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Mini Biners for Cams


Original Post
Josh Gates · · Unknown Hometown · Joined Mar 2017 · Points: 1

I'm putting together my first rack (woo!), and I had a thought: has anybody used those mini, full-strength wiregate biners for racking cams? (something like https://www.rei.com/product/792721/metolius-fs-mini-wiregate-carabiner

I'm going to be adding a draw most of the time anyway, but I thought that these would be a little lighter, a little more compact on the rack, etc. After playing around, it seems to unrack fine - no struggling to get it off because of the smaller gate size.

Thanks,
jg

Bob M · · Alpharetta, GA · Joined Oct 2009 · Points: 45

Josh, that's a pretty common setup, especially if you have Metolius cams and get the color pack to match the colors of your cams.  I know some guys don't like the small size, but that's just a personal preference.  I use them and like them just fine.

txclimber · · Unknown Hometown · Joined Apr 2013 · Points: 10

I have a those on a few of my cams.  They're fine, if you like them.  The trade-off isn't necessarily the ease of getting them off, rather how easy it is to clip the rope.  If that's not a problem for you, they'll work.

Kyle Elliott · · Everett, WA · Joined Jul 2015 · Points: 565

My cams are all racked on minis. I don't mind the small size because I am usually extending my placements but even when I'm not, you get used to em pretty quick. 

ClimbingOn · · Unknown Hometown · Joined Aug 2008 · Points: 405

Don't do it. Sure, you may have small hands and may get used to them, but think about your partners. If you handed me your rack to lead on, I would not be happy.

Get a full-size lightweight biner such as the BD Oz. 

Ronald B · · Los Angeles, CA · Joined Oct 2016 · Points: 0

I have Edelrid 19g racking 'biners on my smaller cams, and although I love them, most of my climbing partners hate them. I'm switching to BD Ozs (which I currently use on my larger cams) for all my cams to make everyone happy. I do really like the fact that the Ozs have the snagless nose.

kevin deweese · · Oakland, Ca · Joined Jan 2007 · Points: 355

So you’re asking if ANYONE has ever thought to use a piece of gear for the exact purpose it was developed and advertised for? Yeah, probably at least a few climbers have thought of this. 

Andy Summers · · Madison, WI · Joined Apr 2016 · Points: 50

I've got the FS Mini 2's on my UL Mastercams and Camp Nano 22's on my C4s. Taking them off my harness hasn't been a problem and I haven't heard any complaints from my partners about unclipping from the FS Mini 2's in the few instances I've clipped directly to them.

Josh Gates · · Unknown Hometown · Joined Mar 2017 · Points: 1
kevin deweese wrote:

So you’re asking if ANYONE has ever thought to use a piece of gear for the exact purpose it was developed and advertised for? Yeah, probably at least a few climbers have thought of this. 

That's not what I actually said. I said that I had a thought, and asked if anyone had done it, and could let me know if there's a downside that I hadn't anticipated.

Glass Tupperware · · Atlanta · Joined Jul 2012 · Points: 45

Make sure to play around with the fs mini's in a store before committing!! I've tried them out on some of my cams and don't particularly like them. I would highly recommend the DMM Phantom. Still very light but much larger with really smooth gate action

Matt Himmelstein · · Orange, California · Joined Jun 2014 · Points: 135

I don't like the Metolious, they are a little too small for me.  I use the Camp Nano 22s.  They are just a tad bigger which makes it easier to rack and unrack, but they are still small and slim which helps cut down bulk in the rack.

greggrylls · · Salt Lake City · Joined Apr 2016 · Points: 67
Matt Himmelstein wrote:

I don't like the Metolious, they are a little too small for me.  I use the Camp Nano 22s.  They are just a tad bigger which makes it easier to rack and unrack, but they are still small and slim which helps cut down bulk in the rack.

This.  I find they handle better as well.  I think it has something to do with the bigger groovers in the I beam construction if that makes any sense.

Sam Cieply · · Venice, CA · Joined Jun 2016 · Points: 20

I chose DMM Alpha Light for my racking biner. A tad heavier than the nano 22 and FS mini (32g claimed weight), but handles as well as a full size, and plenty of room for clove hitch or pretty much anything you would need to do with it. Also notcheless, and the gate action feels much better to me than the Metolius. BD Oz is nice for the same reasons and lighter at 28g, but I do prefer the handling of the Alpha Light.

Mini biners don't feel right to me... tiny gate opening isn't great. I prefer the Nano 22 to FS Mini, but had a few with a teeny sharp point on the notch which was catching and pulling threads on dyneema slings (just use them for racking nuts now).

I also like Camp Photon for lightweight, but full size biner. They have really nice gate action and feel pleasant to clip. Unfortunately they lack the snag free nose.

Mark LaPierre · · spencer, MA · Joined May 2015 · Points: 70
ClimbingOn wrote:

Don't do it. Sure, you may have small hands and may get used to them, but think about your partners. If you handed me your rack to lead on, I would not be happy.

Get a full-size lightweight biner such as the BD Oz. 

This is easy to solve, get your own rack and use big full size biners.  I have the camp nano 22 on all my gear they, as I am sure any other similar biner would.  Most makers are making rainbow colors in them now as well.

Victor K · · Denver, CO · Joined Jul 2003 · Points: 165

My rack reflects a bunch of gear experiments. One of them is using a Metolius FS mini quickdraw to to rack a small cam so the quickdraw is pre-attached. A few months ago, I was climbing the 3rd Flatiron, and I did it roped because I just wasn't willing to solo the high crux at the very top of a 1000' route. At that crux, my piece with the FS mini QD was just the ticket to protect the crux move. I placed the gear, tested the placement, clipped the rope and proceeded to the summit. My buddy was soloing and came up behind me and commented about some gear left behind. Turns out I totally blew the clip. Only time I've ever done that. Turns out I soloed the crux without knowing it. I blame the mini.

I want to like them, but I've come to the conclusion that they're too small for the gear to rope connection.

kevin deweese · · Oakland, Ca · Joined Jan 2007 · Points: 355
This post violated Guideline #1 and has been removed.
King Tut · · Citrus Heights · Joined Aug 2012 · Points: 430
Sam Cieply wrote:

I chose DMM Alpha Light for my racking biner. A tad heavier than the nano 22 and FS mini (32g claimed weight), but handles as well as a full size, and plenty of room for clove hitch or pretty much anything you would need to do with it. Also notcheless, and the gate action feels much better to me than the Metolius. BD Oz is nice for the same reasons and lighter at 28g, but I do prefer the handling of the Alpha Light.

Mini biners don't feel right to me... tiny gate opening isn't great. I prefer the Nano 22 to FS Mini, but had a few with a teeny sharp point on the notch which was catching and pulling threads on dyneema slings (just use them for racking nuts now).

I also like Camp Photon for lightweight, but full size biner. They have really nice gate action and feel pleasant to clip. Unfortunately they lack the snag free nose.


Alpha Light or Trad seem really nice, but $14 for a carabiner is just too rich for my blood.

Huge fan of the Camp Photon though.

@OP Keep in mind you can save more $$$, weight and time, imo, by using lightweight full size biners like the Camp Photon because they do more things better than tiny ultralight biners. Clip easier, hold more, handle better, easier to get on and off the rack etc.

If your rack is pared down to just what you need you will find you are continually scrounging for free carabiners for this or that and larger gate openings greatly improve their utility at the anchor.

Of course, being a large handed mook makes me like larger too...I just don't find bulk on the rack to be a biner issue per se.

Small biners on quick draws makes way more sense, imo. Maybe ultralight biners on your cams for that project on gear when you know exactly what you need for the pitch etc.

Nick Sweeney · · Spokane, WA · Joined Jun 2013 · Points: 634

I use Nano 22s for my racking carabiners... they seem to be a better size than the metolius minis.

Kyle Tarry · · Portland, OR · Joined Mar 2015 · Points: 175
Sam Cieply · · Venice, CA · Joined Jun 2016 · Points: 20
King Tut wrote:


Alpha Light or Trad seem really nice, but $14 for a carabiner is just too rich for my blood.

All good points. The DMM is certainly premium gear at a premium price. I usually order them from Dick's Climbing, and even with overseas shipping, they are closer to $10 per biner (shipping is reasonable, quick, and purchasing multiple rack packs at once brings the overall per biner cost down). Also, no tax.

https://www.dicksclimbing.com/collections/karabiners/products/dmm-alpha-light-5-pack-5-different-colours

Brandon Ribblett · · Breckenridge, CO · Joined Mar 2016 · Points: 65

camp 22 nano's are the best lightweight racking biner IMO.

Guideline #1: Don't be a jerk.

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