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Routes in Echo Rock - West Face

April Fools T 5.10c 6b 20 VII 20 E2 5b R
Battle of the Bulge T 5.11c 6c+ 24 VIII- 24 E4 6a
Cherrie Pie T 5.11a 6c 22 VII+ 22 E3 5c
Cherry Bomb T 5.10c 6b 20 VII 20 E2 5b
Cole-Evans T 5.9 5c 17 VI 17 HVS 5a
Double Dip T 5.6 4c 14 V 12 S 4b
Eff Four T 5.6 4c 14 V 12 S 4b
Falcon and The Snowman, The T 5.10c 6b 20 VII 20 E2 5b PG13
Fall from Grace T 5.10c 6b 20 VII 20 E2 5b
Forbidden Paradise T 5.10b 6a+ 19 VII- 19 E2 5b
Gone in 60 Seconds T 5.10a 6a 18 VI+ 18 E1 5a R
Heart and Sole T 5.10a 6a 18 VI+ 18 E1 5a
Highway 62 T 5.9 5c 17 VI 17 HVS 5a
In Like Flynn TR 5.10a 6a 18 VI+ 18 E1 5a
Legolas T 5.10c 6b 20 VII 20 E2 5b
Love and Rockets T 5.10b 6a+ 19 VII- 19 E2 5b
Minute Man T 5.10d 6b+ 21 VII+ 21 E3 5b
Penny Lane T 5.8 5b 16 VI- 15 HVS 4c
Quick Draw McGraw T 5.10a 6a 18 VI+ 18 E1 5a
Raindogs TR 5.7 5a 15 V+ 13 MVS 4b
Respect The Pouch S 5.9 5c 17 VI 17 HVS 5a
Stichter Quits T 5.7 5a 15 V+ 13 MVS 4b
Stick to What T 5.9 5c 17 VI 17 HVS 5a R
Such a Sandwich TR 5.10c 6b 20 VII 20 E2 5b
Team Slug (aka Cliff Pounder) T 5.10b 6a+ 19 VII- 19 E2 5b
Ten Conversations at Once T 5.10a 6a 18 VI+ 18 E1 5a
Too Bold to Bolt T 5.8 5b 16 VI- 15 HVS 4c X
Tooth Beaver T 5.10a 6a 18 VI+ 18 E1 5a
Trough, The T 5.0 2- 4 I 6 MM 1c
Try Again T 5.10c 6b 20 VII 20 E2 5b PG13
Unzipper S,TR 5.10+ 6b+ 21 VII+ 20 E3 5b PG13
Yo Yo TR 5.8+ 5b 16 VI- 15 HVS 4c
Type: Trad, 115 ft
FA: John Long and others, November 1972
Page Views: 12,968 total, 69/month
Shared By: C Miller on Jun 24, 2002
Admins: C Miller, M. Morley, Adam Stackhouse, Salamanizer suchoski, Justin Johnsen, Vicki Schwantes

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Description

Climb carefully to the first bolt and then pass three more as you edge and smear your way along the prominent black dike to the top. Belay from bolts on top and then scramble off down slabs to the climber's left .

Protection

4 bolts, bolted anchor (all 3/8") but not a sport route
Carla R
San Jose, CA
Carla R   San Jose, CA
Super fun! Felt like one move of 5.7 to me near the 2nd/3rd bolt, the rest was maybe 5.6 and after the 5th bolt it felt even easier. .. I thought I saw a guide that shows a bolt on the spine but nope, the last bolt is just left of the spine.. Jan 30, 2017
peter p
  5.7
peter p  
  5.7
I wasn't too impressed with this climb. Getting past the 1st bolt definitely has some hard moves that may not be 5.7 The 3rd bolt also has some hard moves but way easier than the start; after that, it's very easy climbing all the way up. So the good parts were just too short -- there are just so many other wonderful climbs in the park instead. Oct 30, 2016
Carl Martin
San Francisco
Carl Martin   San Francisco
I missed the 4th bolt and the runout had me terrified and really wish I had a 70m to be able to rap it. Walk off is long. Use a 70 if you have it! Mar 3, 2016
Matt Himmelstein
Orange, California
 
Matt Himmelstein   Orange, California
 
Fun route. A little stiffer than the grade, especially for a beginning climber. Definitely feels run out if you are climbing near the limits. Last bolt in the run out on top is long gone, but the top goes at 5.7 or so. A 70 lets you rap off or TR the route, but tie knots int h ends since at takes all of a 70m.
@IMG-111606215> Feb 7, 2016
The Billy Goat
fontana,ca
  5.7
The Billy Goat   fontana,ca
  5.7
Great route for your first sport lead, the crux is low. The route has a lot of traffic and has gotten pretty smooth over the years. It;s just a simple fun route. My first sport lead and my first whipper. Enjoy! Jan 12, 2016
The Billy Goat
fontana,ca
  5.7
The Billy Goat   fontana,ca
  5.7
Last few times I climb seemed like the route is getting pretty heavy traffic and a bit smoother than I remember. Great route though, lots of fun. Jan 4, 2016
Griffin Costello
San Francisco
  5.7 R
Griffin Costello   San Francisco
  5.7 R
Awesome. Did it right at sundown and it feels runny at the top but fun Slab climbing. Nov 28, 2015
Cron
Barrington, NH
 
Cron   Barrington, NH
 
Felt a bit runout from the last bolt to the anchor. Fun exposure on that spine. Mar 26, 2014
Ryan Watts
Bishop, CA
  5.8
Ryan Watts   Bishop, CA
  5.8
Cool looking line and worth doing if you're in the area but the climbing isn't necessarily "classic" IMO.

Also not nearly as slick as I was lead to believe. I climbed it today in full sun and thought there was a small section of 5.8 between bolts 1 and 2. The rest is significantly easier. Don't pitch from the top though... Feb 19, 2014
Rodger Raubach
  5.7 PG13
Rodger Raubach  
  5.7 PG13
To keep everybody (myself included) happy, why don't we simply call the route "Stichter Quit Before He Got the Anchor in Place?"

I'd more seriously suggest the substructure be called the "Black Tide Dike," and keep the present name as a route thereon. Apr 21, 2013
Jan Tarculas
Riverside, Ca
  5.7
Jan Tarculas   Riverside, Ca
  5.7
70 meter raps ok. Rope tip ends about 3-4 feet above the ground Feb 23, 2013
Mike Holley
Boone, NC
 
Mike Holley   Boone, NC
 
Fun, casual Route! Slick Slab down low leads to very, very easy run out up high! I suppose it is so popular due to historical Reasons! Fun nonetheless! Dec 11, 2012
Canon
  5.7
Canon  
  5.7
The runout at the top is on EASY terrain. Simul-rapping on a newish 60m rope got us below the first bolt on easy slab. I really don't know how this route is so highly regarded. There are much better Josh slab climbs out there. Nov 17, 2012
Rob M
Shangri-LA
Rob M   Shangri-LA
No worries RTM. Partly on me. I could have topped and walked off-just wasn't familiar enough with it. Classic Josh-got in my head a bit. May 1, 2012
RTM
RTM  
My appologies, I will make a note of it for the next one. I recall though, that is was pretty easy to walk down that last 10ft of ramp. Apr 11, 2012
Rob M
Shangri-LA
Rob M   Shangri-LA
The new JT guide by Miramontes has it listed as 100 feet. I thought that didn't look right, and it's not. I'd have to look at the guide again to see if there was other beta, because I only glanced at it after borrowing it from a nearby party.

That said, I got 15 feet above the last piece and yelled down to ask if I had passed the halfway mark and find that it had. I looked up and the anchors were nowhere in sight.

Down-climbed and bailed. Use a 70 or bring two ropes.

Stopped by Coyote Corner on way out and looked at Falcon's short guide; had it listed at 113'.

The party who was next to us that I borrowed the guide from also had the same issue on the neighboring route. Apr 10, 2012
Jim21
  5.7 R
Jim21  
  5.7 R
One of my first outdoor leads! I'm definitely glad I TRed it first just to give me the confidence on the run-out sections. Overall, it's an easy and fun climb once you get past the mental part of having little protection. The scrambling to the walkoff is not too bad either. Mar 31, 2012
Mike Fogarty
La Quinta, CA
Mike Fogarty   La Quinta, CA
This climb will always be black tide to me. Mar 6, 2012
Ken Noyce
Layton, UT
  5.6
Ken Noyce   Layton, UT
  5.6
I just did the route today and had a few things to comment on, first of all, I thought it felt easy for a 5.7, I would probably rate it 5.6, so I don't know why everyone is saying it should be 5.8. Secondly, there is a comment that says that a 60m rope will get you within 8 feet of the ground, this certainly isn't the case. A sixty meter rope ends up in between the first and second bolt and above the crux of the route, so be sure to bring 2 ropes if you plan on rapping off the route, or just rap from the anchors 40 feet to the right. Jan 15, 2011
Brian in SLC
Sandy, Utah
 
Brian in SLC   Sandy, Utah
 
Interesting info from the 'taco:

"Well, while we're all coming clean, I was probably the perpetrator of the most shameless route thievery imaginable.
Ken Stickter and about ten other guys were working all day on what later turned out to be the classic route, "Black Tide," 5.8 (or whatever it is). The boys worked all day on the thing and got all the bolts in but bailed owing to darkness. I can't remember how it came down but we sneaked in there and dashed up the thing before they returned and we had the gall to call it "Stickter Quits." Of course we didn't bother to put in any belay bolts or any of that so when the "fist ascent" party came back and finished the thing they saw the chalk marks and had to wonder but credit went to them anyway and that's fine by me.
JL" Dec 16, 2010
Will S
Joshua Tree
  5.8 PG13
Will S   Joshua Tree
  5.8 PG13
It can be hard to see the belay from the last bolt if you don't know where it is beforehand. Did it in 90+ degree heat, and after the crux did NOT want to get back on that black varnish that's slick as snot...didn't see the belay, and went up and left all the way to the next anchor to the left that I could see. The climbing is really easy going that way, but the runout is ridiculous (so don't get offroute like me). Thought my second was going to murder me when she unclipped the last bolt and looked at the 50' penji she would take if she came off. Nov 7, 2010
Rodger Raubach
  5.7 PG13
Rodger Raubach  
  5.7 PG13
"Black Tide" IS a great name for this great route. One of my all-time favorites ANYWHERE! To me it will always be "Black Tide" which is exquisitely descriptive. I need to climb it again and see if it has gotten harder since 1986! Sep 8, 2010
Cory Harelson
Boise, ID
  5.7+ PG13
Cory Harelson   Boise, ID
  5.7+ PG13
What a fun climb! For a 5.7, the moves were very interesting! I didn't find the route greasy at all, although we did climb it on a cold day.

Although the bolts are well placed to protect the cruxes, I wouldn't send a beginning leader up this as they are fairly spaced.

We rapped the route with our 60 meter. The ends didn't quite touch down, but there were large holds making the 8 feet of downclimbing very easy. Feb 22, 2010
Dave Daly
Kernville, CA
  5.8
Dave Daly   Kernville, CA
  5.8
Gotta agree with a few folks here, did this route 15 years ago and then again this past weekend. The route is definitely slicked up (mainly at bolts #1 and #3). Feels more like 5.8 these days. Dec 8, 2008
JoshuaTreeRunner David
Los Angeles
 
JoshuaTreeRunner David   Los Angeles
 
i climbed it few times, and the last time i noticed that the 4th bolt was chopped. but that chopped bolt is on the easy terrain after the first 3 bolts so maybe someone thought it wasnt needed. i think it should have stayed since it means youre doing a 50ft runnout at the top. Oct 13, 2008
Brian Hench
Costa Mesa, CA
  5.8- PG13
Brian Hench   Costa Mesa, CA
  5.8- PG13
I did this route for the first time and loved it. The walk off is dead easy and it took fewer than five minutes. It's faster than rappelling.

It's true that the bolts protect all the hardest moves. May 12, 2008
Gary Schenk  
 
We did it on a Saturday when nobody was at Echo Rock. A really fun route. It might be a bit runout, but the bolts are well placed to protect the crux moves. Mar 3, 2008
Guy H.
Fort Collins CO
 
Guy H.   Fort Collins CO
 
It is possible to rap this line with a single 70M rope. The ends barely touch the ground. Mar 28, 2007
Bill Olszewski
Colorado Springs, CO
  5.7
Bill Olszewski   Colorado Springs, CO
  5.7
Maybe not a good climb for anyone leading max 5.7, but standard JT traditional slab. Is there really such a thing as a 5.7 crux? The "crux," while perhaps a bit greasy, is well protected. Hey, it's a sunshine climb, don't climb it when it's too hot. ;-) Lot's of fun but no worse than 5.7- by Josh standards IMO. In case anyone who hasn't yet climbed this route is confused by the descent beta, the rap anchor everyone is talking about is NOT the anchor for Black Tide. That would require two 60's. Anyway, I prefer to stick with the north walk-off. Mar 10, 2007
Trevor Roberson
Oxnard, California
  5.7
Trevor Roberson   Oxnard, California
  5.7
Just climbed it last weekend. Great climb but if your used to "sport climbs" it is a little bit runout. We rapped off of the anchors with a 60 meter but the rope comes just about 6-8ft shy of the bottom. We rapped down to the beginning of the dike where there are big footholds and down climbed the last few feet (fairly easy). The walkoff is very straight forward, continue up the dike to easy ground and head left towards double dip, follow the east side slab down and to the right. Follow a large flake which turns into a crack (don't follow the crack all the way, it disappears over a ledge!) and head right towards the bottom) I feel this is a 5.7 face climb but the runout may make it feel 5.8 for some people! Mar 23, 2005
Bo Johnston
  5.8
Bo Johnston  
  5.8
I too believe this route is harder than 5.7. I always feel bad when I get a beginner climber on it, telling them it is 5.7 and they get spanked. I don't think I'd call it 5.9 yet but it's heading in that direction with how polished it's getting on the start. The dike move midway up the climb is a bit sporty too! Feb 10, 2005
David Evans
  5.9
David Evans  
  5.9
Yes, this route is borderline 5.9 now, passing the first bolt is the crux. Let's call it 5.6+. Dec 1, 2003
BinkyBoy
  5.7+
BinkyBoy  
  5.7+
Very nice route. I definately disagree with the previous comments. From what I've seen of Joshua Tree tradition, this climb is definately a 5.6-5.7, given that the low moves and moves off the bolts are well protected.

Also, getting to the second bolt is definately a job for someone tall. I was a little surprised by the height off the flake. Nov 7, 2003
Randy  
This route has definitely gotten harder over the years. So many people have paddled up (and floundered upon) the crux that the rock has become quite polished. 5.8 may be fair. The new guide rates it 5.7/8. Oct 30, 2003
I've climb this route numerous times over the years; and, I believe, it should now be rated 5.8. Oct 30, 2003
The best descent is indeed a single rappel off of Stick to What, and a single 60m will reach as I've done it numerous times. Aug 2, 2003
Randy  
While "Black Tide" may be more elegant name, the original name (by the FA party) was Stichter Quits. Black Tide was a "working" name for the route by the climbers who placed the protection bolts on it. Perhaps Largo and company's snagging the route from Ken Stichter and John Wolfe was in bad form, but it was still the first ascent.

It is really no different that someone redpointing a project someone else is working on. And what would be the reference for all the other "Quits" routes (Martin Quits, Sphincter Quits, etc)? Jul 17, 2003
This is one of the best 5.7's around. First lead it in 1984. I agree that the crux seems more greasy now than it did in the past. the runout sections are not that bad. Apr 2, 2003
Wonderful slab climb with four very well-placed bolts. The walk-off is a bit long. I prefer a single-rope rap from the top of Stick To What to climber's right, across the slab and down a little. Nov 4, 2002
C Miller
CA
 
C Miller   CA  
 
Called "Black Tide" in older guidebooks; a more elegant name for the climb. Jul 9, 2002