Rumney Top Anchors

S. Neoh wrote: Horns can be made from different size metal stocks. I think it is posted somewhere on the RCA site that the ones used at R does not have excessively high rating. I am assuming that the single horn Euro system uses a larger horn (made from thicker stock) paired with a 1/2" (?) glue-in. Besides, this vertically inline system have a lower back-up, usually a solid qlink or locking biner, which is not weighted unless the top horn fails. They might be nutty but not stupid!

The locker below would be prime! I should note that I've only be on one route with horns and that "two is a pain" was my initial reaction.

Nick Goldsmith wrote:This is the best top anchor INMOP. tons of room to clip in and easily replaceable.

Winner winner chicken dinner!!!

And I'd point out you can use zinc plated quicklinks on SS hangers... Only thing is they went with the quickclips at rumney to keep parties moving at decent paces through routes and these are slower for parties as the leader has to untie.

Morgan Patterson wrote: Winner winner chicken dinner!!! And I'd point out you can use zinc plated quicklinks on SS hangers.

ur gonna die!

Out of curiosity, why not mussy hooks? Seems like they last longer than anything else. Hard to source? Expensive? Other issues?

Other sport places I've climbed have these on easy routes, and it seems to work well.

GO

T Roper wrote: ur gonna die!

You may be right. I find it hard to believe that people can't figure out how to untie, thread the rope and rap. What the fuck are they doing up there anyway? As for making it quick to speed up people getting off routes; is that a joke? Considering how long people tie up routes, does the time, being couple of minutes, spent threading really mean anything? Appreciate what people have done putting up the anchors and rap. If people can't figure out how to pull this off, then it's now wonder people are offing themselves.

frank minunni wrote: As for making it quick to speed up people getting off routes; is that a joke?

Actually, no its not a joke and it makes a significant difference at Rumney.

frank minunni wrote: You may be right. I find it hard to believe that people can't figure out how to untie, thread the rope and rap. What the fuck are doing up there anyway? As for making it quick to speed up people getting off routes; is that a joke? Considering how long people tie up routes, does the time, being couple of minutes, spent threading really mean anything? Appreciate what people have done putting up the anchors and rap. If people can't figure out how to pull this off, then it's now wonder people are offing themselves.

That's what's up.. I knew we would agree on something sooner or later :)

Morgan Patterson wrote: Actually, no its not a joke and it makes a significant difference at Rumney.

That's sad. And I really liked Rumney.

This thread shouldn't be about anchor ethics at Rumney. Each one of you spewing your opinion, which I myself also have one, continues to derail this into certain MP garbage.

frank minunni wrote: That's sad. And I really liked Rumney.

So you would stop liking a world class climbing destination filled with dozens of crags because some crags have quick clip anchors in high traffic areas to increase safety and reduce wait times? I don't buy it...

T Roper wrote:

We should take visit and see if this place is worth all the hype!

If we dramatically reduce the number of "quickie" anchors at R, then I would advocate more education and instruction for the beginners, perhaps adopting the Muir replica anchor system on-site.
Keeping the lines moving is an important pro for quickies, and so is reducing the high-stress, back-and-forth yelling, accident-waiting-to-happen scenario we have all seen too often.
There are numerous crags at Rumney, some much more crowded than others, and not every one has a scene ripe for drama and disaster.

frank minunni wrote: That's sad. And I really liked Rumney.

Frank, I remember your visits to R 15 to 20 years ago. Do come visit. I can make recommendations so that you can get on quality climbs, possibly avoiding maddening crowds and quickies. Do you have anything against Perma draws? :)

S. Neoh wrote: There are numerous crags at Rumney, some much more crowded than others, and not every one has a scene ripe for drama and disaster.

I pretty much just avoid Main Cliff (except the Main Cliff Right), the Parking Lot Wall, Waimea, and the Meadows. Everywhere else is just like a normal climbing area.

I'll voice my disagreement with moving away from quickclips and/or ram horns.

I'm pretty quick at rethreading to lower, but it still adds measurable time to the duration that a group is on a route, and it increases the risk (to some degree) of someone f'ing it up and dropping to the deck. Let's all be clear - untying your rope while climbing adds potential points of error that can lead to a failure of the safety systems. Secondary to that, I've been around groups of even reasonably strong climbers who take an extraordinarily long time to just lower and clean from the quick clips (going through some really elaborate and unnecessary backup systems I guess), and I can't even imagine how bad it would be at the lower crags if everyone has to rethread.

If this *is* the direction things are going to move, then there is going to need to be a substantial public awareness and education campaign undertaken, both online and physically at the crags. If you think people were confused the first time they found ram's horns at the top of Underdog, just imagine how bad it's going to be when Joe "5.6" McClimber shows up to get in his weekly lap on Mom's Pancake at Meadows and finds a set of chains, and he's got no slings and has never had to rethread in his life. I've explained it to people on the ground and demonstrated, and watched their face turn green when they think about it. Now add that to the confusion around Main Cliff and Meadows where a couple dozen people are on the ground chatting and yelling at climbers.

If its really about safety and not about pure lazyness then my anchor wins hands down. Dumb it down with quick clips and you get too many people not actually thinking about what they are doing when they clean a climb.

Zswan. exactly. you are advocateing that joe beginner should never have to do anything other that clip into a thingy at the top of a climb. perhaps this is because you don't like joe beginner and would like to see him go splat.

It would be interesting to know how many of those weighing in actually climb the routes with quick clips on a busy day. There is no doubt that they greatly speed up turnover which is a big deal when 20 people are waiting.

As for safety, I wonder how many of those weighing in have had to carry out a broken bloody body, or seen Rumney volunteer rescue guys get seriously injured while trying to help out an injured climber. I have seen both, and it is worth my time and some cash to make things as safe as possible.

Nick, you are right, we shouldn't have to have clippies, any more than we should have to have speed limits on the highway, but this is the real world, and the kid that gets hurt could be yours or mine.

Dave Quinn has been traveling, but I think we can expect a how to video on the rams horns soon. And back to the subject at hand, anyone volunteering to help lube some solid gate clippies before winter sets in? I think a small shot of WD40 would really help, and some silicone based grease like faucet grease or Judy butter from mt biking would be even longer lasting.