Statistics on injuries resulting from ice lead falls
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So everyone who climbs ice has heard someone else say "you just don't fall on ice" or "never fall on ice". We all know the consequences from falling on ice are more severe due to the fact we have big metal spikes attached to our feet. Yet everyone I've ever spoken to who has fallen on ice has walked away unscathed. |
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LawHous wrote: We all know the consequences from falling on ice are more severe due to the fact we have big metal spikes attached to our feet.Not necessarily. Mixed and drytoolers have the same metal spikes and they do fall sometimes a lot. The difference is in the pro and the medium. You don't want to fall on ice because pro is sparse and nobody really wants to test it even in bomber ice. Leading ice is controlled solo, and you don't want to fall soloing, do you? LawHous wrote: Yet everyone I've ever spoken to who has fallen on ice has walked away unscathed.Everyone I know who's taken a fall and walked away unscathed, consider themselves lucky and certainly do not want any repeaters. Have you asked your friends where'd they fallen? A lot of falls I know of are usually all the way to the ground into a nice pile of snow. |
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I've taken at least three whippers onto ice screws two of them pretty spectacular. I wasn't injured in any of them save for a skinned nose caused by a falling slab of snow- ice... |
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"Not necessarily. Mixed and drytoolers have the same metal spikes and they do fall sometimes a lot. The difference is in the pro and the medium. You don't want to fall on ice because pro is sparse and nobody really wants to test it even in bomber ice. Leading ice is controlled solo, and you don't want to fall soloing, do you? " |
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RobC2 wrote:I've taken at least three whippers onto ice screws two of them pretty spectacular. I wasn't injured in any of them save for a skinned nose caused by a falling slab of snow- ice... I can't even keep track of the dry-tooling falls. So 3 & 0.Yeah that is pretty much what I've heard from other people I know who've fallen on ice |
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I'd doubt you'd be able to really peg a difference, but for survivable, I've seen more head & chest injury with ice and more lower extremity with rock; for whatever that's worth. Otherwise, avy & cold injury, which usually doesn't really translate to rock, maybe alpine. |
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I took a pretty scary fall just a couple weeks ago on an ice climb. Pretty surprised by it. Pulled the screw that was right below me that I knew was garbage and got caught by a screw that I knew was good. Came away with a sprained ankle and a bruised ego. |
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All I can provide is a case report. One of my partners tried to lead ice before he really knew what he was doing and proceeded to fall and break his ankle. |
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I think the old adage 'don't fall no matter what' came about mostly because of the type of screws or pro they were using back then. I feel that the modern screws are pretty amazing. |
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I recently saw a friend take a 30' fall on a screw that he thought was pretty manky. (In the interest of full disclosure, he was climbing on double ropes and had a screw three feet below the manky one that may have taken weight as well.) He walked away unscathed. |
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Your friendly local climber with clinical epidemiology training here... |
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I would check out AAC's yearly accident report. You could tally up the information in a few years books and see what you come up with. I understand some don't report their lead falls but it's going in the right direction. |
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There's a master's thesis study in here somewhere... |
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Kirby1013 wrote: Don't fall?... No shit! That has nothing to do with the OP's topic.Haha yes thank you! Please do no restate the fact it's not good to fall on ice. We all know and practice this. I'm just looking for stats, stories, injuries, etc. getting some good stuff though, keep it coming! |
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Check out this video...talked to some guides in North Conway a couple weeks ago about this same topic. |
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I caught a friend on, perhaps, a 25 footer. The real scary thing was it was on his first screw and his crampons flew right by my head on the way down. He ended up about 2 feet off the ground totally fine, but certainly a tad shaken... |
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There's an accident report on Cold Thistle Blog that is worth reading. |
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doligo wrote: Not necessarily. Mixed and drytoolers have the same metal spikes and they do fall sometimes a lot. The difference is in the pro and the medium. You don't want to fall on ice because pro is sparse and nobody really wants to test it even in bomber ice. Leading ice is controlled solo, and you don't want to fall soloing, do you? Everyone I know who's taken a fall and walked away unscathed, consider themselves lucky and certainly do not want any repeaters. Have you asked your friends where'd they fallen? A lot of falls I know of are usually all the way to the ground into a nice pile of snow.In 25 years of ice climbing, I've witnessed 4 falls on to screws. The screws held in all 4 cases, but injuries resulted in 2 of them. Ice pro well placed in good ice (admittedly 2 significant caveats) is actually quite reliable, but it's still a terrible idea to fall. The main difference between falling on ice and the drytoolers you mention above is the angle of the terrain they're generally climbing on. The vast majority of pure ice routes are at most vertical. Most modern drytooling is on overhanging ground. That they don't snap their ankles regularly has as much or more to do with the fact that the falls they take tend to be clean air as it does with the quality of the protection. Think about slabby, ledgy rock routes. Even if the pro is bombproof it's still a lousy idea to fall on them. Add crampons in to the mix and you're asking for trouble. |
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Matt Gusto wrote:Check out this video...talked to some guides in North Conway a couple weeks ago about this same topic. vimeo.com/20549603This accident is hardly representative of what one should expect in a fall on ice of that size. These guys made a multitude of errors and the leader survived unscathed by pure, dumb luck. Sadly, the lesson they seemed to have learned (increased confidence in the strength of ice pro) misses the point entirely. The lessons they SHOULD have learned appear to have been missed entirely. |
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I was lucky enough to be one of the ones to walk away unscathed by a lead fall. It was only 6-7 feet but that was big enough for me. |
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Took a 30+ footer last week and gratefully walked away unscathed despite pitching back and falling most the way upside down. On looking at the screw that held found 3 fractures all at 120 degrees. |