Z4s vs Aliens for Yosemite pin scars?
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Hey, What do you all think? Thank you to anyone who is willing to share their insights! :) (As a side note, the full rack of cams I'm planning on taking up is: 2x BD C4 0.5-3, 1x BD C4 0.4 and 4, 2x Totems 0.5-1.8, 2x offset cams and normal cams smaller than black totem) |
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My guess is there is little discussion on the topic just because the Z4's are so new and the park has been closed and previous to the closure the weather wasn't great. I've placed a few Z4's in yosemite cracks and I think they'll be an alright cam for yosemite pin scars but I don't think they'll beat the aliens. The small offset aliens are sweet, yes they aren't as durable as the X4 or the Z4(assumption)., but they stick like crazy! After a dozen yosemite walls i've ripped a good share of X4's but haven't yet ripped an alien...yet! |
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I have not climbed a dozen walls in the valley. That said ... |
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I didn't even realize offset master cams were a thing. I have no idea how I missed them until now. I just updated the chart to include master cams in the mix: It looks like the aliens still take the cake for range, but the master cams are still very competitive in that aspect. They also all have the same strength ratings too. It is hard to argue with the price on the master cams as well. How well do they stick when compared to the Aliens? After reading Lance's comment I was thinking about picking up the small Z4s and Aliens and just seeing how they compare myself, but now I am thinking about maybe getting the master cams to compare instead. Does anyone else have opinions on the master cams? |
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I’ve only done one wall in the valley, but are there pin scars smaller than black totem? I didn’t find any. |
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I came up on the offset mastercam recommendation from Mark Hudon somewhere on this site or his website. |
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Placements smaller than the black totem will take hand placed beaks or offset nuts/brassies. |
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It sounds like you've not climbed in Yosemite, let alone trad-climbed. Please excuse my presumptions and correct me if I'm wrong, but is your plan to buy a bunch of new gear and go climb a Yosemite A3 Grade V? |
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Ty Harlacker wrote: It sounds like you've not climbed in Yosemite, let alone trad-climbed. Please excuse my presumptions and correct me if I'm wrong, but is your plan to buy a bunch of new gear and go climb a Yosemite A3 Grade V? You are right that I haven't climbed in yosemite yet and am new to trad and aid climbing, but my plan isn't as rash as what you've outlined. I'm planning to go in maybe 1-2 years (haven't set an exact date yet) and before I set off I plan to put in some serious millage to gain the skills I will need to climb the shield. This is more of a long term goal for me. I also live realatively close to Yosemite, so I will be able to get practice on much shorter routes in the area. I am asking about this now because I am currently working on building my rack and rei is going to be having a sale on all bd products soon. |
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Four blue/yellow Metolius Offset Mastercams are the ticket for the Shield. |
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Mark Hudon wrote: Four blue/yellow Metolius Offset Mastercams are the ticket for the Shield. I did the Shield back in ‘91 and we had 3 sets of blue and yellow TCUs, which worked really well. I’d imagine that offsets would work that much better. |
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When you are buying small cams for aid climbing you might think about getting different brands for your doubles (and triples) instead of just 2 sets of the same. Last fall on the Muir, we had Aliens, Metolius, Totems, X4 offsets, C3's, and Kalias Nuco Offsets. Sometimes an alien didn't fit well when a Metolius did or vise versa. But I can say I that my favorite small cams were the Kalias Offsets and the C3s followed closely by the alien revolutions. |
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I don’t really care for “Frankenstein “ racks like Marlin describes above but I don’t think it’s a bad idea. |
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(Quoting myself here) Frankenracks are confusing mostly to the owners’ partners , but they’re not without certain advantages. Like, if your first blue alien doesn’t fit, then your second and third won’t either. Therefore, variety is your friend. |
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Mark Hudon wrote: I’ve never used any other true “offset” cam. Mark, you have never placed an “offset“ Alien?!? |
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Not exactly, I’ve used a few but I’m very in tune with the Metolius offsets and always reach for them first. |
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One thing to consider about Totems over Master Cam off sets is the ability to turn the cam around and use the other side of the Totem because there are no "off set" lobes, you can't do that with an off set Master Cam. To do the same with a Master Cam you would have to have a right and left hand off set of each cam. Totems pull double duty in this respect acting like a off set and being able to flip it around. I still carry some off set Master Cams on walls but they hardly get used near as much as the Totems. |
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Mark Hudon wrote: I’m very in tune with the Metolius offsets and always reach for them first. Feel the same way.. I love Totems.. but I just find the Metolius Offsets work so damn well.. Back-clean Metolius/Leave Totems |
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interesting Quinn, I leave a totem because I want the peace of mind that comes from a secure piece. That said, my *only* aid experience is on the nose, where I will backclean totems and try to leave a dmm dragon2 in the more "perfect" placements, saving the totems for the funky placements. There's really only 2-3 cams under black totem size, so that makes life easy (metolius 00/0, Z4 .1/.2, and the totem basic blue/grn), and I also carry a red (2) dragonfly, which I've set a ladder on 2 lobes for fun. I guess C3's are nice but haven't managed to place one yet... but i'm also only climbing C1 (as a good aid noob should be! ;) |
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Quinn Hatfield wrote: Lol, I backclean Totems and leave Metolius or bdel behind. |
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Mark Hudon wrote: I’ve never failed on a route or felt the route was unduly difficult because of the cams I was using. Yeah but you're Mark fucking Hudon. ;) |