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whats the deal w 80m ropes


slim · · Unknown Hometown · Joined Dec 2004 · Points: 1,107

i got my 80 for $212, shipped to my door. your comment about length of routes being unethical is comical. really????

a 140' route is a rope stretcher to lower with an 80 (very similar to a 120' route with a 70m, or a 100 foot route with a 60m).

is owning an 80 a good idea? depends on where you are using it. if you are climbing at jtree, vedauwoo, etc, where the routes just arent't that long, then obviously it won't be used to its full potential.

other places with long pitches, long raps, etc (red rocks, the desert, the black, etc) the extra length comes in handy.

also, the extra weight... again.... really???? the only time you really carry the extra weight is on the approach. less ice cream, more wheaties....

Nick Stayner · · Wymont Kingdom · Joined Mar 2006 · Points: 2,295

I"d add Devils Tower to the "spots where an 80m is useful" list. I believe a number of the harder routes on the Incredible Hulk are equipped for rapping with a single 80m line as well.

And speaking of the Hulk, a couple of hardmen I know do massive linkups of multiple Hulk routes using an 80. I don't know whether they used it for the 40m raps or because they found that extra 10m of rope that much more effective for their pitch-linking structure. My guess is the extra 10m was just an added benefit as they were simuling much of the routes anyway.

Jake Jones · · Richmond, VA · Joined Jul 2011 · Points: 1,729
20 kN wrote: It is not wasteful in that it is not useful to the climber. It is wasteful in that it costs you significantly more money. Eighty meter ropes do not last any longer than 60m ropes if you are using them on climbs that require 80m ropes. That means that instead of having to replace a $200 rope, you get to replace a $270 one in the same amount of time. What is worse is that no one actually has 80m ropes so you are bolting a line that no one can climb. I know quite a lot of climbers, many who are professionals and climb upwards of solid 5.13, and I can only think of one sport climber that has an 80m rope. I own 13 ropes, and 12 of them are 60m ropes, and one is a 70m. My friend owns a guiding shop and outdoor equipment retailer. He probably has 25 ropes. Guess how many are 80m ropes? Zero. That is my point. It wastes money and not many American sport climbers even have an 80m rope, nor are they going to buy them when 99% of sport climbs in America dont require them.
Fair enough. If 99% of American bolted lines don't require them, it's a non issue. And if only one percent (probably less) use that "ethic" it is hardly an ethic. Nothing is forcing anyone to buy an 80m rope. You can use a tag line, or just climb the other 99%. I see 80m ropes as a specialty piece.

Most people that climb, free climb, and most people that free climb don't own mechanical ascenders or etriers (this is just a logical guess, maybe they do, but it's unlikely). It's gear that is unique to a specific style of climbing. In the same manner, most climbers, as you've mentioned, don't climb super long enduro sport routes. There just aren't many out there. Those that do, or wish to, will probably buy that 80m rope because it is unique to that style of route.

Another good point was made about 50m being the old "standard" and now 60m is. This is just the beginning extension of that. It is not the gear that is the impetus for the developing. It is the opposite, isn't it?
Nick Stayner · · Wymont Kingdom · Joined Mar 2006 · Points: 2,295
20 kN wrote: If anchors are installed in 30m intervals, you can make the route end at the pearly gates, and those who dont want to climb the whole thing can end sooner with their 60m rope.

What about the people with 50m ropes?? :)

...what a ridiculous argument.
Tony B · · Around Boulder, CO · Joined Jan 2001 · Points: 23,295
waltereo wrote:Absolutely no reasons to have a 80 m ropes.
Here is my approximate recollection of history:

1988: "There is no reason to have a 60Meter rope."
1998: "There is no reason to have a 70Meter rope."
2010: 70 Meter rope is pretty standard.
2012: "There is no reason to have an 80 meter rope."

History sighs... and then repeats itself. An 80M rope is only 10M longer than a 70M rope.

OK, time will tell. I'd use an 80M for my next rope. The reason is for running pitches together without simul climbing and to rap a little further without carrying a second rope. I'd use it in a good 9.4 just like my good 70M.

It weighs nothing extra except in my pack.
When I am on lead, the only rope I feel is that which has been used and is between me and the belay.
It requires me to carry nothing extra. I lead until I'm out of gear then I stop. If it is a finger crack, then my sets of stoppers probably got me there on 2 lbs of gear with one every 10-15'. Maybe I placed a few cams too.

waltereo wrote:90% trad route pitches are around up to 40-50m length.
Where do you climb? Where I climb they are typically shorter and I generally run 2+ of them together. Most of the time I stop near the end of my rope. With a longer rope, that is fewer stops. Did the Sabre in 4 and The Diamond in 5 pitches. Wouldn't mind knocking that down a little next time.

All that said, if you are pushing your limits, better not have 80, or 70, or for that matter 60M of rope out. 2X the distance to gear, even if 0, plus 10-15% elongation of that rope length in a fall is going to land you in a bad spot much of the time. the 'Do Not Fall' adage comes back and the rope isn't for preventing all harm in a fall withthat much rope out, it's now to keep you from hitting the ground. But that's true at 70M besides.

BTW- alpine I climb on twin 70M's.
Keenan Waeschle · · Bozeman, MT · Joined Feb 2010 · Points: 200
Dobson wrote:What routes in Hyalite benefit from an 80m line? I've never found myself wanting one. The pitches just aren't that long if you like belaying in comfy spots. Especially considering that 2 50m halves give you more for less weight and cost. Phillip
I can make it down from the top tree on fat one. Just lowered off elevator shaft yesterday with 10 feet of rope to spare. Most routes in Cody can be rapped with a little creativity.

If I could find a set of 60m half ropes for under 250$ I'd go that route, but I'm broke and the 80 works well enough.

80's really aren't that heavy, maybe 10 lbs? I am also a manimal and lug 150 pound boulders to mountaintops just for fun.
Rob Dillon · · Unknown Hometown · Joined Mar 2002 · Points: 730

My wasteful elitist 80m rope gets a lot of use at Indian Creek, and will get me down from the Hulk via the Venturi etc. I can link both pitches on Outer Limits and say 'take.'

An added bonus is that I've never been lowered off the end of my [profligate spendthrift] 80m rope.

It is indeed lighter than carrying 2 50- or 60m ropes.

Where it's not that great is about where you'd think: Penitente, Sand Rock, gritstone. Or when me and the pard each show up for Serenity/Sons with a rope, and mine is eighty meters long. Pulled up a lot of rope that day. If you haven't figured it out by now, it's a cragging rope for places with long pitches.

I apologize for buying such a stupid rope and furthering this regrettable trend. Kids these days!

Bud Martin · · Bozeman, MT · Joined Apr 2010 · Points: 380
Dobson wrote:What routes in Hyalite benefit from an 80m line? I've never found myself wanting one.
As I've found, Mummy 2 early season, Good Lookin' One, Dribbles, Silken Falls & Slot. Also a few routes on the Black Magic wall can be TR'ed with an 80.

Keenan Waeschle wrote: I can make it down from the top tree on fat one. Just lowered off elevator shaft yesterday with 10 feet of rope to spare.

Elevator Shaft can be done easily with a 70m cord.
S Denny · · Aspen, CO · Joined Sep 2008 · Points: 20
Jake Jones wrote: Please don't try to lower off the anchors of a 140 ft route with an 80m rope.
thing about it is beyond 35m most people are just guessing. You can lower off most 140's and even 150's sometimes more as they're marked in the book. No one is actually measuring these, just letting you know that you can't get off with a 70. The next edition of the book will most certainly be more accurate on this with all the 80's kicking around the creek these days,

Nick Stayner wrote:Incredible Hulk are equipped for rapping with a single 80m line as well. And speaking of the Hulk, a couple of hardmen I know do massive linkups of multiple Hulk routes using an 80.
linking the first 2 pitches on Positive requires an 80.
Pete Spri · · Unknown Hometown · Joined Jun 2009 · Points: 291
20 kN wrote: That is such crap ethic. Not being able to climb a sport route because I dont have an 80m rope is outrageous. If someone bolted a climb like that in my area, I would add a subrap anchor. Seriously, it only takes one extra bolt to add a subrap anchor and it means the 99% of people who dont have 80m ropes can use it. We are talking about less than a 4% increase in overall cost to add the anchor. Eighty meter ropes (and even 70m ropes) should never become the standard. That is just wasteful. First off, they are expensive as hell, upwards of $300. Then once you get a core shot, which if you are falling like a mofo on a sport route it wont be long, then you are left with 75m of useless rope that cannot be used on your 80m climbs. Talk about an easy way to pointlessly blow a load of cash. I am fine with creating 120+ foot pitches, but if you do, please add a subrap anchor so the 95% of climbers with 60m ropes can climb it. No one wants to drag two ropes up a single pitch sport climb, that kind of defeats the point of it being a sport climb.
Dude, if they are just using it for the convenience of lowering, nothing is stopping you from using 2 fiftys or sixtys.
Pete Spri · · Unknown Hometown · Joined Jun 2009 · Points: 291

Also, I don't see this as useful for multipitching with all the drag if you actually ran all 80 meters out.

Tony B · · Around Boulder, CO · Joined Jan 2001 · Points: 23,295
Spri wrote: Dude, if they are just using it for the convenience of lowering, nothing is stopping you from using 2 fiftys or sixtys.
Sure there is. If you can't bear to drag 80M around, how do you feel about 100m/120m? Yikes!
Nick Stayner · · Wymont Kingdom · Joined Mar 2006 · Points: 2,295
Spri wrote:Also, I don't see this as useful for multipitching with all the drag if you actually ran all 80 meters out.
Drag can get pretty bad, but typically you're linking stuff easy enough that it's not an issue.

S Denny wrote:linking the first 2 pitches on Positive requires an 80.
I don't have a topo in front of me, but the first two pitches bring you up to that largish ledge w/ a two-bolt belay, right? With the next pitch being the 5.11a traverse bit?
If that's correct, then I've always linked those two pitches with a 70 and maybe 5 feet of simuling.
Ahh.... the Hulk.
MisterE Wolfe · · Bishop, CA · Joined Dec 2007 · Points: 5,748

Bump for an old thread that is becoming a more common practice.

There is plenty of stuff in Pine Creek Canyon that you had better either bring doubles or an 80.

Fixe Hardware had a reasonably priced Roca one - I think I would get a 9.4 or under though to save on weight.

Roca Jungle Mint Blue 80M 9.6

Adam Ronchetti · · Madison, WI · Joined May 2011 · Points: 25

I climbed at Kalymnos and the book recommended an 80 or 90m rope if you want to be able to get on anything. A 70m would get you most routes and a 60m would get you half to 60% of the climbs.

So like someone above said, Long single pitch sport climbs. 

Gunkiemike · · Unknown Hometown · Joined Jul 2009 · Points: 2,860
Darren Mabe wrote: remember when 50m ropes were standard? (and 60m were the 'long' ones...)

Youngster!  My first rope was 120 ft. then I moved up to 45 m (150 ft) for the next two.

Jaren Watson · · Idaho · Joined May 2010 · Points: 2,506

I really wish I had an 80. Many routes at the City are right around 140’.

I hate using two ropes just because my 70 is fifteen feet too short.

Mikey Mayhem Sheridan · · CO · Joined Oct 2007 · Points: 55

Indian Creek!  

MisterE Wolfe · · Bishop, CA · Joined Dec 2007 · Points: 5,748
Adam Ronchetti wrote: I climbed at Kalymnos and the book recommended an 80 or 90m rope if you want to be able to get on anything.

90 meter rope? OH COME ON! Just stop with this stupidity. I am still trying to get to 80 meters and now there are recommendations for a 90 METER Rope?


Let's see what comes up:

90 meter rope search

I thought not.

Wait, what?

120 meter ropes.

Do you just buy a spool and cut off what you need? Stop the madness.
Tony B · · Around Boulder, CO · Joined Jan 2001 · Points: 23,295
Tony B wrote: Absolutely no reasons to have a 80 m ropes. Here is my approximate recollection of history: 1988: "There is no reason to have a 60Meter rope." 1998: "There is no reason to have a 70Meter rope." 2010: 70 Meter rope is pretty standard. 2012: "There is no reason to have an 80 meter rope." History sighs... and then repeats itself. An 80M rope is only 10M longer than a 70M rope. OK, time will tell. I'd use an 80M for my next rope. The reason is for running pitches together without simul climbing and to rap a little further without carrying a second rope. I'd use it in a good 9.4 just like my good 70M. It weighs nothing extra except in my pack. When I am on lead, the only rope I feel is that which has been used and is between me and the belay. It requires me to carry nothing extra. I lead until I'm out of gear then I stop. If it is a finger crack, then my sets of stoppers probably got me there on 2 lbs of gear with one every 10-15'. Maybe I placed a few cams too. 90% trad route pitches are around up to 40-50m length. Where do you climb? Where I climb they are typically shorter and I generally run 2+ of them together. Most of the time I stop near the end of my rope. With a longer rope, that is fewer stops. Did the Sabre in 4 and The Diamond in 5 pitches. Wouldn't mind knocking that down a little next time. All that said, if you are pushing your limits, better not have 80, or 70, or for that matter 60M of rope out. 2X the distance to gear, even if 0, plus 10-15% elongation of that rope length in a fall is going to land you in a bad spot much of the time. the 'Do Not Fall' adage comes back and the rope isn't for preventing all harm in a fall withthat much rope out, it's now to keep you from hitting the ground. But that's true at 70M besides. BTW- alpine I climb on twin 70M's.

6 years later:

My favorite at this point is the 80M BlueWater 'Icon' 9.1mm.  They are durable, handle well, are light, and are available in bi-color (bi-pattern).
At 55g/M, it might weigh about the same as a traditional 60m rope.  Not great for super heavy use, of course... no skinny rope is.
I have a 60m 9.4 for short crags when I just don't want a pile of rope around.
I also keep a 50M 8.4 for slabs & super-light use when I am jogging in for a quick pitch, dawn=patrol style.
I tie into both ends of that for hard pitches as a twin, but can still do short raps.
I have double 8.1mm 70's for serious alpine stuff with long raps.

Ropes are like shoes.  What you take depends on the goals at hand.
Of all of these, my 80M is now the go-to rope that lives in my pack!
Guideline #1: Don't be a jerk.

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