Type: Sport, 45 ft
FA: Eric Fedor and Fred Knapp
Page Views: 5,247 total · 25/month
Shared By: Kristo torgersen on Jul 29, 2001 with updates from Mark Roth and 1 other
Admins: Leo Paik, John McNamee, Frances Fierst, Monty, Monomaniac

You & This Route

140 Opinions

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Access Issue: Temporary Trail and Raptor Closures Details
Access Issue: Routes on Der Zerkle are closed from 1 April to 1 September Details


This line begins by climbing straight up on left angling rails and a three finger pocket to an enormous hueco. These moves are the first of two cruxes, and are unprotected, so have your belayer spot you through these moves. From the hueco, pull up on jugs to gain a ledge and stand up to gain the first bolt. Staying right makes for a more consistent and sustained climb, moving through a series of small edges and horizontal cracks past another bolt to gain a good stance below the overhang (this can be avoided on easier ground by climbing up left on huecos and stepping back right). Second crux: avoid the overhang by moving out right around a small corner on crimpers, and surging up right (a bit reachy) to more crimpers and a stance above the overhang, and the third bolt. From here, it's a couple moderate moves up left to gain the anchors.

Lower off or top out and walk off to the north.


This originally had three bolts to anchors. Per Mark Roth, now it has 4 bolts to the anchors.


Leo Paik
Westminster, Colorado
Leo Paik   Westminster, Colorado  
Skip the 1st section and start on Final Solution and use the last crux to create a moderate 10a. Jul 25, 2002
Tony B
Around Boulder, CO
  5.11a R
Tony B   Around Boulder, CO
  5.11a R
The top felt a little harder than Leo suggested as a 5.10a, but the bottom easier than the given grade of 11c. Going ground up as intended, directly through the first crux (unprotected) was probably 5.11a. The feet are insecure for the first meter of climbing, but then it gets less chancey- hard still, but less chancey. Sep 9, 2002
Doug Redosh
Golden, CO
Doug Redosh   Golden, CO
I was there with Leo that day. If you don't heelhook, it feels a lot harder than 10a! Nice place to climb on a hot summer day, since it is shady. Sep 12, 2002
Did the route on 4-26-03. The top anchors are getting scary! My guess is people have been TR'ing directly through the cold shuts, not on QDs. The shuts are worn halfway through and are rusty. Anyone coming up to do the route might think about bringing a couple of cold shuts and a small crescent to replace them. Apr 27, 2003
There is a formal approval process in place with Boulder Open Space and Moutain Parks to replace fixed gear in the Flatirons, which is being taken over by the Flatirons Climbing Council's Fixed Hardware Review Committee (more details to follow in the next few weeks). Gear replacement requests will be reviewed and expedited on a regular basis.

Thanks Jun 25, 2003
In the case of worn out hangers, a don't ask/don't tell policy is probably in order. Jun 25, 2003
I think it would be helpful to define the terms being used so as to avoid ambiguity. In the trade world of masonry, from which climbers borrowed the technology, the term anchor refers to that portion of the hardware that is directly secured to the rock. It does not refer to anything attached to the anchor, in this case a cold-shut. We climbers are accustomed to referring to the entire get-up as an anchor or bolt, and that's fine. In this instance OSMP draws a distinction between the hanger / cold-shut and the rock anchor / bolt. Nobody is suggesting that the anchor / bolt be modified in any way. One simply has to loosen the nut or bolt, remove and replace the cold shut, and tighten. This is a simple matter of upgrading the hanger / cold shut. Permission is not needed, just beneficence. As a rule of thumb, if you need anything more than a wrench to do the job, get permission from OSMP.

For the record, anyone interested in replacing old gear with new gear in the Flatirons must still contact OSMP directly, not FHRC. OSMP has and will continue to coordinate this effort.

P.S. Hat's off to FCC for their diplomacy and years of persistence. Our kids and grandkids may be the beneficiaries of their fine work! Jun 25, 2003
David A. Turner
David A. Turner  
I am the Chair of the Flatirons Climbing Council, and I believe that Patrick is correct. If it is just a matter of replacing a [hanger], no bureaucracy is required. If the bolt stud in the rock is need of replacement, OSMP must be contacted. They will generally issue a permit that same day. A number of bad bolts have been replaced including on the East Ridge of the Maiden, and Pentaprance on the Third. On another issue, there will be applications for the placement of brand new fixed anchors available in the climbing stores and gyms in the near future. This is a process similar to ACE in Eldo. If approved, these will be the first new fixed anchors placed in the Flatirons since the ban went into effect in 1989. The area open for this includes selected cliffs on Dinosaur Mountain. The applications will have the designated cliffs delineated. While currently limited in scope, it is our hope that the Pilot Project will be deemed successful by OSMP and lead to the opening of other areas in the Flatirons in the future. Jun 29, 2003
Fun route, though it is disappointing that safe harware is not available for someone before the "1st bolt." As well, I don't understand the logic why the 10 to the left had all bolts removed. Aug 31, 2004
The original top anchors (over the top) have been replaced by modern anchors beneath the lip. Clearly, this allows the rope to run better, but we bolted this in the 80s and we weren't so clued in. We didn't bolt the lower bit because it was an established boulder problem that had been climbed many times sans protection. The name stems from a co-worker at Neptune's who kept complaining that "All these sport climbers think they're hot when they're not." Feb 12, 2005
David A. Turner
David A. Turner  
V2 or 3 at the bottom, 11a at the top. May 26, 2008
Westminster, CO
jarthur   Westminster, CO
Stay true to the route and go direct. Don't bail out by traversing into it from the left. This route is really good if you just stay direct at the start. The hardest move is moving to the left hand pocket before grabbing the hueco at 10-ft. Only a spotter is required. Oct 4, 2008

  5.11b PG13
  5.11b PG13
Good route. Even with the heel hook, the top felt harder than 10a and kind of excting as it is hard to preview before launching into it. Tricky feet at the bottom. Aug 4, 2011
I am never going to feel okay about that first bolt in an ancient boulder problem done way, way back in the day (Dinosaur Mtn was Holloway's favorite bouldering area). What a gorgeous problem too and then that putrid stick-clip bolt for the weak. The whole idea is weak. I've bolted some stupid stuff, and I am even glad some of it got chopped and is now left for TRing, but this one.... Oh well, no more clinging to old school ways. That's all dead now, and let's face it, they were awfully confused too. Welcome the long lame age of weenbag gym climbers. I just try not to look at that bolt as I climb past. Jun 24, 2012
Adam Brink
on the road
Adam Brink   on the road
I'm with you, Paul. The new bolt is lame and unnecessary. If a toprope is wanted for the first section, one can boulder around it and clip the original first bolt. Jun 24, 2012
Paul Glover, myself, and another friend climbed the bouldering start back in 1983. There was no chalk, no bolts, and no indication that anyone had climbed here. Paul got it first. I think that I was handicapped by my full size hiking boots as I had not yet acquired a pair of climbing shoes. We were 16 at the time and thought that we had done a cool first ascent. Doing a little research in Erickson's "Rocky Heights" guidebook, we discovered that it had been done already and was called "The Brown Eye Wall". I emphasize with Paul's comment and the fact that the party that put the bolts in didn't add the first bolt in deference to the people who bouldered here before. If you feel sketchy about the start, just imagine a geeky, bumbly kid in old school hiking boots sans chalk rising to the challenge and being all the wiser for it. Ah, those were the days of high adventure! Oct 21, 2012
Gee, I sure wish I was badass enough to have done this in hiking boots AND no chalk!!! WOW! It sure does suck that there is another first bolt. I mean, God forbid someone might have to skip it to get a riskier and more fulfilling experience. Actually I think Paul is right, sometimes it's better to just chop some routes and make people have to toprope, because what is better than toproping? NOTHING! But he is right. I shouldn't cling to oldschool ways. But seriously, new climbers suck. Hard. If they ever wanted to climb as hardcore as I was back in the good old days, they would skip the first TWO bolts. But then you might get sick looking at them as you go by and puke at the disgusting sight of a bolt and then fall down and break your leg because you weren't clipped in. Sure would be an insult to the pride. Apr 7, 2013
clarkbeau   boulder
Pretty fun route. Skip all the comments on bolting, and just go do it, whether you stick clip the 1st bolt or bypass it. I clipped the bolt for the onsight, but I feel good enough to skip it from now on. Who gives a shit?!?! Oct 17, 2014
Boulder, CO
L G   Boulder, CO
Start on small, but sufficient, feet for the bouldery start. Recommend stick clipping the first bolt. Glad this route was brought up-to-date. Jun 28, 2015
Peter Beal
Boulder Colorado
Peter Beal   Boulder Colorado
Did this today and kind of have to agree that the first bolt seems pointless. Ground up, it protects nothing important, and it seems easy enough to top-rope it if you want. My advice would be to bring one bouldering pad, especially with the recent trail work, as the landing is reasonably flat and broad. Jul 11, 2016
I felt the bottom boulder was no harder than V2, and there are at least three different ways to finish the route above the final bulge. The direct finish is the hardest and makes the route at least 11c, going right is easier. Oct 16, 2016
The route described here is not Hot If You're Not. Hot if You're Not is the route folks are calling Absolution. You may want to reverse the info. Sep 25, 2017
John RB
Superior, CO
John RB   Superior, CO
Feels to me like a V2 boulder problem to a ledge. Then 5.8 to a V1 to the chains. So yeah, 11b is about right.

The starting boulder problem is really cool and worth doing on its own (and apparently was done for a long while simply as a boulder problem). The middle section is overhanging and super fun but of course a huge step down in difficulty from the start and finish. The top V1 (if you go right) is meh and a little awkward (for me at least) but exciting above the last bolt. Overall, I think this is a great route... definitely worth doing. May 29, 2018