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Mentor? Or no mentor??

Original Post
SauceBoss · · Unknown Hometown · Joined Apr 2012 · Points: 10

I've been climbing for several years, bouldering mainly. In the past year or year and a half I've been climbing a lot of cracks and have lead a few gear routes. Im at a spot where I feel like I could crush way harder than I have been, im just a bit apprehensive about fully giving myself to it. I've set shitloads of gear and aided on shitloads of gear I've set as practice and have always felt confident about that.

So here's my question: Should I keep trying to find a mentor to take me under their wing, hire a guide for a few days to critique my gear setting and anchors, or just say "fuck it" and find someone at my ability level and go out and learn by trial and error?

Essentially, I don't know enough to know if I know enough... if that makes sense. Its always seemed helpful to have some one around who can say "Why are you doing that shit, dude??" But I guess anyone with a brain could fill that spot, not just an OG.

If anyone else is having, or has had, this epic internal debate, hit me up with some feedback, please.

Mark

d.c. · · the front range to rossland · Joined Apr 2007 · Points: 0

I think we've all been there. I would go out and climb with a bunch of different people. Keep in mind that everyone will do things slightly different (or not), this will greatly broaden your knowledge on how to do things (or not) as well as help you choose the style/method that best suits you. There will be some climbers that you will "get" and will want to continue to climb with them.

Jeff Chrisler · · Boulder, CO · Joined Jun 2009 · Points: 145

A mentor might be harder to find. I don't really know if you need one per se, and more of someone to affirm or critique your placements. Perhaps a very solid guide would be best for you at this point.

Geir www.ToofastTopos.com · · Tucson/DMR · Joined Jun 2006 · Points: 2,751

You can also combine all of the things you have mentioned. I am a big fan of hiring a guide to learn, and have also found that I have learned a lot from more experienced climbers and friends.

Initially I think it is helpful to learn from a professional as you will learn a wide range of modern techniques.

Ryan Williams · · London (sort of) · Joined May 2009 · Points: 1,245

The more people you climb with, and the more you climb, the more you learn. It doesn't matter if they are a wise "mentor" or a bumbly moron.

Climb as much as you can, never pass up on a partner or a day out, and just use your common sense. So much of climbing is just being humble enough to ask questions and learn from others.

There is no hard and fast set of rules to tell you when you should start getting at it. You just go out and climb. These days, people think they have to sport climb first or climb easy trad forever, but back in the day people just went out and did it.

If you have been aiding and hanging on your gear, you know a lot more than I did when I started climbing.

SauceBoss · · Unknown Hometown · Joined Apr 2012 · Points: 10

This is all rad advice, and I appreciate it a bunch.

I think this may ultimately be a problem that only I can fix. Having a mentor would show me how to put it all together in a consistent way. "All" being considerations about rock quality, the level of climbing, and the availability of gear and how alarming it may be, while still making progress. So that would be good.

On the other hand, I could gain that same experience by just doing it, being ready to back off or lower, and seeing what happens.

Maybe if I know that much, I do know enough. Just never lower through slings and never get complacent about rock quality or level of commitment.

A combo of guide, mentor, and climbing with peeps at my level will probably do the trick.

Tim Stich · · Colorado Springs, Colorado · Joined Jan 2001 · Points: 1,520

Definitely, just do a mix of all of those things. In order to get to it without waiting for the perfect mentor to come along, a good guide day would be perfect. Self instruction through reading how-to books is essential anyway, since no guide or mentor can possibly impart that information to you in a short time.

Just take your time and enjoy it. Don't force yourself into doing any multipitch routes ending with storms and benighting before you know, you are "ready" for that. Ha ha ha. Do we ever get used to those epics?

SauceBoss · · Unknown Hometown · Joined Apr 2012 · Points: 10

All I can do is read books on climbing. It's ruined my social life. But I really do not care. Climbing meets my threshold of interest, so it seems to get priority.

As far as guides go, what's the word on companies or dudes/dudettes in GJ or along the Front Range? I know a company from Jackson, Wyo runs something in Boulder, but if Im going to Colorado to learn and eventually reside, Id honestly rather give my loot to a local person or company. Sorry if that's a dick move...

And again, thanks for the intel, every one. It's helped quite a bit already.

Jeff Chrisler · · Boulder, CO · Joined Jun 2009 · Points: 145

Everyone I've learned from at the Colorado Mountain School has been awesome. I'd specifically suggest Mike Soucy - totalclimbing.com/page.php?…

He's a very nice, intelligent, and funny guide. He's always one to point out several different ways of doing things, and then his 'opinion' of what is best, and why. I haven't climbed with him, but was thoroughly impressed with him in an Avy class. He's apparently a better climber than skiier, so you will be in good hands as he is solid there.

Kent Pease · · Littleton, CO · Joined Feb 2006 · Points: 1,066

Invitation: Joint me for the weekend mountainproject.com/v/escal…, (Thrusday and Friday too if you want) and I'll give you a good crack climbing base.

reboot · · . · Joined Jul 2006 · Points: 125

^^^^^^^^^ Free crack lesson from The Sender? People oughta jump on this opportunity in droves. Too bad I'm already committed to flailing on permadraws in rifle, true sporto style.

Braden Downey · · Bishop, CA · Joined Feb 2007 · Points: 110

The most clearly defined questions are the easiest to answer. So if you're looking for answers, I suggest you come up with simple questions.

I find that coming up with the question or goal is the hardest part, and once I do, it's usually pretty clear what I need to do.

For instance, if you are having a hard time utilizing your technical ability while leading trad, as k yourself "why?" - is it because you keep placing gear while cruxing? Is it because your are sketched the fuck out? is it because you don't know how to jam off-fingers size cracks? etc.

Also, worth reading if you want a mentor:
pindancing.blogspot.com/201…

onward

SauceBoss · · Unknown Hometown · Joined Apr 2012 · Points: 10

@ Dirtbag: Those are good points, thanks dude. I'm not in AI, but I understand the correlation. I think just giving it a go will provide the answer to what specifically is causing the problem.

@ "The Sender": Im trapped in Wyoming for the coming weekend due to some school obligations, but if youre available some other time let me know and I will roll down there.

Elena Sera Jose · · colorado · Joined Mar 2012 · Points: 350

Mentor

Lyont72 · · Foco, CO · Joined Dec 2011 · Points: 220

Hi Mark

A little insight on how I got in to trad climbing; Started out with a partner with considerabley more experience in climbing over me and who was patient, understanding and willing to teach. He soon became a mentor of mine and not just a partner. Following such a climber was the best way to lear/ see what a good placement looked like. He would encouraged me to take the sharp end on moderate cracks and give positive feed back if gear was good or bad . . . If it was bad he would tell me what was wrong and how to fix it!

A little insight on my climbing partner as of today; We both agree were at the same level of climbing in ability and proficiency. This helps us when picking climbs one or the other wants to do and neither of us are afraid to put the other in check. Also when were out climbing we frequently ask the other what they think of the gear. Most of the time he or I already know what gear was questionable but it helps to talk about it with one another and discuss what we could have done better. All part of the learning process which is never ending!!! We have a solid group of friends who all climb and frequently climb with them because of scheduling etc. etc. This is good because everyone has different strengths and weaknesses and something new to teach. . .

Everyone tells me that the first year of your trad climbing career is the most dangerous . . . Make it through that and you should be good . . . Just don't get complacent!!! (Note to self)

So in my opinion a good partner is a mentor.

Hope this helps and happy sending.

P.S. A good book that helped me brak into the trad world was: More Climbing Anchors by John Long and Bob Gaines. I think theres a 2nd addition out now . . . But building proficient anchors is key to safe and fun climbing.

Bill M · · Fort Collins, CO · Joined Jun 2010 · Points: 317

I'd try to build up a group of friends that climb, these people will know people and then you have a list to choose from. Some days I climb with a rope gun, other days I climb with a peer, and others I'm the more experienced. You learn something new in each of these settings.

SauceBoss · · Unknown Hometown · Joined Apr 2012 · Points: 10

Thanks for the insights, dudes. It makes more sense to me now. I should be looking at ALL climbing as a learning experience, and not just times I happen to be with some one more experienced.

I think I just need to climb as much as possible with anyone who's down, and all the rest will fall into place.

Climbing with people I don't know could be dangerous, I realize that, but, in my opinion, is something to be determined and dealt with on a case-by-case basis.

I had this mental roadblock that a mentor is the only way to learn and grow as a climber, and all of this has really forced me to realize that outside of the fundamentals of movement and pro, it's all a personal trip, and who I climb with wont change that.

Many thanks!

Bill M · · Fort Collins, CO · Joined Jun 2010 · Points: 317

If you are a strong boulderer you should have raw material to be some older trad climbers rope gun for sure. Typically, these guys have the money for nice gear, have the local knowledge, and have great BITD stories. As you build up a reputation - good I assume - you will get emails asking to come along as long you lead pitch such and such with that 2 move crux they can't do anymore.

When climbing with a stranger try to do at least one climb that you would consider moderate, but not trivial. You will be probably be surprised how good your "radar" is for true incompetence.

I think the most important attribute is personality. I have climbed with several very competent climbers that I just did not click with, we respect each others skills and would have no problems roping up together, but would not make the effort to go on a trip together. On the other hand there are some people that are just plain fun to be around and I don't mind their lack of experience.

SauceBoss · · Unknown Hometown · Joined Apr 2012 · Points: 10

@Bill: Thanks for the advice about older trad dudes and on climbing with strangers. Im just going to try to stay open to climbing with anybody and learning anything I can, and I feel somewhat comfortable with my incompetence radar. Enough that I know if some one is setting cams with the stem perpendicular to the direction of load "'cause it works good," I should probably say something. Haha!

matt davies · · Unknown Hometown · Joined Mar 2007 · Points: 25

Hire an AMGA guide to show you the conventional wisdom, and get you properly scared about
what you should never do

Find a mentor, to show you how to properly do what you should never do

Climb with all partners who do not set your spidey sense tingling, and welcome to trad climbing!

SauceBoss · · Unknown Hometown · Joined Apr 2012 · Points: 10

Hahahahhaha! Badass... Thanks a bunch, Matt!

Guideline #1: Don't be a jerk.

Colorado
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