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I Can’t Even Afford a Dead Bird Notebook


Original Post
Verg · · Fullerton, CA · Joined Jul 2015 · Points: 50
Sunny-D · · SLC, Utah · Joined Aug 2006 · Points: 700

I can send you a dead bird sticker and you can buy a $5.00 notebook and have the same thing and save ... wait for it... $995.00. How’s that. 

Crazy what some people will pay for. 


Forever Outside · · Los Angeles, CA · Joined Feb 2017 · Points: 235

If you're not wearing dead bird, you will die in the wilderness.

that guy named seb · · Britland · Joined Oct 2015 · Points: 205
Forever Outside wrote:

If you're not wearing dead bird, you will die in the wilderness.

If you're not writing in a dead bird note book you will die in the starbucks.

Chris C. · · Seattle, WA · Joined Mar 2016 · Points: 322

Sometimes the extra few bucks is worth the quality.

20 kN · · Unknown Hometown · Joined Feb 2009 · Points: 1,346
Chris C. wrote:

Sometimes the extra few bucks is worth the quality.

But when the few extra bucks are ten times the price for a 20% increase in quality, it's never worth it. Seriously, I've seen lesser known names sell product that is almost comparable in quality, but for a small fraction of the price. It’s not hard to get a really good puffy that's a fraction of the cost. I used to have an Arcteryx puffy and I replaced it with some unknown name brand that I got on sale for $60. It’s been just as warm and I barely notice a difference in quality. It's also possible to get Gore-Tex jackets on sale overseas at a good price point. I've seen pretty legit Gore-Tex jackets heavily discounted straight from the manufacturer go for $70 when I was traveling overseas. The same jacket by Arcteryx would be $700. The markup on these items is ridiculous, thanks largely because people think it’s “worth it” to buy quality not knowing that quality cost a hell of a lot less than the big brands would have you believe.

David Kerkeslager · · New Paltz, NY · Joined Jan 2017 · Points: 119
Chris C. wrote:

Sometimes the extra few bucks is worth the quality.

That's true, but having a dead bird on it isn't a reliable indicator of quality.

My Arcteryx jacket is the best jacket I've ever owned. Comfortable, allows good mobility, very warm. Lots of little nice design touches that make it functional, comfortable, and pleasing.

My Arcteryx climbing backpack? Not so much. The outer pocket is too small to be much use. The strings on the outside which are intended for clipping things to are pretty loose so they flop all over the place and get tangled. The chest strap detaches easily and is now lost. The waistband doesn't provode much support because the back doesn't have any rigidity. It doesn't have niceties to make it a good day-to-day pack, and a cheaper frame pack would work better for carrying a heavy rack.

The Blueprint Part Dank · · FEMA Region VIII · Joined Jun 2013 · Points: 460
David Kerkeslager wrote:

That's true, but having a dead bird on it isn't a reliable indicator of quality.

My Arcteryx jacket is the best jacket I've ever owned. Comfortable, allows good mobility, very warm. Lots of little nice design touches that make it functional, comfortable, and pleasing.

My Arcteryx climbing backpack? Not so much. The outer pocket is too small to be much use. The strings on the outside which are intended for clipping things to are pretty loose so they flop all over the place and get tangled. The chest strap detaches easily and is now lost. The waistband doesn't provode much support because the back doesn't have any rigidity. It doesn't have niceties to make it a good day-to-day pack, and a cheaper frame pack would work better for carrying a heavy rack.

Well said. I think they excel in a few areas, but they aren't batting 1,000% by any means, though they've built a cache off of the few things they do really, really well to charge too much for their less stellar offerings. I have really come to be more of a Patagucci or Outdoor Research purchaser in recent years, even though when I first started climbing I was kinda a dead bird afficianado. 

mpech · · Unknown Hometown · Joined Sep 2013 · Points: 2

Link doesn't work...

Bill Kirby · · Baltimore Maryland · Joined Jul 2012 · Points: 480

I wear the size 56 long jacket. I wear whatever I find that fits. XXL Arcteryx used to fit me well now they design their sizing much slimmer lately. That’s fine for pants. I have a pair of XL Gamma pants that are tight just in the quads. I tried on an Atom Hoody last year and... 

Verg · · Fullerton, CA · Joined Jul 2015 · Points: 50
mpech wrote:

Link doesn't work...

Looks like they caught their mistake

mediocre · · Unknown Hometown · Joined Jul 2013 · Points: 0
David Kerkeslager wrote:

That's true, but having a dead bird on it isn't a reliable indicator of quality.

My Arcteryx jacket is the best jacket I've ever owned. Comfortable, allows good mobility, very warm. Lots of little nice design touches that make it functional, comfortable, and pleasing.

My Arcteryx climbing backpack? Not so much. The outer pocket is too small to be much use. The strings on the outside which are intended for clipping things to are pretty loose so they flop all over the place and get tangled. The chest strap detaches easily and is now lost. The waistband doesn't provode much support because the back doesn't have any rigidity. It doesn't have niceties to make it a good day-to-day pack, and a cheaper frame pack would work better for carrying a heavy rack.

Which bag is it? I've got a Bora 80 thats 10 years old and probably 300 days on it and the thing is still bombproof. I had bad luck with Gregory and Osprey packs, but my Osprey Variant seems to be holding up really well. I was actually surprised that my BD Speed(?) is really comfortable and has held up for 5 years. 

I swear theres no rhyme or reason to it. I've blown through Pataguch outerwear in half a season, but I have a Ruff Rider jacket thats 10 years old that I refuse to give up. Seems like it just depends on whose little hands are working the sewing machine that day.

David Kerkeslager · · New Paltz, NY · Joined Jan 2017 · Points: 119
mediocre wrote:

Which bag is it? I've got a Bora 80 thats 10 years old and probably 300 days on it and the thing is still bombproof. I had bad luck with Gregory and Osprey packs, but my Osprey Variant seems to be holding up really well. I was actually surprised that my BD Speed(?) is really comfortable and has held up for 5 years. 

I swear theres no rhyme or reason to it. I've blown through Pataguch outerwear in half a season, but I have a Ruff Rider jacket thats 10 years old that I refuse to give up. Seems like it just depends on whose little hands are working the sewing machine that day.

The Cierzo

Bill Kirby · · Baltimore Maryland · Joined Jul 2012 · Points: 480
David Kerkeslager wrote:

The Cierzo

That's a leader's pack. not designed for alot for weight. i have the old 16L that has a drawstring closure. Now that thing gets snow or leaves the minute I take it out the car. I got a ton of days on the pack and its holding up.

Jesse Coonce · · Unknown Hometown · Joined Aug 2016 · Points: 5
The Blueprint Part Dank wrote:

Well said. I think they excel in a few areas, but they aren't batting 1,000% by any means, though they've built a cache off of the few things they do really, really well to charge too much for their less stellar offerings. I have really come to be more of a Patagucci or Outdoor Research purchaser in recent years, even though when I first started climbing I was kinda a dead bird afficianado. 

Me too, have become a big fan of OR recently, and though I still like all my Arcteryx gear, I am unlikely to replace it in kind because I don't feel the costs are justified.  OR also has a warranty that is the best in the business, or at least I haven't heard of a better one to date.

Chris C. · · Seattle, WA · Joined Mar 2016 · Points: 322


20 kN wrote:


But when the few extra bucks are ten times the price for a 20% increase in quality, it's never worth it. Seriously, I've seen lesser known names sell product that is almost comparable in quality, but for a small fraction of the price. It’s not hard to get a really good puffy that's a fraction of the cost. I used to have an Arcteryx puffy and I replaced it with some unknown name brand that I got on sale for $60. It’s been just as warm and I barely notice a difference in quality. It's also possible to get Gore-Tex jackets on sale overseas at a good price point. I've seen pretty legit Gore-Tex jackets heavily discounted straight from the manufacturer go for $70 when I was traveling overseas. The same jacket by Arcteryx would be $700. The markup on these items is ridiculous, thanks largely because people think it’s “worth it” to buy quality not knowing that quality cost a hell of a lot less than the big brands would have you believe.



David Kerkeslager wrote:

That's true, but having a dead bird on it isn't a reliable indicator of quality.

My Arcteryx jacket is the best jacket I've ever owned. Comfortable, allows good mobility, very warm. Lots of little nice design touches that make it functional, comfortable, and pleasing.

My Arcteryx climbing backpack? Not so much. The outer pocket is too small to be much use. The strings on the outside which are intended for clipping things to are pretty loose so they flop all over the place and get tangled. The chest strap detaches easily and is now lost. The waistband doesn't provode much support because the back doesn't have any rigidity. It doesn't have niceties to make it a good day-to-day pack, and a cheaper frame pack would work better for carrying a heavy rack.

LOL sarcasm over the heads. This is a (probably mispriced) $1000 Arc’teryx notebook   

Also, I loved that so many people here responded that the item in question was indeed overpriced, literally without knowing what was being talked about. Classic MP

Chris C. · · Seattle, WA · Joined Mar 2016 · Points: 322
20 kN wrote:

 It's also possible to get Gore-Tex jackets on sale overseas at a good price point. I've seen pretty legit Gore-Tex jackets heavily discounted straight from the manufacturer go for $70 when I was traveling overseas. The same jacket by Arcteryx would be $700. 

Im really curious where you are talking about here. I’ve been to quite a few “climbing destinations” around the world now and have only seen gear sell for significantly more expensive. It seems that North American and European alpine goods go for +50-100% in Peru and Ecuador. Prices are high in Nepal, and you can’t be certain if you are even getting real products. In Russia, I literally had a local guy in a mountain hut offer to buy my used Arc’teryx Atom SV jacket off me for $1000. Banff and Chamonix are super expensive, but that is kind of expected. 

Jon Frisby · · Colorado Springs, CO · Joined Feb 2013 · Points: 110
David Kerkeslager wrote:

That's true, but having a dead bird on it isn't a reliable indicator of quality.

My Arcteryx jacket is the best jacket I've ever owned. Comfortable, allows good mobility, very warm. Lots of little nice design touches that make it functional, comfortable, and pleasing.

My Arcteryx climbing backpack? Not so much. The outer pocket is too small to be much use. The strings on the outside which are intended for clipping things to are pretty loose so they flop all over the place and get tangled. The chest strap detaches easily and is now lost. The waistband doesn't provode much support because the back doesn't have any rigidity. It doesn't have niceties to make it a good day-to-day pack, and a cheaper frame pack would work better for carrying a heavy rack.

for a specific body shape, their jackets fit so much better than anyone else I've tried. I've tried on everything majorly commercially available in the US and Germany

20 kN · · Unknown Hometown · Joined Feb 2009 · Points: 1,346
Chris C. wrote:

Im really curious where you are talking about here. I’ve been to quite a few “climbing destinations” around the world now and have only seen gear sell for significantly more expensive. It seems that North American and European alpine goods go for +50-100% in Peru and Ecuador. In Russia, I literally had a guy in a mountain hut offer to buy my used Arc’teryx Atom SV jacket off me for $1000. 

I was just in Korea and I nearly bought a pretty legit Gore-Tex jacket for $70 US. In the end I dident buy it because it was off by two sizes and I already have two jackets. However, I did pick up a pair of approach shoes which are very much as good as any US name brand and I paid $20 including tax for them. I routinely saw pants which were arguably better than my Black Diamond pants, but for $30 including tax instead of $120 excluding shipping. Yes, there were plenty of stores trying to charge $500 for a Mammut jacket and $225 for Scarpa shoes as well, but I just walked right past them to the other stores which carry local brands for a small fraction of the price.

I even took some of the pants, coats and shoes from the store to the ArcTeryx, Mammut and North Face store right next door (they let me take the gear with a deposit), and compared the products side-by-side. The difference in quality was minimal, but the difference in price was astronomical. It was a real eye opener into how much of a mark-up there is on western clothing items and how cheaply quality clothing products can be had for under the right circumstances.

Chris C. · · Seattle, WA · Joined Mar 2016 · Points: 322
20 kN wrote:

I was just in Korea and I nearly bought a pretty legit Gore-Tex jacket for $70 US. In the end I dident buy it because it was off by two sizes and I already have two jackets. However, I did pick up a pair of approach shoes which are very much as good as any US name brand and I paid $20 including tax for them. I routinely saw pants which were arguably better than my Black Diamond pants, but for $30 including tax instead of $120 excluding shipping. Yes, there were plenty of stores trying to charge $500 for a Mammut jacket and $225 for Scarpa shoes as well, but I just walked right past them to the other stores which carry local brands for a small fraction of the price.

I even took some of the pants, coats and shoes from the store to the ArcTeryx, Mammut and North Face store right next door (they let me take the gear with a deposit), and compared the products side-by-side. The difference in quality was minimal, but the difference in price was astronomical. It was a real eye opener into how much of a mark-up there is on western clothing items and how cheaply quality products can be hand for under the right circumstances.

Did you happen to get the names of the brands? It would be interesting to try some out. 

David Kerkeslager · · New Paltz, NY · Joined Jan 2017 · Points: 119
Bill Kirby wrote:

That's a leader's pack. not designed for alot for weight. i have the old 16L that has a drawstring closure. Now that thing gets snow or leaves the minute I take it out the car. I got a ton of days on the pack and its holding up.

I wouldn't want to lead with it, the string on the outside gets caught on stuff enough on the ground. Maybe the older version is better.

Guideline #1: Don't be a jerk.

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