13+ and 5.15b who don't train but instead climb a lot and constantly try hard projects.

On this podcast yes I listen for neck meat, Ethan Pringle just wang-slapped advice from known "trainers" by saying their saying is complete nonsense, of - if you can't send something after several tries, you need to go back and train, and that he does no train or finger the board.

"Training" is quite good if you cannot get on the climbing rocks for actual, or if you are quite nerdy with the spreadsheets and have excessive amounts of sexual frustration you need to release, or if you simply want to feel like you are accomplishing something in regarding the climbing when you likely actually accomplish little or nothing, yes?

"Training" is also good if you want to take the advantage of others' insecurities and mediocrity and sell them devices and programs!

Instead you must go clamp your crushing grip down on some climbing rocks and thrust yourself up many times, with maximum effort until you have the crushing palm of iron fist and powerful eagle talon crimp and you climb as man or woman of power with impeccable style!

Ho ho ho, ha ha ha, he he he, ho ha he hya hmmmmmmmmmyyyyyaaaaaahhhhh!!!

Mark E Dixon wrote: Indian Creek or Eldo? IE crack or face 12s?

Ideally, both. I assume hang boarding is better for face climbing strength although I don't know much about it. I hope 5.12 cracks will come with experience.

A full on domestic life leaves me plenty of time to hang board at home but only an indoor session once every two weeks. And more depressingly, since I am in Michigan, only two real outdoor trips a year. I'm interested in doing a great job hang boarding because I would love to make those two outdoor trips as much fun as I can.

Don Ferris wrote: Ideally, both. I assume hang boarding is better for face climbing strength although I don't know much about it. I hope 5.12 cracks will come with experience.

I'm not a crack climber, would be interested in hearing ideas from those who are. Could do repeaters on a crack machine of some kind. I'd think that shoulder strength would be important too. Pullups, that sort of thing.

For trad face I personally would focus more on longer hangs, such as extended repeater sessions (7/3x8-12), maybe try repeaters with limited recovery time (7/3x6 with one minute recovery and try to shorten that to maybe 30 seconds recovery) or even 20/20x10 Tabatas.
You'll need some raw strength for cruxes, but if you have enough strength for that, seems like being able to hang out to solve sequences, place gear, downclimb, quiver with fear, etc, would be most helpful.

climbing friend,

for 5.12 cracks, you may practice sticking fingers in garbage disposal and turning on, also while slapping yourself with a frozen salmon of considerable size.

Lol. Crack machine is a good idea for practicing for hard cracks...for a 12, you're probably looking at super nasty finger/off sizes, which get burly...or roofs. Or off-width, if you're $&@?ing nuts...

Don Ferris wrote: Ideally, both. I assume hang boarding is better for face climbing strength although I don't know much about it. I hope 5.12 cracks will come with experience.

Get a good look at how your fingers are arranged in a thin crack. Often It's pretty close to a stacked 2 finger pocket. Something easily trained on a hangboard. Also a lot of seem climbing in that range. Practicing on small, rounded edges is pretty helpful.

Also cracks in the grade can be downright painful. Wouldnt hurt to simulate some of the in a controlled environment. Hangboard pockets can be just that.

As to your first question: Id say it's because a lot of climbers dont have a formal athletics background and therefore are not accustomed to regimented training, drills, whathaveyou. Most of the climbers I've met are so untrained that doing anything would improve their climbing. So why spend time on a boring hangboard when you can punch laps on a juggy gym 5.10 and improve slightly?

Also I wouldnt take advice from someone who does nothing but travel and is incredibly gifted in talent and good genes. Yes, Ethan might not have to train formally, but Im sure his normal cycle mirrors a typical periodized plan: bouldering in the winter in Hueco/Bishop/Joes, then a shift towards shorter sport lines, then finally PE rigs in Spain. I think it's a much better idea to take advice from a time constrained, average build individual whos' shown steady progression over a number of years(ie Anderson Brothers).

climbing friend,

yes its true, if you don't have copious time to spend on the climbing rocks you may choose to hang your fingers on a board. but let us not be fooling ourselves that this is osmehow better or faster magic shortcut route to improvement than copious time on the climbing rocks, yes?

Aleks Zebastian wrote:climbing friend, yes its true, if you don't have copious time to spend on the climbing rocks you may choose to hang your fingers on a board. but let us not be fooling ourselves that this is osmehow better or faster magic shortcut route to improvement than copious time on the climbing rocks, yes?

but then you'd have to believe that improving in climbing is somehow different-in-kind than improving in any other sport

all serious athletes do some sort of sport-specific exercises that aren't just doing the sport itself. the lifting up and putting down of heavy things is pretty common in all kinds of sports, myah?

now if you're just wanting to play flag football after work with some cold ones and your buddies, you probably don't need to worry about the girth of your neck meat and its ability to withstand bone crushing tackles. but at some point on your trajectory to elite footballery, you're going to get left behind if all you do is play football

the way climbing IS different from other sports is that you're not really competing with others to make the big league in pro climbing, so there's not the same dynamic of being left behind. if you're good enough to "make it" as a pro climber, you don't really need to worry about continual improvement as an existential threat, it's more a matter of personal motivation.

in that environment, it's no surprise why a lot of pro climbers don't train outside of just climbing a bunch. sharma's not going to lose a roster spot to ondra

it's also no surprise that with the growing class of competition climbers, there seems to be more emphasis on coaching and regimented training. in that case, you are competing for a spot on the podium, and if it really is a zero sum game you're going to do anything you can to get ahead. hence, fingering the board

Yeah...except Sharma IS (hypothetically) going to lose a roster spot, in the form of what sustains most pro climbers: endorsement deals. Both of the climbers you mentioned train extensively...I believe Ondra said he does 5 or 6 days a week; and that's TRAIN, not just climb. The pro climbers who don't train (Pringle, Ashima) are very much the exception, not the norm.

Dan Austin wrote:all serious athletes do some sort of sport-specific exercises that aren't just doing the sport itself.

Yes and I think the reason some top climbers don't do much fingerboarding is because standard fingerboard exercises are
not so sport-specific, and
not the best stimulus for long-term muscle+tendon HYPertrophy.

And they know about and have equipment for doing other better training drills in a progressive measurable way ... exercises which are more climbing-specific than fingerboard hangs.

Ken