Going form 5.9 to 10D this season


Original Post
Daniel T · · Riverside, Ca · Joined Mar 2015 · Points: 35

I have a lofty goal of sending 5.10D climb by the end of this winter.  the climb in question is Expresso out at New Jack City.  Im climbing 5.9 right now. Im roughly 200lbs and 5ft 10in and working on dropping weight and getting stronger, Im kind of lost when when it comes to training for climbing.  I cant really find any plans online that I can follow or get an idea of were to start.  My climbing schedule is Mon, Wed, and if I can get free on a weekend day I will climb, but its not always a possibility.  The good news is that my lady has her eyes set on a 10A that she wants to send this winter as well, so that means we are both motivated to get into shape.

Our two main goals this winter season: send these climbs and backpack the trans Catalina trail this winter.  

I used to partake in long distance triathlon and ultra marathons so I know how to workout and schedule my time but I can find any training schedules for climbing that are reasonably priced, $150 for a workout plan is not reasonably priced.

Thanks for reading and any advise would be rad.

*edited to add height

J. Albers · · Colorado · Joined Jul 2008 · Points: 1,793

Hi Daniel,

It will cost you $28.95 :)

This is about all you need right here:

https://www.fixedpin.com/collections/training/products/the-rock-climber-s-training-manual

The above book is written by MP's own Anderson Bros. Very well-written, researched, and with tons of information on all facets of training for climbing (my book is at home, but I believe that it even has sample training plans, though you will clearly need to tailor it to your needs).

Cheers.

Eli · · Lives in a truck · Joined Nov 2010 · Points: 2,541

Focus on diet and losing weight. You probably don't need to get stronger, having 20-30 pounds less to carry to the top of that thing could easily get you there. You definitely don't need a fancy training plan or book to get to 10+. Maybe check out stevie haston's blog.

Stanley McKnight · · Paradise Valley, Arizona · Joined Jan 2013 · Points: 268

I agree with Eli, If you can climb 5.9 now and can lose 20+ pounds that is more than enough strength to get you to the top of 10D. My recommendation would be focus on the weight loss like you already said, and try to improve technic by climbing a lot. Sometimes I like to video myself so I can watch for inefficiencies (places I was using my arms too much, pulling too hard, stayed too long on a small hold, etc...) then I can focus on improving those things on future climbs. It's surprising sometimes how just keeping your hips closer to the wall or climbing more smoothly through a difficult section can make the difference between pumping out and falling or sending. 

Eli · · Lives in a truck · Joined Nov 2010 · Points: 2,541

http://steviehaston.blogspot.fr/2012/06/5-minutes-training-plan-versus-5-years.html

You can also read any number of this guys ridiculous ideas. they will definitely make you stronger.

goingUp · · over here · Joined Apr 2013 · Points: 40

Honestly, you need to climb.  For me, when I first started leading 5.10' s it was all about technique,  learning not to overgrip, trusting my feet, finding balance, and figuring out body position like flagging, stemming, how to read the rock etc.  

Climb a route, lower off  it, and immediately go back up in sets of 3-5.  Have the patience to hold the rope for your partner to for these and this  is your rest in between sets.  Work up to 5 routes, in sets of 5 (you might start at 3 burns).  To do these efficiently, pick a route you can send, then start to work up making them harder and harder.  No hangdogging, you should be moving the whole time.    

Training, I would do pistol squats, then try to do them with the front of your foot on a block (lets say a 2x4), If you cant do pistols start with 'air squats' in sets of 50 and do a few hundred, then add weight with a backpack or vest.  Box jumps etc (dont have a gym, use a park bench or retaining wall).  Core exercises, like planks, front levers and toes to bar if you have access to a bar (if not monkey bars at a kids playground work - I have no shame), v-ups and dont forget obliques.  A hangboard where you can google session tips and workout plans 3 times a week or get rock rings and take them to said playground.



Stephen Lander · · Columbus, OH · Joined Jan 2016 · Points: 10

You don't NEED a training book, but it's not going to hurt. I definitely second the Rock Climber's Training Manual as a good resource. They have methods for people training at every level. Following the program religiously would be overkill at your level, but in addition to specific workouts they present a lot of ideas just about how to train in general.

At your level, I would advise against hangboarding though. There's a high risk of injury doing this before your tendons are ready for it.

Aleks Zebastian · · Boulder, CO · Joined Jul 2014 · Points: 175

climbing friend,

you may buy the book of dave macleod, 9 out of 10 climbers they are making the same mistakes.

do not pay for  ridiculous training plan, you may buy yes every book ever written on climbing training for less, especially when at your level it would be boiling down to "climb a lot" and "try hard"

caughtinside · · Oakland CA · Joined Nov 2006 · Points: 1,470

Espresso is .10c.

You can do it. You don't need a training plan, you sound like a good athlete, just climb a few days per week if you can and you'll improve rapidly.  

Lena chita · · Cleveland, OH · Joined Mar 2011 · Points: 240

How long have you been climbing? And how many 5.9s have you actually sent? (yes, I clicked on your profile :) but I was a bit confused by notes such as "sent it, hung a little bit at the 4th bolt")

There are a lot of climbing plans out there, but if you have been only climbing for couple years, and you really can boulder V2, then you already have the ability to send that 5.10d, A 35 ft 5.10d can't be more than 2-3 boulder problems stacked together, and not a single of them harder than V1... you just need mileage and endurance, the best thing would to get outside a lot, get on a lot of climbs, work then until you send them, and and build your pyramid. 

a 5.10d pyramid would be:

1x 5.10d

2x5.10c's

4x5.10b's

8x 5.10a's.

Work backwards from there. In the past 6 months how many routes have you actually sent?

If all 5.9s that you have been on in the past 6 months you have sent, and flashed some of them, then you need to get on harder routes more. Get on some 5.10bs, 5.10a's, and start building 5.10b pyramid-- all you need is one 5.10b, and two 5.10a's, if you are sending 5.9s you should get this pretty quickly. Once you have that, start building the pyramid one grade higher, etc.

Have you actually tried this 5.10d yet? Just getting on that 5.10d that you have your heart set on, and trying it a bunch of times will probably get you to a send, too... but building the base is a better way to go, long-term.

Getting on your "dream" project is a good way to figure out what you need to focus on. Maybe the hardest part for you is a high step rock over, and you need to find more moves like that when you are climbing indoors, or on other routes you work. Maybe you have trouble with a layback move, or balance, or whatever. Until you try it, you wouldn't know.

Lots of books out there, but IMO they are aimed at people with a bit more mileage under their belt, and a good foundation of technique.

Mike Womack · · Los Angeles, CA · Joined Mar 2014 · Points: 1,297

Agreed with Aleks here... Don't focus on losing weight or even creating plans - but instead just go out there and climb, climb, climb.  Hop on your project and see what it's like.  I bet you'll get it a lot faster than you think.  Let me know if you need a belayer - I need to get back out to NJC! Cool place for sure

Brian Carver · · Boulder, Co · Joined Jul 2015 · Points: 30
goingUp wrote:

Honestly, you need to climb.  For me, when I first started leading 5.10' s it was all about technique,  learning not to overgrip, trusting my feet, finding balance, and figuring out body position like flagging, stemming, how to read the rock etc.  

+1 to this. Get as much mileage in as you can on as many different rock types as possible. Learning to "power" through shitty technique will only hurt you in the long run. I'll second 9 out of 10 climbers as a good resource.

Eric L · · Roseville, CA · Joined Jan 2015 · Points: 20

Daniel, I'm on the exact same journey!  I started in Jan at 196 as I got my foot out of a cast.  For my foot, my PT put me on a plan to work on my balance, ankle and hip strength.  Surprisingly, the balance work helped me with footwork and balance on the wall.  I started running and biking and diet to lose weight (shouldn't be a problem for you), basic pull downs and rows in the gym (using fingertip grip on light weight and high reps), and core work  stretching while I watch TV (leg lifts, crunches, etc).  Lastly, I started climbing only 5.10+ routes in the gym. 

Currently, I'm at 185 with a goal of 179 and climbing about 5.10b.  Weight made a difference (smaller core helps!)  Try climbing routes without (many) jugs - that helped me start to think differently.

Good luck!

Dirk Diggler · · Boulder, Colorado · Joined Nov 2014 · Points: 225

Aggressive hangboard pull-ups. Try to surprise your tendons. 

Aleks Zebastian · · Boulder, CO · Joined Jul 2014 · Points: 175
Dirk Diggler wrote:

Aggressive hangboard pull-ups. Try to surprise your tendons. 

climbing friend,

and when the footwork it would become quite tricky and sneaky on your route, you are simply cut your feet and commence angry crimp campusing!

Nick Drake · · Newcastle, WA · Joined Jan 2015 · Points: 478

Listen to Lena's advice on the route pyramid (advice I need to get back to myself). You'll learn far more by getting a large amount of mileage at the lower grades and build up a foundation before that harder route. I spent all of June working on one specific route because I really liked the line and wanted to say that I did a 12a. Prior to this I had an honest red point of only two 11b routes, I had never sent and 11c or 11d. I did learn some valuable skills about projecting on the 12, but I could have learned a lot more if I had done more 11b/c routes first in different styles. 

You do not need to "train" in the physical sense that most people associate. Do not buy RCTM, do not subscribe to any physical training plan or even "energy system" training while climbing. 

Practice PERFECTLY. Precise foot placement. Ideal body positioning to use holds. Repeat routes/moves to figure out how to do them with greater economy. This applies more to where you are at than anything else:
https://www.climbstrong.com/articles/20150706 

If there is any book to read at this point it would be the self coached climber, the portions about your center of gravity and body positioning. 

Josh Gates · · Unknown Hometown · Joined Mar 2017 · Points: 0
Lena chita wrote:

There are a lot of climbing plans out there, but if you have been only climbing for couple years, and you really can boulder V2, then you already have the ability to send that 5.10d, A 35 ft 5.10d can't be more than 2-3 boulder problems stacked together, and not a single of them harder than V1... 

This is something that I've struggled with. Is that really true? I've done a lot more bouldering than roped climbing, but quite a bit on TR and lead, and I have never felt like 5.10d is anywhere close to equivalent to V1. I'm consistent V4, have sent a handful of V5's, consistent mid 5.10, sent a couple of 5.11(a). I'm sure that I'm missing something, but I don't know what. What's the disconnect there?

Lena chita · · Cleveland, OH · Joined Mar 2011 · Points: 240
Josh Gates wrote:

This is something that I've struggled with. Is that really true? I've done a lot more bouldering than roped climbing, but quite a bit on TR and lead, and I have never felt like 5.10d is anywhere close to equivalent to V1. I'm consistent V4, have sent a handful of V5's, consistent mid 5.10, sent a couple of 5.11(a). I'm sure that I'm missing something, but I don't know what. What's the disconnect there?

I'm consistent V4, too. Have done maybe two V5s and one? (soft) V6. I have sent couple 12c, and can sometimes flash 12a.

I'm guessing from your own words that the disconnect is how much time you spend on roped climbing, vs bouldering. But not enough info to make a better guess...

Some people are shut down on lead, and climb a lot of grades below their ability, until they get a lot of mileage.
I also don't know how much mileage you have outdoors, and whether we are talking outdoor grades, or indoor, in the first place. It is pretty common for guys to get V4-strong quickly in a gym, and not be able to do V1 outside. 

reboot · · . · Joined Jul 2006 · Points: 125
Josh Gates wrote:

What's the disconnect there?

Difference in terrain/rock type. Between harder routes/boulder problem equivalents, the 2 tend to converge. With easier routes/boulders, the former tend to be lower angle/footwork intensive/static.

Christopher Woodall · · Somerville, MA · Joined May 2015 · Points: 138
Nick Drake wrote:

Listen to Lena's advice on the route pyramid (advice I need to get back to myself). You'll learn far more by getting a large amount of mileage at the lower grades and build up a foundation before that harder route. I spent all of June working on one specific route because I really liked the line and wanted to say that I did a 12a. Prior to this I had an honest red point of only two 11b routes, I had never sent and 11c or 11d. I did learn some valuable skills about projecting on the 12, but I could have learned a lot more if I had done more 11b/c routes first in different styles. 

You do not need to "train" in the physical sense that most people associate. Do not buy RCTM, do not subscribe to any physical training plan or even "energy system" training while climbing. 

Practice PERFECTLY. Precise foot placement. Ideal body positioning to use holds. Repeat routes/moves to figure out how to do them with greater economy. This applies more to where you are at than anything else:
https://www.climbstrong.com/articles/20150706 

If there is any book to read at this point it would be the self coached climber, the portions about your center of gravity and body positioning. 

I think the Climb Strong: Logical Progression book can also be useful. A little more lenient and scalable than RCTM, and combined with that article would probably make a good base for training.

https://www.climbstrong.com/store/products/34

I just started reading it, and have not yet enacted a plan based on it.

Ted Pinson · · Chicago, IL · Joined Jul 2014 · Points: 190

Yeah.  A V1 boulder problem will typically be very juggy, whereas a 10d might be vertical crimps.  There's also the sustain factor...I'd say you would want to be able to climbV2/V3 to be able to send 10d, as it's very different doing something 10' off the ground compared to 60'.

As far as your goal: I would second Lena's question: have you actually attempted the route?  Grading is inherently subjective, and you might surprise yourself; in the comments, it's mentioned that the route was originally 9+.  A 35' route isn't going to have much of an endurance factor, it's basically a highball boulder problem.  If that climb is your goal, I would honesty just jump on it.  Stick clip the first bolt or toprope it if you need to and work out the moves...strength:weight is very unlikely a factor.

Guideline #1: Don't be a jerk.

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