Rope for a pas system?


Original Post
Addison Smith · · Ohio · Joined Jul 2017 · Points: 0

What would be wrong with using rope as a PAS system? If you tied a couple double fishermans knots together and just used that to anchor in? Is the rope just not as durable or what would be wrong with this scenario?

20 kN · · Unknown Hometown · Joined Feb 2009 · Points: 1,352

You could make your own PAS with cordletee if you wanted, but having some device with a half-dozen knots in it is quite bulky, heavy and you're counting on several knots in a row needing to hold otherwise the device would fail. A better alternative would be to buy a 3' or 4' sling and just tie a few overhand knots in along it's length thereby making pockets wherever you want. If you do that, use a nylon sling instead of a Dyneema one though as girth hitching a skinny Dyneema sling through your tie in points will destroy the leg loop tie in point very quickly.

Bryce Adamson · · Unknown Hometown · Joined Apr 2015 · Points: 178

"Down with the PAS thong!"

-Hermann Buhl (OK, probably not)

-Aleks Zebastian

-Me

Bryce Adamson · · Unknown Hometown · Joined Apr 2015 · Points: 178

In all seriousness, what climbing context is this for? You probably don't even need a PAS or PAS substitute.

David Kerkeslager · · Brooklyn, NY · Joined Jan 2017 · Points: 45

There's nothing wrong with using rope/cord for a PAS. There are three systems I know of for doing this (from most common to least common):

  1. Purcell Prussik
  2. Petzl's Connect-Adjust System

Bryce, you almost never need a PAS, and it's worth knowing how to do without. But there are a lot of situations where using a PAS saves time, and lots of people find that to be a good tradeoff for weight and cost. Can we just agree this is a personal preference thing and not have this argument again?

Gunkiemike · · Unknown Hometown · Joined Jul 2009 · Points: 2,740

I suppose you could rig up something from 7mm cord.  Here's a short (too short) version I just did to illustrate.  In practice you'd want to start with 12-14 feet of cord, and maybe tie alpine butterfly knots along the length instead of overhand loops.  But it's still going to a catch-on-everything, bulky mess.

Addison Smith · · Ohio · Joined Jul 2017 · Points: 0
Bryce Adamson wrote:

In all seriousness, what climbing context is this for? You probably don't even need a PAS or PAS substitute.

Just mainly for anchoring and cleaning

Addison Smith · · Ohio · Joined Jul 2017 · Points: 0
20 kN wrote:

You could make your own PAS with cordletee if you wanted, but having some device with a half-dozen knots in it is quite bulky, heavy and you're counting on several knots in a row needing to hold otherwise the device would fail. A better alternative would be to buy a 3' or 4' sling and just tie a few overhand knots in along it's length thereby making pockets wherever you want. If you do that, use a nylon sling instead of a Dyneema one though as girth hitching a skinny Dyneema sling through your tie in points will destroy the leg loop tie in point very quickly.

Yeah I actually ended up buying 65cm nylon slings from camp USA and they seem like they would work really well for a PAS

Addison Smith · · Ohio · Joined Jul 2017 · Points: 0
Gunkiemike wrote:

I suppose you could rig up something from 7mm cord.  Here's a short (too short) version I just did to illustrate.  In practice you'd want to start with 12-14 feet of cord, and maybe tie alpine butterfly knots along the length instead of overhand loops.  But it's still going to a catch-on-everything, bulky mess.

Yeah this is basically what I meant but it does look really bulky and irritating when you'd be climbing 

Ted Pinson · · Chicago, IL · Joined Jul 2014 · Points: 190

Lol.  Why the hell would you use butterflies in place of just making loops by tying overhand knots?  It seems like that would be much more of a PITA to clip.

David Kerkeslager · · Brooklyn, NY · Joined Jan 2017 · Points: 45

It seems to me like loops are more likely to get caught on stuff, whether they be butterflies or overhands on bights. A lot of my friends use nylon slings with overhands in them at intervals. I don't see why you couldn't do that with cord:

A nice property of clipping to the overhand knots is that the overhands make the system a little bit dynamic if you're using static cord, because they'll roll and tighten in the case of a fall (a video by I think DMM demonstrated this with static slings, and it seems like this would also be true for static cord).

Bryce Adamson · · Unknown Hometown · Joined Apr 2015 · Points: 178

Bryce, you almost never need a PAS, and it's worth knowing how to do without. But there are a lot of situations where using a PAS saves time, and lots of people find that to be a good tradeoff for weight and cost. Can we just agree this is a personal preference thing and not have this argument again?

Fair enough.

To the OP: if you're talking about sport climbing, I'm sure you know you can just use a quickdraw to anchor yourself in to one of the bolts. I like to bring a couple of alpine draws with me when I'm sport climbing, so that if there is a bolt that needs an extended draw I have it. If not, then you have a nice long, adjustable length draw for the anchors. If you're also climbing trad, definitely experiment with a purcell prusik or 4' sling and see if you like it. You should probably have a couple of long slings anyways.

Guideline #1: Don't be a jerk.

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