Gear Review - Black Diamond ATC Guide
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I just bought the ATC Guide this summer and used it for the first time while guiding with thicker ropes and was surprised at how poorly it fed. We got rained out and went into the gym and the fat, stiff gym cords barely worked there was so much friction. It works great with newer 10.5 or thinner ropes, though. But for 11mm or older 10.5 that have become thicker with use I wouldn't recommend using the ATC Guide. |
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Hi vegastradguy, vegastradguy wrote:... as to your friction problem, thats pretty weird, considering the Guide has 30% less friction than the XP.!It's really weird - my "sticking" experience with the ATC Guide and not with the ATC-XP. I need to take measurements, because if the slots are freer as you note, then the only explanation I can come up with is the weight of the device. It dawns on me that I recently shifted to attaching belay 'biner to my belay loop. Until a couple of months ago, I ran it through my harness tie in points. After all of these years, I've changed. I'd be interested to hear if others who report this sticking problem were also running their locker through their tie-in point instead of their belay loop. This might contribute to the weight of the ATC Guide dropping down and jamming as I've experienced. Yes, the new ropes are plenty strong in their svelte, new dimensions. Those who are uncomfortable with the idea of a skinny rope need only look at the weight per meter to gain more assurance. The obvious problem with dictating the thickness of a rope by your belay device of course lies in predicting what your partner owns. Cheers, Thom |
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I have three devices that I use as the situation requires:
Choose the right tool for the job... |
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Hi Ron, all ... Ron Olsen wrote:Choose the right tool for the job...To the man whose only tool is a hammer, every problem is a nail. I just compared my 2007 ATC Guide with last year's (I think) ATC-XP. Both the width of the slots as well as the angle of the "V" grooves (and shape of the teeth) are different. I don't know if this is a difference in model years or in the models themselves, but you can certainly verify this at your climbing shop. A cursory measurement shows the width of the "slots" to be .545" for the Guide and .560 for the XP. Well, that's one mystery solved. Cheers, Thom |
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This years BD guide has a sticky feed compared to the one that came out last year. My guess... the new ones are made in China. :-) Galibier_Numero_Un wrote:Hi Ron, all ... To the man whose only tool is a hammer, every problem is a nail. I just compared my 2007 ATC Guide with last year's (I think) ATC-XP. Both the width of the slots as well as the angle of the "V" grooves (and shape of the teeth) are different. I don't know if this is a difference in model years or in the models themselves, but you can certainly verify this at your climbing shop. A cursory measurement shows the width of the "slots" to be .545" for the Guide and .560 for the XP. Well, that's one mystery solved. Cheers, Thom |
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Rick M wrote:This years BD guide has a sticky feed compared to the one that came out last year. My guess... the new ones are made in China. :-)Out of curiosity, while at Neptune's on Saturday, I asked to compare the current XP vs. the Guide. The XP slots continue to be wide, with the Guide being narrow as we have both observed. I guess only the Guide is made in China :^) Cheers, Thom |
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Galibier_Numero_Un wrote: Out of curiosity, while at Neptune's on Saturday, I asked to compare the current XP vs. the Guide. The XP slots continue to be wide, with the Guide being narrow as we have both observed. I guess only the Guide is made in China :^) Cheers, ThomThat's cool, but I was comparing two different BD guides(no XPs). One was purchased in 2006 and the other last month. The finish is different between them and the newer model does not feed rope near as well. |
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sorry to bring up such an old thread, but i've only recently got out of the dark ages and had some other questions i thought someone might be able to help me with: |
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Steve, #1 is a rig with the autoblock off the belay loop. Piton Pete gives an illustration but using the gri-gri. Using the guide/reverso/similar device is basically the same, but the gri-gri is far more manageable & you would need to manage a knot so you can treat a two strand standard rap as a one strand fixed to allow pull when you get to a safe anchor in a lower position. |
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I posted a response to this thread about how my new atc guide was very difficult to feed the rope through. I was especially bummed when belaying a leader. Well, now that the device is quite worn, it feeds much better. Maybe the holes are bigger or the coating has worn off. Anyway, now I really enjoy the device. When its time to get a new one I will break it out when i need to do exstensive rapelling....el cap?. |
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i love my guide and it's fantastic for bringing up seconds and the multi friction modes. one complaint, sort of, i was taught that if you ratchet the biner clipped through the rope that it will lower your second inch by inch in case they need only a little slack to get back to a rest. I did notice after about three weeks worth of climbing (8 days total) the biner had worn a sharp edge on the inside bottom edge of the device. something to keep your eye out for. from now on i'll just use some acc cord through the hole for short lowers |
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is it possible to use the auto-locking function outside of guide mode? I plan on getting one soon because i typically climb with people heavier than me and i have used a both a gri gri and a cinch and both help a lot with falls when the climber weighs 1.75x as much as the belayer. the problem is, i don't do much multi pitch climbing so i would rarely use the guide mode. i would consider getting either a gri gri/ cinch but i don't feel that i can give a safe lead belay with them... i know it is possible i just don't feel like my partner is safe when i try to do so |
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Eli asked: is it possible to use the auto-locking function outside of guide mode? |
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Eli, consider an assisted-braking device. The Mammut Smart & Alpine Smart, and Edelrid MegaJul are three such devices. They behave a lot like the ATC, but amplify your braking force. The main difference is how you lower/pay slack, which takes a little getting used to, but may be worthwhile for you! They are a nice compromise between the more intuitive ATC and the locking GriGri. |
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Alpine Up is another good assisted locking device. |
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Thanks for the feedback guys. After much research it appears the Mammut Smart is as close as i am going to get to what i am looking for. |
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eli poss wrote:Thanks for the feedback guys. After much research it appears the Mammut Smart is as close as i am going to get to what i am looking for.I have owned and used the Mammut Smart Alpine. The Alpine Up is a superior device. Easier to pay out rope without locking up. Smoother in guide mode. Smoother rappels. Skinny twin ropes don't migrate under the divider and hang up. youtube.com/watch?v=EogWFgH… |
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Kai Larson wrote: I have owned and used the Mammut Smart Alpine. The Alpine Up is a superior device.AT four times the price of the Mammut Smart, you'd hope so! |