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Pulley System for Hangboards

Original Post
Connor Erickson · · Brandon, SD · Joined Jun 2018 · Points: 17

What would you guys use for a counterweight when hangboarding?

Dan Gozdz · · Louisville, CO · Joined Jun 2015 · Points: 1

I was just putting a chair in a position that I could put my feet on it. I could control how much weight I wanted taking off by pushing more or less with my legs. If you rig a pulley you could use something like this https://www.lpgmuscle.com/shop/weight-plate-holder-loading-pin-6-standard-olympic or anything else that you could attach to your cable/cordage like a backpack with textbooks. Just make sure it's hanging away from sensitive areas in case you go down and it comes up.

Kevin Heinrich · · AMGA Rock Guide · Joined Mar 2013 · Points: 286

As a cheap bastard I used gallons of water and a backpack full of bricks for my super weak holds. A gallon of water is ~8.5 lbs.

Lena chita · · OH · Joined Mar 2011 · Points: 1,667

Not sure what you mean... weight plates?

you have a pulley with rope running through it, one end of the rope attaches to your harness, the other end of the rope gets whatever weight you are trying to subtract.

I tie figure 8s on both ends of the rope, a carabiner will attach it to my harness, and I have several short pieces of rope and old webbing that I thread through the hole in weight plates and then attach the weights with a carabiner to the other side if the pulley rope. 

John Byrnes · · Fort Collins, CO · Joined Dec 2007 · Points: 392
Dan Gozdz wrote: I was just putting a chair in a position that I could put my feet on it. 

Dan's right.  Place it out in front of you, put your feet on it.  Then further out... one leg... etc.   Way easier than rigging a pulley system that's gonna be useless in a few weeks when you get stronger.  

Personally, I'll sometimes use a 5-gallon bucket with some weight in it so it stays put.  I've had chairs move on me.
Ken Noyce · · Layton, UT · Joined Aug 2010 · Points: 2,648
Lena chita wrote: Not sure what you mean... weight plates?

you have a pulley with rope running through it, one end of the rope attaches to your harness, the other end of the rope gets whatever weight you are trying to subtract.

I tie figure 8s on both ends of the rope, a carabiner will attach it to my harness, and I have several short pieces of rope and old webbing that I thread through the hole in weight plates and then attach the weights with a carabiner to the other side if the pulley rope. 

This,  If you want to be able to accurately track your training, it is by far the easiest way.  Using a chair with your feet on it as is being suggested is an absolutely terrible idea it you are actually interested in repetability and tracking.

frech sends · · Unknown Hometown · Joined Nov 2015 · Points: 36

I saw a picture the other day of Shauna Coxsey hangboarding with her feet on a bathroom scale. Seems like a simple, clever way to monitor how much weight is on your feet without using a more complicated pulley system...

Ken Noyce · · Layton, UT · Joined Aug 2010 · Points: 2,648
reboot wrote:

While correct, it does beg the question "to what end"? If you have that kind of personality then sure. It's hard to argue it's absolutely necessary (up to some variance) for training to be effective; I doubt most of us achieved our best at our absolute physical peak under the most ideal rock condition.


Correct, which is why I prefaced my post with "If you want to be able to accurately track your training", obviously you can progress without tracking it, but at least for me it is nice to be able to quantify that progression.

David K · · The Road, Sometimes Chattan… · Joined Jan 2017 · Points: 423
John Byrnes wrote:

Dan's right.  Place it out in front of you, put your feet on it.  Then further out... one leg... etc.   Way easier than rigging a pulley system that's gonna be useless in a few weeks when you get stronger.

When you get stronger, there are harder holds and grips, which can't always be worked into simply by increasing load on easier holds. Any one-handed grips, for example, will take a long time to not need a pulley, and use significantly different muscles than two-handed grips, making it difficult to work into them by simply increasing load on two-handed grips.

F Loyd · · Kennewick, WA · Joined Mar 2018 · Points: 808

Would a bungee system work for this? Gyms use them for helping folks do pull ups.

John Byrnes · · Fort Collins, CO · Joined Dec 2007 · Points: 392
John Byrnes wrote: Dan's right.  Place it out in front of you, put your feet on it.  Then further out... one leg... etc.   Way easier than rigging a pulley system that's gonna be useless in a few weeks when you get stronger.

David Kerkeslager wrote:

When you get stronger, there are harder holds and grips, which can't always be worked into simply by increasing load on easier holds. 

Really?  Do tell.  

Any one-handed grips, for example, will take a long time to not need a pulley, and use significantly different muscles than two-handed grips, making it difficult to work into them by simply increasing load on two-handed grips.

  Excuse me, but why can't someone use a chair/bucket and one hand on the board?   BTW, I just tried it, no problem.   You obviously like your pulley system but that doesn't mean it's the only way.

Jason Halladay · · Los Alamos, NM · Joined Oct 2005 · Points: 15,153
Floyd Eggers wrote: Would a bungee system work for this? Gyms use them for helping folks do pull ups.

Bungees work but, like putting your feet on a chair or a scale, it's not accurate nor consistently repeatable. The resistance of the bungee changes through the range of stretch unlike a pulley system that keeps the counterweight consistent and predictable. 

I use old slings girth-hitched on hand weights/dumbells on a two-pulley system---one pulley centered under the hangboard, one off to the side a few feet to keep the weights from smacking my crotch. One the weight-end of the pulley system cord I have an old figure-eight belay device tied onto the cord. This makes clipping and unclipping the girth-hitched weights to it very easy.
Vaughn · · Colorado · Joined Mar 2011 · Points: 55
Connor Erickson wrote: What would you guys use for a counterweight when hangboarding?

I use cheap weight plates I got on craigslist. 

David K · · The Road, Sometimes Chattan… · Joined Jan 2017 · Points: 423
John Byrnes wrote: Really?  Do tell.  

Excuse me, but why can't someone use a chair/bucket and one hand on the board?   BTW, I just tried it, no problem.   You obviously like your pulley system but that doesn't mean it's the only way.

I was disagreeing with the claim that the pulley is "gonna be useless in a few weeks when you get stronger". The pulley remains useful, and is the way I've seen some very strong climbers work into one arm locked-off hangs on very small holds.

The pulley's certainly not the only way. You'll note I didn't say you can't work into harder holds using a chair/bucket, I said you can't always work into harder holds by increasing load on easier holds.

Eric Fjellanger · · Unknown Hometown · Joined May 2008 · Points: 870
John Byrnes wrote: 

  Excuse me, but why can't someone use a chair/bucket and one hand on the board?   BTW, I just tried it, no problem.   You obviously like your pulley system but that doesn't mean it's the only way.

It's okay if you're too lazy or cheap or undisciplined to actually train. Just don't give training advice. Nobody runs a random distance without a stopwatch and calls it training, nobody goes into a gym and lifts some random weights a random number of times and calls it training.

Mark Paulson · · Raleigh, NC · Joined Sep 2010 · Points: 141

I got 50# of weight plates off Craigslist for $20.  I have a sling and biner on each plate for ease of switching weight (I usually HB with my partner[s]).

John Byrnes wrote:

Dan's right.  Place it out in front of you, put your feet on it.  Then further out... one leg... etc.   Way easier than rigging a pulley system that's gonna be useless in a few weeks when you get stronger.  

Personally, I'll sometimes use a 5-gallon bucket with some weight in it so it stays put.  I've had chairs move on me.

So, "an inferior method of training is easier than a superior method".  Weird advice. The easiest thing to do is nothing at all, but that's not really the point of training, and certainly not what the OP asked about.

John Byrnes · · Fort Collins, CO · Joined Dec 2007 · Points: 392
Eric Fjellanger wrote:

It's okay if you're too lazy or cheap or undisciplined to actually train. Just don't give training advice. Nobody runs a random distance without a stopwatch and calls it training, nobody goes into a gym and lifts some random weights a random number of times and calls it training.

Eric, what you just wrote is just pure bullshit and arrogant as well.   There are many ways to train, not just your way.

In this case, if you must measure progress,  one can put marks on the floor 3" apart and using the chosen holds, progressively move the bucket further away and record that.  Then you eliminate the bucket.   Then you can hang weight from your harness.  Then you can repeat the process with smaller holds.  All of these things measure progress, just not the way you do.

A pulley system is nice, but it's unnecessary for the vast majority of climbers.   A bucket/chair/box is effective, simple, immediate and costs almost nothing.    (It also trains your core/feet to maintain body tension on steep routes.)

And "training" doesn't necessarily require some sort of measurement/record.    Like millions of other climbers, when I go to the gym for a training session, I don't record every warm-up, on-sight, redpoint, top-rope or best top-out.  It's still training, regardless of what you think.    I can feel the results when I get outside on the rock, and that's the result I'm looking for.  
John Byrnes · · Fort Collins, CO · Joined Dec 2007 · Points: 392
David Kerkeslager wrote:

I was disagreeing with the claim that the pulley is "gonna be useless in a few weeks when you get stronger". The pulley remains useful, and is the way I've seen some very strong climbers work into one arm locked-off hangs on very small holds.

Okay, point taken.   It's just that the OP seems to be a novice that can't hold onto the board at all without help, so once he can do that,  it'll be a long time before he needs to take weight off again.

The pulley's certainly not the only way. You'll note I didn't say you can't work into harder holds using a chair/bucket, I said you can't always work into harder holds by increasing load on easier holds.

Maybe this is a question of semantics, but most of the hangboard programs I've seen/used do exactly that.   And Steve Bechtel's program builds strength and power without changing the holds!   

John Byrnes · · Fort Collins, CO · Joined Dec 2007 · Points: 392
Mike McKinnon wrote:

You need repeatable and trackable resistance if you are going to progress. Putting your feet on a chair where some days you push harder with your feet (and feel strong) and other days you push less hard (and feel weak). How are you supposed to know if you are getting stronger if you cant track the resistance?


Apparently you haven't tried it.  As I outlined in another reply, it's quite simple to track your progress by putting marks on the floor, and moving the chair/bucket further away each session (if you can).

John Byrnes · · Fort Collins, CO · Joined Dec 2007 · Points: 392
Mark Paulson wrote: I got 50# of weight plates off Craigslist for $20.  I have a sling and biner on each plate for ease of switching weight (I usually HB with my partner[s]).

So, "an inferior method of training is easier than a superior method".  Weird advice. The easiest thing to do is nothing at all, but that's not really the point of training, and certainly not what the OP asked about.

Easier, yes.  For someone like the OP, who is apparently a novice, finding a chair or bucket around the house is far easier than spending time (days?) on Craigslist looking for plates, buying pulleys,  mounting them, etc.  In a month or so he'll probably be able to eliminate the chair: no money spent, no time wasted and now he can continue on whatever hangboard program he chooses.

And BTW,  simply using a chair or equivalent has been recommended by professional trainers since Neumann & Goddard's Performance Rock Climbing back in 1993.  Eric Horst has it in all his books.  So when you write your book, you can call it inferior.
David K · · The Road, Sometimes Chattan… · Joined Jan 2017 · Points: 423
John Byrnes wrote:

Maybe this is a question of semantics, but most of the hangboard programs I've seen/used do exactly that.   And Steve Bechtel's program builds strength and power without changing the holds!   

You can definitely work onto harder holds as long as they use similar muscle groups or the relevant muscles are already strong. But again, this isn't always the case.

I keep bringing up the one-arm hang case because it's the most climbing-related example I can think of. People expect that because they can hang on a tiny hold with both hands they'll be able to hang on a moderate hold with one hand. But the asymmetry turns the body and loads the shoulder differently. On two occasions I've seen older teenagers at my gym start working into one-armed hangs and bam, rotator cuff injury.

A similar thing happened back when I was doing more strength training (this was before I got serious about climbing). I was doing StrongLifts 5x5 (a weight lifting program) and later played around with Convict Conditioning (a bodyweight strength training program). With weights, if someone started with the bar and added weight gradually with good form, I never saw an injury. Injuries were fairly predictable because I'd see some guy yanking the bar and hunching his back with way more weight than he should be using. But with Convict Conditioning, only using body weight meant that the progression happened by changing exercises to harder variations. So the other guys I talked to about it would get injuries when switching exercises, because the new exercise worked muscles that they hadn't trained. Particularly I saw a bunch of elbow injuries when switching from asymmetric push-ups to asymmetric raised pushups, and had a fair amount of elbow tendonitis myself before I had to back off that program. I'm not sure the physics of it, but it seemed that placing something under the hand on that's out to the side when doing asymmetric push-ups was putting some pressure on the elbow that wasn't there before.

What it comes down to is that training is exercise-specific, and significantly different grips are significantly different exercises. It's like if someone only did squats, and then started doing deadlifts with a bunch of weight. Squats and deadlifts work a lot of the same muscles, but there are a few that deadlifts work that squats don't. So if you start deadlifting expecting to deadlift a lot because you squat, you're setting yourself up for injury in the muscles that deadlifts work which squats don't.

But yeah, if you do similar holds that work pretty similar muscles (i.e. same grip with slightly smaller holds) you're probably okay. I'm pointing out a specific exception but I suspect we agree more than we disagree.
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