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an unexplained accident


Russ Keane · · Asheville, NC · Joined Feb 2013 · Points: 170

Neils-  I honestly do not think tying a bight mid-rope to lower the guy was a bad idea.   For real, this secures the climber to a bomber rope with a belayer on one end.  

Now, SethG sums it up well -- except I still don't see how ... "the climber stops on a ledge and the belayer plays out some additional slack".    He/she literally pulled slack through with other hand?   If you are lowering someone and the tension stops, you throw rope out?   It doesn't go through the device on its own without tension.   I am lost here because it just doesn't make sense.

Andrew Krajnik · · Plainfield, IL · Joined Jul 2016 · Points: 1,698
Tradiban wrote: I'm impressed. I've never seen so much written about so little

I see it all the time.

GDavis Davis · · Unknown Hometown · Joined Aug 2008 · Points: 10
Tradiban wrote: I'm impressed. I've never seen so much written about so little

To sum it up: Don't do weird shit.

You're just mad it wasn't the belay device this time.

When all you've got is a hammer everything starts to look like a nail...
GDavis Davis · · Unknown Hometown · Joined Aug 2008 · Points: 10
Suburban Roadside wrote: HMMMM?!

lets see?Wait? It was ~in part~  the Device/Belay


Nope this can happen with any belay device.


gunkz dased
GDavis Davis · · Unknown Hometown · Joined Aug 2008 · Points: 10
Russ Keane wrote: Neils-  I honestly do not think tying a bight mid-rope to lower the guy was a bad idea.   For real, this secures the climber to a bomber rope with a belayer on one end.  

Now, SethG sums it up well -- except I still don't see how ... "the climber stops on a ledge and the belayer plays out some additional slack".    He/she literally pulled slack through with other hand?   If you are lowering someone and the tension stops, you throw rope out?   It doesn't go through the device on its own without tension.   I am lost here because it just doesn't make sense.

Next time you get lowered, stop at a ledge, You go from barely weighing it, where most of your weight is on the rope, to where the weight slowly transfers to your feet. That transfer of weight is where the rope continues to get paid out, and because of stretch (on a very long rope) it can add to a significant amount. I've seen people drop 10 feet easy on a skinny rope stepping off a ledge.

Ian F · · Pennsylvania · Joined Mar 2017 · Points: 1,756

...static elongation of modern ropes runs anywhere from 7-10%. With 175 feet of rope out, that's between 15 and 17 feet from stretch alone once the climber stepped off the ledge. Add in a couple of feet from the rope caught on something above and releasing plus the belayer getting lifted in the air from a 15-20 foot TR whipper and the numbers easily allow for a deck from 20-25 feet.

neils · · Unknown Hometown · Joined May 2016 · Points: 30
Ian F wrote: ...static elongation of modern ropes runs anywhere from 7-10%. With 175 feet of rope out, that's between 15 and 17 feet from stretch alone once the climber stepped off the ledge. Add in a couple of feet from the rope caught on something above and releasing plus the belayer getting lifted in the air from a 15-20 foot TR whipper and the numbers easily allow for a deck from 20-25 feet.

in addition...if there was even a couple feet of slack out and she stepped of the ledge doesnt that start to go into the realm of dynamic elongation - i.e. like a 2 ft lead fall onto a slack rope - which I assume would cause even more stretch.  Is that right?

Tradiban · · Unknown Hometown · Joined Apr 2004 · Points: 11,510
Andrew Krajnik wrote:

I see it all the time.

This is quite true, there is a serious obsession going on about little ol' Tradiban.

Serge Smirnov · · Seattle, WA · Joined Oct 2015 · Points: 283
neils wrote:

in addition...if there was even a couple feet of slack out and she stepped of the ledge doesnt that start to go into the realm of dynamic elongation - i.e. like a 2 ft lead fall onto a slack rope - which I assume would cause even more stretch.  Is that right?

Maybe, but I wouldn't get hung up on the the exact length estimates - it doesn't take that big a fall to break an ankle.  The notion that injuries can happen just from poorly managed tension on a long TR has come up on this forum before.

Guideline #1: Don't be a jerk.

Injuries and Accidents
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