Maxi Climber - anybody have one? opinions?

So, what do you think? (Regardless of whether you own one.)
youtube.com/watch?v=kvS4KnC…

Don't have one, I've used similar climbing machines in gyms a couple of times. If you're trying to improve aerobic fitness, I don't think its any better or any worse than just using a stair climber or other aerobic machine. If youre trying to use it to improve your climbing grade I expect it's somewhere between having no effect to having a negative effect (I'm basing this on the Anderson bros. argument that anything that increases leg mass including muscle has a negative effect on your climbing, coupled with my argument, it reinforces bad technique)

If you can add muscle mass to your legs using that thing, you're either completely detrained or very creative.

From what I know after years of competitive cycling, one can add strength without adding mass with any piece of exercise equipment. Depends on how you use it.

Steve Pulver wrote: it reinforces bad technique)

Interesting, could you elaborate some?

The lawyer character in the movie "K2" had one in his office, so there's that.

As far as technique, I thought it encourages you to have your hips facing straight in, instead of turned out.

I guess I never figured out how to add strength without mass. I've never been at a competitive level at any sport, in any sense of the word. I've done a lot of.recreational fitness activities my entire life. I followed the rock prodigy advice about two years ago and cut out all running, about 95% of my cycling and 95℅ of my lower body strength exercises, and I've seen a large reduction in my leg size. I attribute all of my gains in climbing ability to their program, and probably would rank this advice to cutout lower body exercises as one of the top five things I would recommend to any climber trying to improve. (I guess you can tell I'm a fan. Despite having tried many forms of training to improve my climbing over 25 years I was pretty much always at what I would call a 5.9/5.10 level climber. It seems hard for me to believe, but I think I would call myself a 5.12 climber now, and the 12's I've done have also felt so easy, I'm not even 100℅ sure that's what my level is.)

Before the Maxi Climber (or maybe at the same time) there was the Versa Climber.

For the Versa Climber, the "gym model" offered resistance but was only sold to gyms. The "personal model" was lacking in resistance, and it was really useless. We sent it back after ordering and finding out that there were two different models.

I think the previous poster's criticism about hip position is accurate and apt.

Steve Pulver wrote:I guess I never figured out how to add strength without mass.

High reps - low weight
In cycling, spinning would be the technique. In high school, the basketball team used a "jumper" or "jump machine". A padded cradle went over your shoulders that gave resistance. You would squat then jump fast and hard repeatedly against it. We also did high rep, low weight on all the lifting equipment. We were lean and strong.
It may also be easier for some body types to benefit from this sort of activity.

I am not a sports physiologist, but I did stay at a Holiday Inn Express last night. ;)
Seriously though, it sounds like those bodybuilders are shooting for pure unadulterated strength, sans endurance. For general climbing I don’t think that is what you want. Although the examples I gave are anecdotal, I stand by them because I’ve seen them work for me and others in 5 years as a competitive road racing cyclist. I had a 25 mile time trial personal best time of 58:57 while working a full-time job. Not to shabby.

Two things

1. I think you mean miles, not km. Nobody here cares if you are a decent Cat 3 or 4.

2. You are using the terms strength and endurance somewhat loosely / cavalierly in this thread and that's why people are arguing with you. It seems like you don't have very precise definitions of these. What I think you're talking about in this thread is muscular endurance. That's a major factor in TTing in the road cycling world, and is also a core element of going hard uphill during alpine climbing - analogous to the concept of FTP people with power meters use. The versa climber might help in this regard. But to say that it's due to strength that comes without mass sounds willfully ignorant of some basics of physiology. It's the nexus of strength and the aerobic system. I'm not a physiologist either but I have read a few things. A couple of chapters in Joe Friel's training bible or Training for the New Alpinism by Scott and Johnston lays out these definitions / concepts / distinctions. It'll be hard to have conversations with Internet strangers on these topics without a little more precision.

Steve Pulver wrote: I guess I never figured out how to add strength without mass.

Couple suggestions of varying quality a few posts above... But it's also worth nothing that it is much harder for some people to add strength without mass. And some people have trouble adding mass. And others have trouble adding definition. Etc

To jaredj,

You are right. I didn't "define my terms" sufficiently. Its the first rule of philosophy and applicable in any debate. Also, it was a 25 mile TT. And...NOBODY cares if I was a decent category 3 cyclist; ouch! I'm just being facetious now. I think I'll stop before someone harps on my poor punctuation, sentence structure, or articulation.

P.S. I sold my treadmill and bought a Maxi Climber. I guess I will let you know.

As mentioned very early on, the guy in the movie 'K2' had one of these in his office. He totally killed it with the ladies AND climbed a sick bigwall route on K2!
I want to do that... I don't know about climbing K2, though.

Mike McKinnon wrote: You dont even know me.

Sorry, I did not intend to attack you in any way. I also was not being snarky. Just trying throw in a little sarcasm to keep it "light"

To refocus the discussion a bit; will this machine add mass? will it make you "stronger", in the generic laymen's meaning of the word strong? will I able to climb a bit harder route perhaps? or climb a little longer route? That is the real discussion here.

Lee Durbetaki wrote: If you can add muscle mass to your legs using that thing, you're either completely detrained or very creative.

I think I agree with that.
This too.

Stiles wrote: He totally killed it with the ladies AND climbed a sick bigwall route on K2!

brian n wrote:P.S. I sold my treadmill and bought a Maxi Climber. I guess I will let you know.

Any update on your self experiment?

jaredj wrote:The lawyer character in the movie "K2" had one in his office, so there's that.

Sold!

amockalypsenow wrote:how do you best train aerobically without effing up your climbing by building leg mass? rowing?

Most folks' genes are gonna prevent them from building too much mass by training aerobically.

amockalypsenow wrote:but what is the best aerobic activity according to the climbing training nerd literature?

So many of these discussions are ambiguous because different specialization requires different thinking about training.

For climbing defined as alpine / mountaineering, it's probably carrying a heavy pack uphill or doing step-ups on a box.

For technical rock climbing, it's "ARC"ing, or maybe nothing depending on who you ask.

aikibujin wrote: Any update on your self experiment?

Thanks for asking. Before I answer, a little background maybe in order, to keep the previous argumentation from re-erupting. I am not an uber-climber(anymore). Although I am very experienced (20+ years) and climbed 5.12 at one point, I don't regularly get on rock and the nearest gym is 45 minutes away. I would say I am a bit less than a seasonal weekend warrior. Also, I don't climb steep, overhung, bouldery terrain. I go vertical in the 5.8 - 5.10 range. So... that being said, here is my assessment.

Maxi-Climber is much better than a treadmill for an intense aerobic workout. It does mimic the body position and range of motion of slab climbing. You can get a crazy calf "burn" with positioning your toes on the pedals. Conversely you can isolate your quad if you position your heel on the pedal (really akward at first). You can also pull harder with your arms thus varying the workout for arms vs legs. Alone I don't think this machine will make me a better climber, but I have started to wear ankle weights and/or a weight vest while using it. The vest will hold up to 40lbs. of steel rods, although I have yet to go more than 15. It is much harder with the added weight, so I am getting "stronger".

But the jury is still out. The tell will be when I get back to my summer routine on my home wall, which is vertical, and compare my performance to last year. If I pick up where I left off or can do more difficult sequences or climb for a longer period of time then it will have made me a better climber.

What I can say definitively right now is:

1. not a very solid piece of equipment, but probably worth the $200 price. You can get used ones on craigslist for less.

2. takes up very little space and is lightweight.

2. if someone belongs to The Brotherhood of Neck Meat then this machine is not for them.(thats a friendly humourous wisecrack, don't attack me MP)

Thanks for the review. My wife wanted to start exercising again and she was asking me last night how much a treadmill costs (way too much). Then I remembered reading about this thing here and thought it may not be such a bad idea. One thing that bugs me is the movement pattern of the Maxiclimber, you're lifting the arm and leg on the same side of your body, which seems very un-natural to me. The Versaclimber has what they call "Contra-Lateral Movement Pattern", basically you are lifting opposite arm and leg at the same time, but of course the Versaclimber is ten times more expensive.

Are you bothered at all by the movement pattern of the Maxiclimber?

aikibujin wrote:Are you bothered at all by the movement pattern of the Maxiclimber?

You are right that it is not natural with the arm and leg both in unison, but until you mentioned it that thought really hadn't crossed my mind. It will probably bother me now (O.C.D.) Seriously, it isn't a big deal. You just get used to it.