Petzl Evolve Adjust & Aid Climbing...Anyone Try it?

Erik Sloan wrote:

I'm not sure that is true. In that, one doesn't have to extend and crank them in every piece. On C1 just leave them extended until you get to a  difficult bit

David Coley wrote:

I'm not sure that is true. In that, one doesn't have to extend and crank them in every piece. On C1 just leave them extended until you get to a  difficult bit

Well spoke. I disagree that they are "inappropriate" for the situations Erik presents. They're certainly overkill, overpriced, and inefficient for the normal 80% of people on the wall, but this applies to buckle-style webbing adjustable daisies as well. I've been leading and cleaning and jugging with them for many pitches and over many months now and love them. 

If you're a "typical" climber these aren't needed but if you want them, go get them. But seriously, if it's a question of these or another totem cam, (he'll, if it's between clothing your children or another totem cam) go for the totems first second and third. If you don't have a triple set of totem between you and your partners, what even are you doing? (ps. triple set of totem comment is a hyperbolic joke - but if you do have a triple of even a quad set, your gunna love life.) 

kevin deweese wrote:

Well spoke. I disagree that they are "inappropriate" for the situations Erik presents. They're certainly overkill, overpriced, and inefficient for the normal 80% of people on the wall, but this applies to buckle-style webbing adjustable daisies as well. I've been leading and cleaning and jugging with them for many pitches and over many months now and love them. 

If you're a "typical" climber these aren't needed but if you want them, go get them. But seriously, if it's a question of these or another totem cam, (he'll, if it's between clothing your children or another totem cam) go for the totems first second and third. If you don't have a triple set of totem between you and your partners, what even are you doing?

Another point is how easy extension is.  You reach down, grab and tilt the metal cam piece, and reach up.  The gadget extends  about as fast as you can reach for the high piece and so extending doesn't seem to me to present a new obstacle of any sort.

Go for the Totems! Three each is a minimum on the wall these days - Gnarly Marley was waaay ahead of his time!

Hi,

I thought I would add some more comments about using these. I recently did a 20m bolted roof pitch with them. Completely horizontal, with the bolts so far apart I had to swing for them. They proved very easy to use and to release. There is a skill here to do with keeping one foot in the previous ladder and quickly pulling up on the previous piece at the same time as releasing (i.e a momentary de-weighting). This was my second's first go at aid climbing, and me aided the the pitch to clean it. It was the first time he had used the adjustables or stood in ladders. He aided the pitch in 30min. Which I would say was a very good pace and a complement to these daisies.

I hate mine... 

Listening to the recent Sharp End Podcast with Quinn Brett, she mentioned using what I believe was the Petzl Evolve Adjust. She said something to the effect that she liked leading with the Evolve Adjust because a daisy fall was less dangerous. That seems like a valid reason to me. 

Now that more time has passed, can anyone else comment on the use of these? I am an aid noob. I've climbed Washington Column (just had regular nylon daisies) and I am training up for Zion trade routes and eventually El Cap (hopefully moving quickly.) Would that Petzl Evolve Adjust be a useful tool?

Thanks. 

I like them so far. Granted it’s my first time really using adjustable daisies... feels like cheating almost. But once you get used to them it’s pretty smooth. You have to remember to lengthen them before going to clip the next piece (I usually do this while it’s still clipped to the low piece, just before clipping the rope to it. That seems faster than using both hands to do it after moving on.)

Also once I didn’t pay attention when clipping to the anchor bolt and it was pushed against the rock in an “open/feed” position and I slid down as I started to weight it. But that’s pretty easy to avoid once you realize how it happened. But they are so long that could scare the crap out of you as you slide all the way down to where the sewn end jammed it.) 

Never taken A daisy fall on one, but I like knowing it’s not a fully static when it does happen.

Jugging is nice, quick easy adjust to perfect length. And they are very light weight.

I stopped using my Fifi also, just use the adjustable ness to top step, position myself for dangling, etc.. (I girth it to my tie-in points (leg loops and belt), not my belay loop) and there is plenty of length to spare when reaching fully while stretching to get a high placement while top-stepping/pulling tension on the piece below).

Again, it’s almost like cheating since it makes things so easy. Definetly speeds things up over regular daisies. I’ve always used daisies in my Aid setup though. When I was learning to aid I never saw anyone use only aiders and a Fifi. I remember seeing a couple people using two different length slings and a Fifi. I’m sure they were out there with the Fifi and Aider only setup, I just never saw them. (They probably flew by me to quick to notice) (;  But I’d assume that you would still want some sort of tether for hooking and on expanding stuff. And I’d say these could be a game changer for people that use daisies, and certainly worth looking into. - but that’s just my opinion. I’m a lazy climber especially now that I’m older.

Just my impressions using them since this past October (4/5 months). I like them so much that I’ve left my fish daisies in the bottom of the bag after using these a couple times.  They did take a few pitches to get used to, but that could be due to the fact that I never really used adjustable daisies (other than the Yates on a bolt ladder once or twice). 

Anyway, I’m not, and don’t claim to be an Aid hard man by any means. But My first Wall was Prodigal Sun back in ‘99. If I would have had these back then, I probably would have ventured to the valley a decade before I did. In any event, i’m planning to take them to Zion at the end of the month to try them on the a couple trade routes. I’m quite sure they will perform well, and they seem to be holding-up quite nicely so far. But time will tell.

On a side note, i’ve heard rumors of people changing the cord to something thinner. Which intrigues me. Anyone done this? Anyone seen it done? Any thoughts?

Jonathan Croom wrote:

Can you describe this setup?  I'm having trouble picturing tying a bowline without modifying the evolves.

Thanks for the bowline tip! I’ll try it today. (;

Jordan Gans wrote:

Can you describe this setup?  I'm having trouble picturing tying a bowline without modifying the evolves.

I'm assuming it's a bowline on a bite, which you won't have to modify the evolves for

Chris Reyes wrote:

I'm assuming it's a bowline on a bite, which you won't have to modify the evolves for

It might just be my foggy brain from working, but I'm having a hard time picturing how this is done without modifying the Evolves. Can you post a picture?

I have mentioned tying a loop that doesn't contract in the context of home-made tethers attached to harness tie-in points, but I don't recall suggesting it with the Petzl rigs, which in any case are meant to be installed on the belay loop, not the hard points. The problem with using any kind of knot for attaching the Petzls is that the tethers, which I think a barely long enough as-is, will be shortened even more.

Chris Reyes wrote:

I'm assuming it's a bowline on a bite, which you won't have to modify the evolves for

it's not possible to tie a bowline on a bight through hardpoints or a belay loop without rethreading (i.e. modifying the evolv rig) or having a large loop that you can step through.

Chris Blatchley wrote:

it's not possible to tie a bowline on a bight through hardpoints or a belay loop without rethreading (i.e. modifying the evolv rig) or having a large loop that you can step through.

Hahaha, you're totally right. I forgot about that last loop that passes over it! 

In case it helps, I find I can't get them short enough if attached to the belay loop and I don't like the shortening of the harness if I use the tie in points. So I girth hitch them to a D shaped alloy mallion placed through the tie in points. I have carefully cut the stitching on the daisies at the girth hitch so I can pull in real short. 

Chris Blatchley wrote:

it's not possible to tie a bowline on a bight through hardpoints or a belay loop without rethreading (i.e. modifying the evolv rig) or having a large loop that you can step through.

The bowline works just fine. The loop at the end is large enough to thread the “tails” through. I did it yesterday and it worked great! (Just a bolt ladder, but still didn’t see much difference from girth-hitching to the hard points (other than the harness compression/under tension issue that this solves quite nicely).

I’m currently using a Yates shield harness while aid climbing and that has less room on the top hard-point than any other harness I’ve owned.

The plastic piece on the evolv adjust fell off months ago, but the stitching that it protects is still in tact.

I could probably post a pic of it on my harness if someone is interested and really can’t figure it out by trying it. 

You just have to tie the bowline different than you are used to. The “loop” that is normally tied is there already. You have to tie the crossed bight section of the bowline instead of the looped around that crossed section and back through that you are used to... basically tying it backwards from what you normally do. It’s tricky until you actually try it, but once you get it it’s quite easy. 

I grabbed a piece of cord and tied a bowline in that and had it nearby while trying it. Having a visual reference to refer to when tying the evolv adjust on the hard points made this process easy. You can adjust the remaining loop through the hard points with little effort once it’s tied to get your preferred length of the “tails”.

And those “tails” are plenty long. The tails on the other similar Petzl connects are quite a bit shorter (15~95cm on the connect vs. 15~150cm on the evolv adjust to be specific). But the evolv adjust has plenty of extension, even when tied-in to the hard points.

This is not directed at any one person, but just an in general opinion... If you don’t like them, fine. But don’t go bagging on them and making things up about them if you have never even tried them. Looking at them is much different than actually using them after learning to use them properly.

Jon LostVegan wrote:

You just have to tie the bowline different than you are used to. The “loop” that is normally tied is there already. You have to tie the crossed bight section of the bowline instead of the looped around that crossed section and back through that you are used to... basically tying it backwards from what you normally do. It’s tricky until you actually try it, but once you get it it’s quite easy. 

nice! i hadn't thought of that. seems obvious in hindsight... cool trick!

I use an Alfreefi in conjunction with the adjust. I mostly keep the adjust as full length tethers and just adjust the Alfreefi until it's super overhanging and/or traversing in which I'll tension the adjust on the piece I'm stepping on while lowering on with the alfreefi and then put the alfreefi on the peice I'm on and do the rest of my tensioning with that as to limit the cluster of lowering/extending the adjust.