Cam purchase advice
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Hey everyone. I'm wondering if anyone has any advice on cam sizing. I have been using BD C4 and X4s for a while on my borrowed rack (best friend is injured, nice guy). I like them and am looking for what would be best for me. I'm leaning towards getting Wild country new friends bc they are essentially the same sizing as c4s and lighter, plus I liked the ones I've tried. For smaller cams I was leaning towards DMM dragons since they are rated at 12 KN for DB .4 equivilent. But lately I had a friend recommend totem cams because of their ability to load differently in shallow placements / irregular flares ect. I regularly climb at Red River gorge and a lot of the cracks are typically not lasers or super parallel, but I've never seen anyone with totems... Anyone have an opinion on this? and does anyone know how their sizes line up BD sizes? Thanks |
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Most people are fine with standard black diamond gear and a set of aliens or small cam equivalent. Me? I use totems. |
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The best rack is the one you are most comfortable with! However If you learned on those terrible x4s, your next set of cams will feel much nicer. Totem cams and totem basics are my preferred cam, they are the highest quality... 2nd place is a long way down in my opinion. However, the totems are not the fastest placing cam, it will take some practice to get to use them. The basics are great to supplement the totem rack for this reason. For tiny cams I like C3s and metolius mastercam. For big gear, get the ultralights. the weight you save is incredible! Of course this is also the most expensive rack I can think of... And you're in the RRG. Go sport climbing! You'll be so strong after a few years. Save the crack climbing for the West coast. |
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Kevin Kelley wrote: |
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Totems are king, get the new WC in size 3 and BD in size 4. |
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You're going to find a ton of Totem love here on Mountain Project, because they are awesome. They have their flaws like anything else, but they do tend to place better than any other cam in odd places. In strait sided cracks just about anything will work well. I have BD, DMM, Metolius and Totem in the larger sizes. I really like the Metolius Master Cams for small placements. If you find them on sale (which you often can if you just wait 2-4 weeks) they are almost half the price of Totems. The Master cam ultralight's are really light and pretty awesome. |
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How much money are you willing to spend? $ or $$ or $$$? How many cams do you want? Where do you climb the most? |
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that guy named seb wrote: Do you not like the WC new friend in size 4? |
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You have a sweet rack planned, but I would avoid the X4s... I recently sold mine and switched over all of my small cams (BD sizes .2-.4) to Totem Basics. Could not be happier with my rock rack now! |
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Nick Sweeney wrote: What do you dislike about the X4s? What do you like better about the Totem Basics? |
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The BD C4s are touted as the standard, but I can't really see a reason to get them any more. There are better cams for the same price or cheaper, in the same size ranges. Totems are the best, but they are significantly more expensive. If money is limiting the number of cams you can get, it may be worthwhile to get more cams in different sizes rather than better cams. EDIT: One thing to note when comparing cam sizings is that Metolius reports effective range, while (AFAIK) every other manufacturer reports the full range of the cams, which is misleading because the full range includes ranges where the cam is so undercammed it won't work. Metolius' numbers don't look as good, but that's only because other manufacturers are reporting a misleading upper range number. |
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David Kerkeslager wrote: What are these cams? |
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David Kerkeslager wrote: Why? Because you don't like how they feel? Do you have any data or are you just a hater because people love BD |
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Kevin Kelley wrote: There's something to be said for the ubiquity of BD C4s. If you climb trad around the country and with other people it's the most likely cam you're going to encounter. So when it comes to merging/mixing your rack with someone else's to go do a climb that needs four BD size #.75, for example, you won't have trouble figuring out what goes with what. Not that you couldn't or shouldn't mix and match with other brands, too, I'm just saying it's more simple. Also, you can get screaming deals here on MP of people unloading their lightly used C4 racks. You don't really see that as much with other brands, except really crappy old stuff. Again, may not be the primary concern for you. |
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divnamite wrote: In the smaller sizes, the Metolius UL Master Cams are lighter, cheaper, and have a better "feel". It's a little more ambiguous in the larger sizes. I've really liked the Dragon 2 cams when I've placed them, enough that I think I'm going to sell my C4s to get Dragon 2s. I've never used the WC Friends, but a lot of UK folks seem to consider the Friends to be the standard, not the BD C4s, and just looking at the paper stats, they are lighter. |
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I like the smallest totems, but calling the entire range, especially the larger ones "the best" is just as absurd as saying there's no reason to buy BDs. Totems are floppy by design, which is fine for reducing walking, for loading at oblique angles and so on, but go ahead and try walking a large cam over your head while thrutching up a off-fist crack then get back to me on how well a narrow headed, floppy stemmed cam works out for you. Try placing any size of them at full stretch where you're just trying to push it into the placement and instead of going in the stem just buckles. It's the same reason then original aliens never caught on above about the red size, too floppy. There's good reason to own multiple brands, or at least supplement with other brands in specific ranges, particularly if you climb parallel wingate cracks. E.g a #2 friend or a black metolius works perfectly when your other option would be tipped out 0.75 camalot. |
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Here're my 2 cents. If you go around the crag (in North America) and look at what everyone has, you'll see (aka, you'll be fine with these):
There's good reason most people have a rack like this. It's a good compromise of functionality, weight and cost. My opinion about other cams:
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Will S wrote: You must have very very small hands. |
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AndrewArroz wrote: One thing to note is that many other brands (for example, Dragons) use the same coloring scheme, so someone accustomed to BD C4s won't have much trouble. This is actually my biggest criticism of the Totems, is that they deviated from this color scheme and didn't do something better. |
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Will S wrote: If the .75 is tipped out, you can place a #1. I get that in a narrow range of thin hands the black metolius may be more ideal than either a .75 or 1, but it seems like the BD sizes still cover the bases. |