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Woody design help

Original Post
Kevin Hilgert · · Unknown Hometown · Joined Jun 2012 · Points: 5

Looking for some ideas/feedback on my plans.

Background. Used to be a weekend warrior boulderer about 10 years ago when I lived in CO, and did some climbing when I first got to SoCal in 2005, but by now I am probably at the level of someone walking into the gym/crag for the very first time.

I am looking for something fun to do exercise wise along with my wife, especially in the long Michigan winters. Additionally nearest climbing is a 3 hour round trip, and the closest gym is 1.5 hours round trip-- difficult scenarios with 3 kids under 8, and only 1 car for the family. My three young children also like to climb everything, and I think it would be nice to have them in there too.

What I have to work with is a room in my basement. It is 10'9" wide by 11'3" long, 7' 4" high on the short side and 7' 7" on the long side.

As you can see not a lot of height, but it is what I have to work with.

Basically I have come up with 2 designs I am choosing between.

First Design Option
: is a 10'9" wide ~10' vertical gain 45d wall with a 6-8 inch kicker. That leaves me with 44" of additional space facing the wall. I am considering a 15d 7' 10" wall opposite the 45d wall, leaving about 20" for a horizontal roof.

Positives: This build would be easy construction wise, give me the longest vertical gain I could get out of this room, and I could always add features/volumes down the line.

Negatives: 45d for a noob, in decent shape, but strength is not the same in my late 30's as it was in my earl-late 20's when I bouldered in the past and could depend on my athleticism to get me through/up things. The 45d is a bit intimidating. 20" of horizontal roof not enough "fall zone" between the two walls, even taking angles of wall into account?

Second Design Option: is to have an 8' wide x 8' vertical gain 35d wall with a 10" kicker. Opposite that wall would be a ~18d 8'x 8' vertical gain wall. Perpendicular to those two walls and butting up to them would be a 4' wide by 8' vertical gain ~25d wall. I plan to frame in the dihedrals for the three walls. It would also have a 4' wide x 8' long horizontal roof.

Positives. Varying angles and slightly more climbable surface area. Maybe longer problems would be possible? On paper, and without the aid of "real" climbing knowledge at this point, the "flow" seems nice... sort of a nice "U" shape overhung wall of varying angles, with one vert connector wall.

Negatives. More difficult construction. More materials. Not as much vertical gain.

In many ways I am questioning what is going to be the best for me. I am not "training" per se to be able to send problems of a higher level. I am not training for climbing at a local crag. I am climbing for fun/exercise/challenge, but fun for me means pushing myself, making advancements, struggling, overcoming, problem solving, being exhausted, having success....

I have been doing exhaustive research since the end of March. Many people tout 45d for best training. Many people tout to have as much vertical gain as possible. This makes me lean towards Design One.

However, I have seen many 8' vertical gain walls. Many people using anywhere from 15d-35d walls too.

So I do not know how many of these people actually climb their walls regularly, and do so beyond a mere 5-6 months or even a years time.

This is an investment, and one I am willing to make, but cannot afford to completely redo it either though once constructed!

Currently, I am ready to begin construction. I have been acquiring holds over the months, and at the local home improvement I just scored 4x8x3/4" baltic birch for 14.99!!! a sheet. I also found some 5' x 6' x 4.5" thick closed cell foam for crash pads. The room is ready to go, and I have a neighbor enlisted to help with framing.

Any advice from knowledgeable folks would be appreciated; those who have built multiple walls and have climbed for multiple years on walls they have built would be most appreciated.

Thanks!

Rudimentary pics of the 45d wall design:





Rudimentary pics of the "U-shaped" wall design:





Andy Librande · · Denver, CO · Joined Nov 2005 · Points: 1,880

While the 45 does give you a little extra room I feel that it might become "old" for you quickly at that angle as everything will have to be big jug holds especially if you have not been climbing much lately.

Personally I would build the 35 degree wall. I would not add the second/other walls until you have the first one up and you have climbed on it for a while as sometimes it is hard to understand how everything will fit together until it is installed.

Make it as wide as possible since most of the routes will be set as traverses (from one corner high to the other corner).

Once you have this wall installed I think just adding in a roof would be a solid addition to add some finishing moves and extend your body out further.

Climb on it for a while and if it seems logical to add the rest of the U shape or another wall then that is what you should do at that time. You don't want to build a plan that once you climb on it you realize that you made a mistake.

Lots of inspiration here: mountainproject.com/v/gener…

Some recent threads:
mountainproject.com/v/new-w…
mountainproject.com/v/sugge…

Also the guys that run climbingholdreview.blogspot… have a relatively small space and lots of videos here to give you an idea of space: youtube.com/user/ntmb?featu…

Matt Roberts · · Columbus, OH · Joined Mar 2010 · Points: 85

Go w/ option 2, I find that it is plenty hard enough, but you can still (once you are up to it) put some smaller holds on it. My wall is 28" of kick, 8' of 33d, and 20" of roof. (It was supposed to be a bit different, but after we started we found that the garage wasn't square). We used the plans from Metolius, pretty much. My t-nuts are on overlapping 8" grids. Get the screw-in instead of the pound in, too.

My whole family climbs--3 for USAC, and we use it quite a bit, enough that we installed a heater and our old sofa in the garage. Family stick games can become quite competitive.

Good luck! If you have any Qs, feel free to ask.

My home wall.

Kevin Hilgert · · Unknown Hometown · Joined Jun 2012 · Points: 5

Thanks for the input/advice everyone.

Andy, like I said I have been doing lots of research for about the last ~6 months, and I have indeed seen those threads you linked multiple times (as well as multiple visits to your own site, and numerous others), especially the show us your woody thread too many times to count!

Option 2 does seem to be the way to go... but any other advice is welcomed.

Thanks again.

Kevin Hilgert · · Unknown Hometown · Joined Jun 2012 · Points: 5

Well, only about a year later and finally ready to start construction! Crazy how life gets in the way sometimes.

Quick question: I have a crap-ton of 2 1/2" 1/4" thick (#14) deck screws leftover from another project. I am really hoping to be able to use these screws, but the Metolius plans call for 3.5" long screws. If I can use the screws I have I can start building; otherwise I need to wait for more funds to come in. I figured at worst I could countersink my holes 1/2" and that would be pushing the screws right to the edge of the framing (using 2x framing for the framing, ergo 3" thick). Seems good to me, but... checking for affirmation.

FYI there will be two spans... one will be 12' vertical gain and the other 10' vertical gain. Spans will be anchored into existing wall framing and roof rafters in the garage.

Thanks for the help/insight.

PS: Original plans changed. Basement room became my home brewery, and the wall is going in the garage. I will have a 15d 10' vertical gain wall into a 4' long 60d roof (natural angle of the roof pitch), and a 27d 12' vertical gain wall with a 12" kicker.

Matt Roberts · · Columbus, OH · Joined Mar 2010 · Points: 85

cyber,
I think that I used 2-2 1/2" screws to hold my plywood on to the frame also b/c I had a large about left over from building a treehouse.

But for the frame joining, I used a mixture of 3" and 5" screws--the 5" to sink into the horizontal of the truss spanning my garage roof. You might be okay to stay w/ the 2.5", but if you're not, its really going to suck to replace.

Matt.

Guideline #1: Don't be a jerk.

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