AMGA Rock Certified Guides in the Tucson area

Looking for a Guide in AZ. go to amga.com

I am not sure what the difference in certification requirements is between an AMGA Certified Rock Guide and an AMGA Certified Rock Instructor, but I know Jeff has over a decade of full time guiding experience.

I have also had the pleasure of getting to know Jeff during the time I lived and climbed in Tucson. From what I have seen he is a great guide and he has a great sense of humor. Jeff is plenty competent and very experienced as a guide. There are some other guides in the area (none AMGA certified that I know of), but Jeff is the only one I would point a friend to without reservation.

What kind of guiding are you looking for?

Jeff is certainly more than capable of guiding you up anything in the Tucson area up through hard 5.10 trad. If you are looking for some world class badass for guide he is not the person, but if you want a safe guide who is also some one it is fun to spend time with you can't go wrong with Jeff.

Any particular reason you are focused on the higher level of certification?

While it is one factor to judge a guide by, some one with lots of certifications who is an a**hole is a waste of you hard earned money. Many of the best guides in the US are not certified (by choice or lack of funds for the expensive certification process). Certification ensures a certain level of technical competence, but read around on climbing websites a bit and you will find many examples of people who have had bad run ins with certified guides.

Along with the level of certification you should find out how long they have been climbing and how long they have guiding. I would personally be more confident in a guide with 15-25 years of climbing experience and a decade of guiding than some one with less experience and a better certification.

That having been said I think your approach of looking for AMGA certified guides is a good one. My recomendation would be to talk to Jeff and get a feel for him and maybe ask for references to call.

If you are looking for the "world class badass" type guide to lead you up some 5.11 A3 epic then your best bet is probably to look through the list of AMGA guides for a name familar from climbing literature/magazines and give them a call. Even if they do not have a permit for the area they can often work with a guide service who does and "buy" some user days off of them.

For any standard guiding/instruction in the Tucson area I would say go with Jeff. He is a good guy and has a great sense of humor and the patience of saint when needed (ask him about the time he had to belay a client's aunt/grandmother and her half blind/lame dog up the approach to Green Slabs). Running into Jeff out at the crag was always one of the bonuses for me when I climbed on Lemmon.

George Marsden

I hired Jeff as a guide on Mt. Lemmon last winter. I would highly recommend him. He's a good guy and is very safe. I doubt that the different certification levels are relevant for most climbing in AZ.

As a rock instructor, you are AMGA certified AS A GUIDE on climbs up to grade III. The additional certification is for guiding on longer routes. I would do your research before posting semi-offensive information about a guide (i.e. teaching assistant comment).

jeff is an outstanding guide. ive had the priveledge of climbing with him. he's super efficient, super safe and very entertaing. no one else will get you up more pitches in a day. you can't go wrong with jeff.

My question now is:

Was the original poster's question an honest inquiry, or is this someone's sneaky way to dog Jeff?

It is curious that this is Tucson1's first posting on the site and he only joined yesterday. I will also point out that everyone else is posting under a personally identifiable screen name (and users of this site generally do that or sign their posts).

Hmmmm....if we had not all responded so quickly in defense of Jeff would we have found a responding post on the site from another very new member directing Tucson1 to another guide or guide service?

Is this reverse "guerilla marketing"?

I hope this is just my internet inspired suspicious nature.....

...in any case I think Bob is probably right.

George Marsden

Wow,

There are other guides in the area. Jason and the boys at Rocks and ropes have had rock instructor training with the AMGA and have a top rope site manager certification as well. They know the area and have plenty of guiding experience.

If you had looked further on our website you would have found two guides that work with me, Dick Jackson (owner of Aspen Expeditions/Rocky Mountain Climbing School) and Amos Whiting, both of whom are IFMGA Certified guides.

good luck,

Jeff Fassett

Tuscon has always been stacked to the gills with competent climbers long before the AMGA ever existed. Do you need a guide or someone to learn to climb from? A guide may take you out a couple of times, a few steady competent partners you can second and really learn from are worth more than all the guides in Arizona put together...

I have climbed with both Jeff Fassett and Amos Whiting. Both know their stuff and I would gladly hire either of them if I had the need.

And it is good to see the vanagon on Mt. Lemmon again, Jeff.

Hey “tucson1” … care to share your real name with your toothy opinion?

Many 'Tucsonian's' have a (State Issued) Driver's License! Does this mean that they are good "Drivers?" I have to be careful driving in Tucson with my head out the window, because I might lose it or get a bug caught in my teeth while yelling at slow Drivers.. This would be called "Road Rage Karma!"

Paz Ramirez wrote:Actually, you would get a lot more from a certified guide. Anyone saying otherwise is not familiar w/ the certification/education process. The certification part means that the person has acquired certain skills/knowledge and has demonstrated such understanding under the scrutiny of very talented guides/climbers (the AMGA examiners). The techniques utilized by certified guides are proven to be the most practical w/ safety in mind at all times. The best part is that you can drill these guys w/ all your climbing related questions and they will probably have the answers (and enjoy the conversation as they live for this stuff) as all of these guys do this because they love it, not in it to become rich if you know what I mean. Of course if the certified guide you hire is a prick, then you may not get the full value, but that's the same situation if you go with some person who climbs that you don't know very well. I can promise that an IFMGA certified guide will have more skills in his toolbox than Joe-Shmoe on almost every occasion. Getting certified is not a gimme, you have to know your shit. Certified guides are required to have a strong understanding of self-rescue scenarios, which many strong climbers have a knowledge of, but probably aren't practicing mock situations very often. Paz!

Acutally, that's complete bullshit. No one said getting certified is a "gimme", but it's still just a stamping of some base level of competency, and trust me, the IFMGA has no exclusive hold on climbing skills. Again, Tuscson, Eldo, the Valley, the Gunks, Seneca, NC, Devils Tower, et al have all been cranking out superbly competent climbers since long, long before climbing became commercialized with gyms and the AMGA and they still do.

The only thing being AMGA-certification provides is a way for clueless strangers to tell for sure that someone they have never met possesses a base level set of competencies. I'd say bag that whole approach to climbing, go to a crag, or check here or RC and get hooked up with one or more experienced climbers, strike up longer term relationships, and start seconding them.

Tucson1 wrote: I need some help finding a Good rock guide in and around Tucson. Is this our only "Guide" in the Tucson area? Jeff Fassett Certified Rock Instructor 8009 E. Snakeroot Dr.Tuscon, AZ 85710 jfassett@climbarizona.com 970 925-7625 amga.com/guides/rock_list.html Do we have any AMGA Certified Rock Guides in Tucson? Above, I've added what I found on our "local Guide" who's just certified as an instructor. Kinda like taking my kid to school and asking for the teachers aid, not the certified teacher! I'm looking for a guide in the tucson area and would like one who's AMGA Rock Guide Certified or even better, IFMGA Certified. Anyone know of one? I can't believe it's so hard to find a competent guide! Thanks,

First, an instructor is a teacher.

Second, I've met Jeff and he's about as competent as they come.

Third, why don't you just go by yourself if you're so knowledgable?

Paz Ramirez wrote:Actually, you would get a lot more from a certified guide. Anyone saying otherwise is not familiar w/ the certification/education process. The certification part means that the person has acquired certain skills/knowledge and has demonstrated such understanding under the scrutiny of very talented guides/climbers (the AMGA examiners). The techniques utilized by certified guides are proven to be the most practical w/ safety in mind at all times. The best part is that you can drill these guys w/ all your climbing related questions and they will probably have the answers (and enjoy the conversation as they live for this stuff) as all of these guys do this because they love it, not in it to become rich if you know what I mean. Of course if the certified guide you hire is a prick, then you may not get the full value, but that's the same situation if you go with some person who climbs that you don't know very well. I can promise that an IFMGA certified guide will have more skills in his toolbox than Joe-Shmoe on almost every occasion. Getting certified is not a gimme, you have to know your shit. Certified guides are required to have a strong understanding of self-rescue scenarios, which many strong climbers have a knowledge of, but probably aren't practicing mock situations very often. Paz!

I think Jeff Mayhew is an example of a climber without AMGA cert. who could kick just about any AMGA guide's ASS, esp. in So. AZ.

btw, alot of us DO practice self-rescue, esp. if we go backcountry a lot. You know C-rigs, Z-rigs, munter mules, klemheists, improvised rappels, spider rappels, hauling with a garda knot, etc.

I think Jeff's reply says more about what a class act Jeff is than all of our input combined. Looking at a person's certifications is a prudent way to begin a search for a guide. But a test doesn't tell you the person is a good guide. Jeff is a dedicated and great guide.

hey "tucson1" ... i must have missed your reply ... what's your real name?

Healyje wrote: Actually, that's complete bullshit. No one said getting certified is a "gimme", but it's still just a stamping of some base level of competency, and trust me, the IFMGA has no exclusive hold on climbing skills. Again, Tuscson, Eldo, the Valley, the Gunks, Seneca, NC, Devils Tower, et al have all been cranking out superbly competent climbers since long, long before climbing became commercialized with gyms and the AMGA and they still do. The only thing being AMGA-certification provides is a way for clueless strangers to tell for sure that someone they have never met possesses a base level set of competencies. I'd say bag that whole approach to climbing, go to a crag, or check here or RC and get hooked up with one or more experienced climbers, strike up longer term relationships, and start seconding them.

a lot of places crank out good, even great climbers. but being a great climber doesn't necesarilly make one a good guide. it takes a certain personality and a great deal of patients to deal with know-it-all clients that anyone who has to make a living at something i.e. retail, law enforcement, health industry, and yes,. even climbing guides run into. a climber can say " I WON'T CLIMB WITH HIM/HER BECAUSE BLAH BLAH BLAH". a guide HAS to climb with him/her to put food on the table. a guide has to do it safely and efficiently and provide a lasting experience for that client if that guide wants to stay in business. Jeff Fasset has those qualities. a lot of climbers don't i.e spray lords, holier than thow hangdoggin stick clippin sport wankers. THEY SHOOT HANG DOGGERS DONT THEY?

BTW anyone who has any questions about a guides certifications should visit the AMGA web site and check out the prerequisites for the program.

Shawn, I have no doubt Jeff is a great climber and guide - I'm actually suggesting people skip the whole commercial guiding path altogether and establish longer term relationships with experienced local climbers who can bring them along until they are capable of climbing competently and self-contained. If we're talking about paying someone to take you climbing on a vacation or weekend - despite it happening everyday in an era where gyms crank out an annual tidal flow of folks who really can't climb in the wholistic sense of the word - well, I'm frankly just too damn old to relate to that whole reality; it's so contrary to all the reasons I climb.

Skip guiding, learn to [trad] climb, and once you can - go do it. It requires a commitment no doubt, but the rewards are great.

[ Edit: for that matter skip guidebooks, eschew beta, and learn to just eyeball stuff mapping potential lines to your abilities. Will you epic - definitely, and hard sometimes, but you will eventually develop an eye... ]

healyje,
I can see your point. going out and "just doing it" is highly rewarding. that is how i learned. mostly because i couldn't afford an instructor/guide, partly because it never occurred to me to hire one, and lastly because IM a rather arrogant bastard who chooses to do things on my own. it may not have been the smartest way to go, as some of my adventures would prove, adventure being defined as only happening when things go wrong.
then there are those who need to be shown the way. better to be shown by someone whose credentials are recognized world wide than by someone talking himself up at the gym.

Well, looks like you might just have to go to another state to climb. It appears nobody in the state of Arizona will meet your standards.
First, since you are a "very experienced climber" you might consider taking the ten day rock instructor course (or a privatized equivalent course) and see first hand what the standards are, rather than cut and pasting from the AMGA web page.
Second, there are many great guides with years of experience who have no certification whatsoever. Perhaps you might ask for some references or testimonials on a guide rather than slander the guides experience level and knowledge.
Furthermore, a number of the people responding to your post are people I don't know, not just friends defending me.

Good luck,

Jeff Fassett

One more thing. You could just pick up the phone and speak to me personally, rather than a few cowardly posts.
I would be happy to speak to you directly,

Jeff Fassett