Type: Sport, 80 ft
FA: unknown
Page Views: 3,934 total · 25/month
Shared By: David Tvedt on Apr 12, 2006
Admins: Nate Ball, Micah Klesick

You & This Route

90 Opinions

Your To-Do List:

Add To-Do · View List

Your Star Rating:

     Clear Rating

Your Difficulty Rating:

-none- Change

Your Ticks:

Add New Tick


This route is a second pitch above either Benedictine Punk (5.7) or Innocent Victim (10a). A very nice route with quality rock. It starts with a step-over trough and heads up a knobby face (hardest move maybe 10a and mostly 5.9?). At about 2/3rds up the slab turns overhung and the difficulties begin. Challenging reaches between horizontal pockets may remind you of Toxic, although the pockets are much narrower. Just before the anchors, the crux hits with technical moves on small holds.


The second pitch above Benedictine Punk or Innocent Victim. Both these routes have the same start as Manic Nirvana (10c),which is in the 1992 Watt's guide. Benedictine Punk (5.7) is the left side route whereas Innocent Victim (10a) shares the first 3 bolts of Manic Nirvana before veering left and joining with Benedictine Punk. Manic Nirvana is the bolted route that veers out right above an overhang.


Bolts. Rap Anchor. 2 raps to the ground.


Bryson Slothower
Portland, OR
Bryson Slothower   Portland, OR
One of the best sport pitches I've been on at Smith! Apr 25, 2006
David Tvedt
David Tvedt  
I'm curious about this route. While I think it's a very good route and has great finishing moves, it doesn't strike me as a classic because it only has harder moves in the last 1/3rd of the route. The route in some ways reminds me of Massive Luxury Overdose, only cleaner and harder and having pockets instead of edges and arete moves on the last 1/3rd. I seem to be in the minority on this one as besides the 2 4-star votes here, I've heard a few others have thought it 4 star also and Ryan Lawson also gave it 4 stars in his little red book(his route). It has high quality rock but to me that doesn't make up for 10- moves on the first 2/3rds of an 11b route. What to you makes it a 4 star route? For me, if it had 80 feet of those finishing pockets... but then of course it'd be a 5.12... Apr 28, 2006
Bryson Slothower
Portland, OR
Bryson Slothower   Portland, OR
I did this route for the 1st time weekend before last...I went back and did it again last weekend.
I think the fact that is a second pitch above a nice ledge adds to the over-all quality of the climb. I agree that the bottom part of the climb is easy but it is fun. For me a climb doesn't have to be sustained and difficult to be good, it just has to be fun.
Would this still be a great climb it it never got above 5.10...??? in my opinion yes.

David, would you say the same thing about Overboard?

May 2, 2006
David Tvedt
David Tvedt  
Thanks for answering Bryson. A number of other climbers see this as a classic too and I'd like to understand why. I too like the added exposure of Holier Than Thou being a second pitch, but while the starting slab was OK/enjoyable, it didn't stand out to me in any way. I also gave Overboard 3 stars, although I would say I like the start to Overboard over the start to Holier Than Thou. In contrast, I like the ending to HTT better than that of Overboard. Both routes are enjoyable, but I would say that the start of Overboard is more consistent with the difficulties above than is the case with HTT, and also more interesting. For me, Overboard might be considered classic if the rock quality was better(although it probably has cleaned up enough by now to possibly be classic- I haven't been on it for a few years). I'm not sure what a 5.10 version of HTT would consist of, but if it was more sustained or consistent, and also fun, I would like it better and probably consider it classic. I think there are a lot of climbs with great moves in a section of the climb but so-so/somewhat enjoyable moves in the rest, and I see HTT in this category. If HTT is considered a classic, what about all these other routes, that also might have great rock quality like HTT? I have no problem enjoying a 5.9 or easier route if it stays close to that difficulty throughout, or has other amenities(great exposure, position, uniqueness, etc).

Any other thoughts on why this could be considered a classic? May 3, 2006
I'd say it's classic because it's pure fun! It's just really, really, fun. Oct 3, 2012
Bridger Mann-Wood
Madison, WI
Bridger Mann-Wood   Madison, WI
You don't have to do this route as a two pitch climb. There is a decent gully up to the "trough" from the left side of the route. Makes it easier to approach if you don't have time for a multi-pitch. Really great route, I thought! Oct 13, 2013
Tony Litke
La Crosse, Wisconsin
Tony Litke   La Crosse, Wisconsin
Another favorite. I love the slow progression to overhang! So fun to clip the draws on this one! Mar 4, 2015