Camp (Cassin) Xdream picks - Crap steel?

I got some Mixte picks I could donate.

I gotta ask one thing.. Does anybody really give a enough of a shit about the filing the picks to not use Cassin X Dreams? Next, there's somebody out there that bashes their Mixte picks up so much that, what? You're going to use other tool?

I can't really speak to the differences between Cassin and other companies in terms of hardness/durability; I've only used Cassin. But I will say that I sharpen my tools a ton, and have started carrying a small file on long routes, so that I can put a lick on 'em before a crux lead. There's nothing better than starting up a steep pitch with freshly sharpened implements!

So, if the picks are indeed softer, perhaps one advantage would be ease of sharpening!

-Scott

I carry a small file on route as well. And I'm in love with my X-Dreams - no intention of switching to anything else. (Although the new BD vipers do seem like a great way to finally use my stash of Aermet picks on more moderate alpine climbs).

I suppose my Mixte picks have blunted a bit quicker than BD/Petzl picks, but it's honestly not a real issue. I figure I'll get about 20 days on my tools this season, with about about 7-10 of those days climbing mixed/rock routes and I'm pretty sure my set of Mixte picks will still have some life left to carry me into next season. I'm perfectly comfortable spending $35 on new picks every 1.5 years.

Bill Kirby wrote: I got some Mixte picks I could donate. I gotta ask one thing.. Does anybody really give a enough of a shit about the filing the picks to not use Cassin X Dreams? Next, there's somebody out there that bashes their Mixte picks up so much that, what? You're going to use other tool?

The less I have to think about on a day out, the better. If I'm cragging, meh. I'll bring a file, or maybe spare picks, or whatever. No big deal.

If I'm doing something committing, I'd rather not have to choose to be daintier, bring a file, or swing dull tips. And I would pay a bit more for harder steel to not have to make that choice.

And just to add some additional (but still totally anecdotal) evidence, I bent one of my x-dreams' picks on a fairly light torque last weekend. Will try to bend it back, and I'm sure it'll be fine, but definitely annoying. While I've bent at least one other pick in the past (BD fusion, really cranking down hard), I really wasn't torquing all that hard (or at least what I would consider hard) on the x-dreams, though it was a weird angle.

Honestly, after having multiple instances where the picks have disappointed, I'm a bit leery of bringing them anywhere where I expect things to get weird. The last thing I want to think about mid-climb is compromising placement security because the picks might be too delicate. The x-dreams a katana on ice, but I think I'm going to stick with my battle axe fusions for mixed unless cassin releases picks with harder steel.

shoo wrote:And just to add some additional (but still totally anecdotal) evidence, I bent one of my x-dreams' picks on a fairly light torque last weekend. Will try to bend it back, and I'm sure it'll be fine, but definitely annoying. While I've bent at least one other pick in the past (BD fusion, really cranking down hard), I really wasn't torquing all that hard (or at least what I would consider hard) on the x-dreams, though it was a weird angle. Honestly, after having multiple instances where the picks have disappointed, I'm a bit leery of bringing them anywhere where I expect things to get weird. The last thing I want to think about mid-climb is compromising placement security because the picks might be too delicate. The x-dreams a katana on ice, but I think I'm going to stick with my battle axe fusions for mixed unless cassin releases picks with harder steel.

I've found that the new BD Fuels work well for a second set of tools for mixed routes. I agree that fusions are fantastic on rock but they suck on ice. The fuels are much more useful than the Fusions.

I'll throw my two cents into the conversation, albeit a bit old. I tried the X-dreams recently and I beat the shit out the picks. More so than I would have expected. The tools are amazing, and I was super impressed by them. The pick thickness isn't far off from other's (Petzl, BD, Grivel) but I did notice that they took much more of a beating than usual. If I had to buy new tools right now, it would be the x-dreams but I would defiently consider custom picks that are stronger. Not sure what it is, but they are definietly not as strong.

I have talked to a CAMP-USA rep about this soft steel issue and was basically told that it is softer, but by design. They claim that having a pick bend and not break is better. I think most people have forgotten the BD pick breaking issue that instigated a public release from BD . That being said, I really enjoy how well the x-dreams climb and will keep using them. If the soft pick gets to me I can always upgrade with these.

Hey and salute to all the x dream users!
There is a solution coming soon to the soft steel of the mixte picks.This russian company krukonogi makes drytooling picks, but guess what... They are coming with the ice line as well. I got the drytooling picks a month ago, this season was mostly ice season, but still I got a couple of days on rock with those picks, they are really good. If I count it, around six hundred meters of drytooing and I couldn't see any changes on the tip. Maybe it's because of me, I don't like to jerk when I climb. Anyway, I'm waiting for the ice picks to arrive, I hope to get them before the last ice melts down here in ontario.
I'll post it right away.
Cheers

Appreciate you sharing your observations stasb.

I still prefer my nomics when getting on a totally dry line, and love the xdreams on the steep blue lines.

Jon H wrote:Anybody have access to a Rockwell tester? If we can find people with retired BD, Petzl, Cassin, and Grivel picks, I will happily donate $22 to cover everyone's shipping costs (USPS Priority flat rate envelope $5.50 x 4) to get the picks tested. I'm quite curious as to the relative hardness of each company's steel.

I can do Birnell, Rockwell and impact tests in a lab but I'm in calgary.

KRUKONOGI x-dream replacement picks